But if you weren't answering his calls, then he had no way of knowing if you still needed him to come or not, right? So that was your part in the mess.
See, what we have all learned is that what we have control over is OUR 50% of the relationship. And amazingly, when we start taking care of OUR 50% better, our spouses usually change THEIR behavior, too.
As for the medical questions - let me just say, that if you are diabetic and having unexpected lows or mysterious other symptoms, there are a couple of things I recommend having checked:
- ask to be tested (THOROUGHLY) for thyroid disease. 5% of Type I diabetics will also have autoimmune thyroid disease. Screening tests in the "normal" range may not be enough to rule it out in every case - insist on TSH,Free T4, free T3, and a thyroid antibody panel. Hypothyroidism can cause a myriad of strange symptoms, usually fatigue, weight gain, dry skin and thinning hair, but at the extremes, neuropathy, psychosis, and coma!!
- ask to be tested for celiac disease. Due to an autoimmune reaction to wheat gluten, celiac disease also has a 5% overlap with type I diabetes, and can cause a diabetic to be "brittle". Blood tests for anti-ttg or anti-endomysial antibodies as well as anti-gliadin antibodies can screen for this. Again, celiac disease usually causes symptoms of weight loss or diarrhea, but at extremes can cause much more severe and varied symptoms.
- ask to have your cortisol levels checked. Addison's disease (adrenal failure) is much rarer, but is also usually an autoimmmune disease.
See, we KNOW that people with one autoimmune disease ar at increased risk for another - still, we tend to blame all the symptoms on the first, identified disease and forget to look for the others.
Hi Ellie, thank you so much for the post. I have been checked for the celiac, not a biopsy, but the bloodwork. And also had the Addison's test. Have not had the thyroid yet, but feel that might be coming.
I dont' want to share too much, dont' know what is normal amount to share here. But since it anonymous, its alright. When I carried my third son, I went undiagnosed as a diabetic and went into a coma. He was born prematurely as I was in and out of conciousness, at 27 weeks. I had pancreatitis and heart problems. He was in Icu for 73 days, but survived and other than being small for his age, and behind in alot of things, he is doing very well.
During the time leading up to the coma, I was basically incapcitated and had very high blood sugar (we know now), and had damage to my legs, arms, chest and one ventricle. I also contracted histoplasmosis and Epstein barr at this time. I have alot of muscle damage and after 4 yrs, my neurologist is just now getting the Epstein B. under some sort of control. I do have a chronic potassium deficiency that is a pain to deal with.
Mostly, I am able to walk and get about by myself. Sometimes I do need a bit of help. There is more, but that is enough for now. LOL
I do have good BS control, and dont' have alot of lows. Some lows that I am having, I am not getting any signals for. So its a little nerve wracking. I can go to 50 or 60 and not know it. I do have a service dog in training. She was not with me that day.
This made me really question whether I should even be attempting to work again. My neurologist is against the idea. But I feel like so much more of a whole person when I can contribute a little.
Things are pretty good with us, I just was hoping to work on some sort of lack of communication we seem to have. Or something like that. thanks for your post
NDV, Ellie is a physician, if Pam hasn't told you that, and has been very generous with her knowledge and insight for as long as I've been on this board. I'm glad you have shared the information on your conditions, because maybe you can find some help there.
My questions about what your H SHOULD do were meant to get to some of your underlying beliefs about yourself, him and your M. Sometimes people with medical issues feel "less than" and look for their partner to provide what's needed to be OK or even "more than".
One thing I've learned is that if we want something from someone, we have to ask. We have to verbalize. We have to say, "Honey, I've locked my keys in the car and I'm scared because I haven't eaten and I have no food. Can you come help?" Or, "Honey, I'm feeling overwhelmed by my medical situation and I need XYZ from you. I'm exhausted from trying to be strong and act as if it's no big deal. It's a big deal to me, and I'm struggling. Can you help me with this?" (this may or may not be what you're thinking -- I'm just illustrating and not trying to put words into your mouth).
Unspoken expectations erode marriages.
