I'm doing some things. I've wanted to get involved in volunteering for both charitable and social reasons (+ to get me out of the house). I've found it difficult because my absence was one of the issues in our marriage. I am also reluctant to turn down time with my kids at this point (even though it is at home and my wife truly believes that I am a good father).
Having said all of that, on Monday I am helping with the local center for homeless women with children (great setup...they stay for six months, get counseling, training in work skills, etc.). All I am doing at first is helping with their annual party for the "clients" (residents). I'll do more later. My oldest daughter (13) said she would like to come with me...all the better.
This is a bit of a change although my wife is skeptical of this type of thing as she thinks I am trying to impress her (not true...this is for me).
Listed below are some other thoughts that I posted on another string:
My wife and I are going to dinner with the kids on Saturday and she and I alone are going to a movie on Sunday. Generally I think that these are good things, however lots of good times in the past three months have not led to a change of heart.
This might suggest a 180 is appropriate, but it doesn't feel right to abandon friendly contact. I keep hoping for a breakthrough, but I think non-pressuring good activities seem desirable. I am curious about your thoughts.
In general, it is hard to know what to do because by the time I commute home for New York City, eat, spend time with my daughters there is only about an hour left. I have been working out regularly in the morning (5:00 AM...ouch) which has been good (great morale boost...you've got to love the post-divorce announcement depression related weight loss).
I guess I could spend less quality time with spouse, but I am reluctant.
I am a little curious how a little time apart will affect her thoughts. I am in Europe for two days next week (Thur & Fri.). I usually have to travel a lot for my work, but have avoided all trips since the announcement. Brining a little bit of normalcy back will help (and also help me remain employed).
Quoting DavidinCT: I've wanted to get involved in volunteering for both charitable and social reasons (+ to get me out of the house). I've found it difficult because my absence was one of the issues in our marriage.
Then by all means don't continue this(being absent) behavior now.
Quote: I am also reluctant to turn down time with my kids at this point (even though it is at home and my wife truly believes that I am a good father).
That is certainly understandable
Quote: Having said all of that, on Monday I am helping with the local center for homeless women with children (great setup...they stay for six months, get counseling, training in work skills, etc.). All I am doing at first is helping with their annual party for the "clients" (residents). I'll do more later. My oldest daughter (13) said she would like to come with me...all the better.
Sounds unpredictable, that's good and great that your D13 wants to go too.
Quote: This is a bit of a change although my wife is skeptical of this type of thing as she thinks I am trying to impress her (not true...this is for me).
If this is making her wonder about you in some way and not part of the status quo then it should be a positive thing.
Quote: My wife and I are going to dinner with the kids on Saturday and she and I alone are going to a movie on Sunday. Generally I think that these are good things, however lots of good times in the past three months have not led to a change of heart.
David if your wife is in MLC it's going to take more then 3 months for a change of heart. It sounds like what you are doing is working so keep it up and don't get discouraged.
Quote: This might suggest a 180 is appropriate, but it doesn't feel right to abandon friendly contact.
You don't necessarily need to especially, if your wife's complaint was not enough time spent with her
Quote: I keep hoping for a breakthrough,
Some times you have to string together small baby steps to see that things are going in the right direction.
Quote: but I think non-pressuring good activities seem desirable.
If that is working then continue doing so.
David, have you read up on MLC? Have you been to the MLC Forum? I would check it out and get as much information as you can on MLC
Quote: In general, it is hard to know what to do because by the time I commute home for New York City, eat, spend time with my daughters there is only about an hour left.
What you've been doing seems to be working.
Quote: I guess I could spend less quality time with spouse, but I am reluctant.
What is your thinking on why you would spend less quality time with your W if having quality time was one of her complaints?
I had a mixed weekend that ended on a sour note. I don't know if I am looking for specific advice, or just venting. I do appreciate your feedback and support.
As I mentioned before, we planned on going out Saturday with our kids for dinner and alone to a movie we both wanted to see. I didn't mention that I have long planned to replace my current car when it hit 100,000 miles. It recently did so and has started having mechanical problems. Prior to the divorce conversations she was very supportive of my replacing it and encouraged me to spend more on myself (I am the saver in the family...to her credit, her generosity/spending is for all of us, not just her).
When the car started to have problems recently I was reluctant to bring up the topic of the car as I didn't want to create any issues (noting that she is somewhat sensitive regarding money post-divorce). Last week she surprised me by telling me without prompting that I should go get another car instead of fixing mine.
We were going to go look together at the dealership on Saturday, but she was too busy doing other things. I went by myself. This should have been fun as I have wanted to do it for a long time (although I am not much of a car buff). The whole time I felt empty and sad knowing how excited I should have been, and so sad that I couldn't share this with her.
Prior to this on Saturday I had taken my youngest daughter (8) to practice at church (she is in a short nativity scene at Christman mass). My family is Catholic but I am not (although I have attended regularly with them and would join now but for the fact that doing so is threatening to my wife). The people at the play asked me to help with lights on the night of the performance and I agreed.
Saturday night went very well. Dinner with the kids was good. The movie was lousy but we had a good time. Even after the movie we got home and had a problem with the kids (they hadn't gotten along and some discipline was needed). This would typically lead my wife to being upset which would then extend to me. Surprisingly we ended up watching an hour of television and joking with each other. This was the best night in about 10 days.