The Five Love Languages book is really marvelous and could be useful for you. But I think some self-reflection about your underlying beliefs would be extremely helpful as you go thru this passage.
If Azure was reading this, she'd suggest Byron Katie's book "Loving What Is"! That book has helped so many people on this bb. It's helped me so much that Katie's process is a fundamental part of how I live my life.
Hope you feel helped with all this input. How're you doing?
Hi Michelle, thank you. Normally I don't share too much of personal situations, but this just seemed so.. blatant? when you have a spouse, you want to feel like they 'have your back'? when you get in a jam. I certainly didn't feel that way. I felt like I was an annoyance at best.
Quote: I'm exhausted from trying to be strong and act as if it's no big deal.
Amen - This really is something I deal with, you put things into words so well. I think I do a good job of running a house, taking care of three wild boys, and when it comes to my needing something, the ball gets dropped. The comment about 'cry baby' about made me cry! Talk about harsh and untrue. None of that resembled anything in this situation. I constantly put aside my own pain and needs for the benefit of others. I'm still feeling pretty down today about the whole situation, even though we did talk about it some this morning. How do I go about knowing what my underlying beliefs about the situation are? thanks!
I think you misunderstood -- my point was not that you shouldn't want a caring and supportive H. Rather, it was that your reaction in the case seemed to be coming from a place of pain pre-H, from the position of an injured child.
Look, you really were OK. You coped with a difficult situation very well. If H had been unreachable for some good reason, you wouldn't have felt neglected. What is going on is that you want more nurturing than you are getting.
This certainly does not mean that you are not a strong, compassionate person. You almost certainly are, having salvaged an M after an A, to say nothing of anything else.
It does mean that sometimes, you, me, all of us react to situations based on old hurts. Understanding this is more than half the battle. It frees us to quit reacting in an old way and respond to our spouses as partners, as adults.
This is what people are suggesting -- direct, unapologetic communication about what you want in terms of nurturing. This can really change the entire dynamic and result in an R in which you are both happier and having your needs met better.
You don't always want to have to be strong. THIS IS FINE. The thing to change is how you seek the nurturing. Seek it from an equal partner, not from a fantom parent. Acknowledge your desire for support directly! This is NOT an easy thing to do.
For strong people, it is hard and scary to admit to wanting nurturing. It is a huge emotional risk and it takes a lot of trust. But, if you avoid addressing this need directly, then the harmful patterns of interaction between you and H with respect to this sort of thing will continue. If you take the emotional risk and wind up getting what you want, then you build trust and intimacy to boot. For, you are really then sharing yourself with H and your M becomes part of the healing of your emotional scars.
Again, wanting nurturing, caring, tenderness, support, even rescuing sometimes is OK. The trick is to turn it into a positive experience so that you are getting what you want and your H has a realistic opportunity to feel like he can do enough.
Thank you OldTimer. You had me in a downer. LOL Is it possible to react based on old pain, even when you dont' feel as if the pain is there for you any longer? From somewhere in the memory, I mean?
I did have a very unattached, unloving father. He was always present and provided for the family well financially, but there was little to no love from him. He is still like this, even with the grandkids. It sounds like a cliche, but really its all about money for him. My mother, who is a very caring person, shut off emotionally after years of this. She divorced him after 28 yrs. Sometimes we see glimpses of caring out of him, but on the whole... Looking back on my entire childhood, I dont' ever recall him telling us kids he loved us, not once. I've always felt like there was this wall between him and everyone else, and he will never let it down. Maybe there arent' any emotions there to show, and that is why. I dont' know. I dont' know if this has anything to do with it all, just thinking out loud here. It is very hard for me to ask for help, I tend to try to do it all myself. I dont' want everyone to know that I'm only running on 50% or 25%, whatever it may be. I think when my H said.. 'call someone for help' (knowing that the police already said they wouldn't help).. my mind was like.. are you kidding me? Who was I supposed to call? I think what I want is more effort on his part. Not the work, around the house, chores effort, but emotional effort? And I must need to learn to express myself better and not react so quickly? I dont' know. I am definitely going to read the books suggested.