Also interesting was that on Saturday evening my wife asked me about vacation plans for February. We had planned on going to Mexico for the kids' Spring Break (praise the benefits of frequent flyer tickets and free hotel stays). She asked me if I had canceled that plans. I told her no and that I had actually booked a second room in case we did still go (when I did this I wanted to have the other room in case she would go, but not in the same room...the hotel fills up if not booked early). She didn't say anything further, but this was interesting.
I went to bed Saturday wondering if things might be starting to turn around. Then Sunday. Sunday morning I returned from the gym a couple of hours before we were to got to church (which has been a breakthrough in that I have gone with her the past four times despite telling me in September/October that she didn't want me to come with). My younger daughter had squirted out a good amount of her older sister's hair products into the tub and then lied about doing so. My wife got very mad at her (primary about the lying). After this blew over my wife came in to the room where I was and told me that she wasn't going to church with us (and implied that I shouldn't go). She then got mad at me for a number of things:
(I) She feels that I am trying to "take over" her relationships. Specific examples include her church, where I have become interested in potentially joining...she was also upset that I agreed to help with the lights...I offered to get out of it which I did; my step-son (who lives with his father in UT) because I called him without checking with her first...she contends (partially accurately) that I didn't do much of this "during our marriage"...although when we told him over Thanksgiving that we were splitting, we said that I would remain in his life...I've know him since he was 2; and being involved with her friends (this has merely been as a result of our being around them more lately. I don't really know what to do about any of these.
II. She feels that I am doing a lot of things to impress her and they are just "pissing her off." Examples here included being interested in church (which has been for me although I do question my own motives somewhat here) and starting to get involved in charitable activities (which is only for me).
III. A few days ago I was looking at a course catalog at a local university for myself. Three years ago my wife took classes here. At the time she was interested in taking a Saturday class that would have run eight weeks (cool class on Egyptian Art...4 classes at University and 4 at Metropolitan Museum of Art in NYC). Though I was typically very supportive of her going to school (she doesn't feel this way...I believe selective memory on her part) I voiced unhappiness at her not being around on Saturdays. She resented this. When looking at the class catalog now, I saw the same class offered and sent her an e-mail telling her about it...noting that she may be too busy to be interested.
On Sunday she voiced annoyance at this, but I believe was also upset that I was looking at classes of any kind for myself. In the past she was upset when I was looking at real estate listings in the paper. She seems to get upset when I look at things involved in moving on (and she says I am controlling).
The rest of Sunday was strange. Sunday afternoon I noticed that she wasn't wearing her wedding ring (she already only wears and anniversary band or another alternate ring). She periodically takes them off when doing things, so this wouldn't necessarily be a bid deal. She left if off all day, however. If it's off when I see her tonight I am going to be crushed, although I am preparing myself for this anyway (I tell myself what's the shock, she wants to divorce me?).
In the afternoon on Sunday I test-drove a car being sold by a local individual. As of Saturday night she was going to come with me to do this. She was, in light of her mood, not interested in going. I brought the car by anyway and we both went for a drive (she drove it...I already had). We had fun and the mood improved. I thanked her for being supportive of my getting the car in light of everything going on (probably not wise but no big deal). (I am buying it tonight in fact)
Later, after I returned, she said that I had waited a long time to get it. We joked around, including jokes about post-divorce life (is this wise? it just seems fake to completely ignore the possiblity...I almost feel that discussing it some makes be appear to be less in denial...I kind of think that here feelings will either change or they won't and that ignoring the situation by pretending it isn't happening is not helpful).
I mentioned her concerns of Sunday morning and told her that I did not mean to upset her with most of these actions and that when she was ready, I'd be interested in talking about how she would like me to act regarding these matters (mistake??).
She went out for errands and returned very upset and depressed. She spent most of the rest of the evening in her (formerly our) room wrapping presents and preparing things to be shipped. She was obviously stressed. I offered to clean out the large hot-tub in her (my) bathroom...we use it infrequently, hence it must be cleaned before use...so that she could get in an relax (pursuing? mistake? being nice and responsive/good?...I never know what to do).
She declined and remained upset all night, emerging from her room only to yell at 13 year old daughter about cleaning her room, etc. (I helped both girls clean up their rooms as they were disasters).
So, Saturday was pretty good. Sunday was horrible (except for driving the car with her). I'm off to this charitable thing tonight.
I know this is too long to truly respond to, but I had to vent and your responses cheer me up. I'm going to copy this thing for a few others as well.
If you want to keep all your stuff on one thread and if you know how to post a link to that one thread, I'll check it periodically or if you have a specific question for me then continue to post here and let me know to check your thread. That way you don't have to post the same thing on a bunch of different threads.
One thing that I do know, is that in the beginning, everything that happens, every move, comment or behavior seems definative. They are not! It is more about the big picture. Taking a long view of the situation will help you to stay off the roller coaster. As they say over on the MLC board (have you checked it out yet?): "grab some popcorn and take a seat on the curb." Watch the roller coaster from there(the curb) instead of being a passanger,hanging on to the outside of the "car" by a rope.
Again: Read up on MLC!!
David, try to detach enough so that you are not rocked by every thing she does. It will help you in keeping your PMA.