Quote: Is it possible to react based on old pain, even when you dont' feel as if the pain is there for you any longer? From somewhere in the memory, I mean?
Yes. Absolutely. Definitely. For sure. This kind of pain is pretty stubborn, too, because it is often very repressed, and very painful even to look at and acknowledge.
Quote: I did have a very unattached, unloving father.
I was torn between saying: "Ding ding ding!!!" and "B I N G O!!!" So, I guess I'll put both
To me, this sheds SO MUCH light on your reaction to H. It seemed to you that H was more worried about work (making money) than you. NO WONDER it hurt so much, given your background of emotional neglect by your father who was all about the money and who gave you no real nurturing or emotional intimacy. (Perhaps your mother also became emotionally neglectful too at times?)
Anyway, it seems as though your experience downtown was almost bound to trigger the reaction it did, pretty much custom made for doing so, lol.
I remarried fairly recently. One day, before we were married, my H came to bed and started to brush my hair gently, methodically, thoroughly. It was just incredibly sweet and nurturing. I cried. I felt panicked because it felt so good, I felt so very loved. I was afraid to even feel a desire for that kind of care and attention because I knew it would be so painful not to get it if I allowed myself to want it. Anyway, it was a really big deal -- this simple action of his, brushing my hair, was a momentous emotional watershed moment for me.
Fortunately, in large part due to DBing, I was able to share this with him. I can now ask for this kind of nurturing when I'd like it. He often spontaneously is nurturing in this way, because he likes to and because he knows how loved it makes me feel.
One thing I had to do once I could both accept and ask for nurturing, was to get past feelings of neglect when my desire could not be accommodated. Just because he doesn't want to or have time to brush my hair at a particular time does NOT mean he doesn't love me, lol, it does NOT mean he is neglecting me.
This is hard to explain, but while I can get enough nurturing from him as an adult and feel very loved from it, there is no way he could EVER nurture that little girl part of me that craved it so much. No one could. I needed to heal that part myself. The whole breakthrough with him certainly helped, but it was not something more and more attention from him ever could have fixed on its own.
Now, I still have a high desire for nurturing. This isn't a bad thing, it is just how it is. Hey, on the bright side, it is pretty darn easy to make me pretty blissful, lol, with a bit of tender care and attention. But, on a bad day when I'm exhausted, I can still certainly slip into a little girl pout. This is not very helpful, but it happens. Much better is when I can simply say, "Gee, I'm emotionally exhausted, could you brush my hair?"
Two bits of advice just for you (not having to do with how to interact with H):
(1) Say this out loud: "I am very hurt that my father neglected me emotionally. I am a good girl and I deserved loving care and attention from him."
No, really, say it OUT LOUD. Not in your head. OUT LOUD. This may take an incredible effort. Now, say it again MORE SINCERELY. And again. REALLY DO THIS. And don't be surprised if doing so makes you cry.
Now, say the same thing when it can be witnessed -- say it to psluke or to your H. Do this with someone you trust, it isn't easy and it is a big emotional risk. Don't be ashamed or afraid. It is a true statement.
I really really hope you do this, I think it could be a very powerful experience for you.
(2) When a post really pisses you off, makes you defensive, even puts you on the offense, distresses you, puts you in a funk, etc..., in my experience it is one that very likely bears close scrutiny and requires keeping an open mind, as hard as that may be. For, there is some aspect of those posts that are banging on your defenses and hitting a little too close for home.
Consider, would you have gotten on a downer if I had said:
"The problem is that you want to control the finances by controlling whether H succeeds in his job or not. You were frustrated because H wouldn't let you dictate whether or not he would be to work on time."
Well? Does that hurt? I expect not, lol. No matter how tactlessly I made such a claim, I doubt it would get under your skin. It is simply so wildly offbase that you wouldn't CARE if a STRANGER made such a bizarre claim. Indeed, you might worry more about me and my sanity than anything else
So, if a post causes a real response in you, my suggestion is that you give it time to percolate. Get curious about yourself -- why should a stranger's words be affecting you so much? What part of it is hitting close to home? What part of it is getting at your deepest fear? And so on...
Anyway, again, your post about your mom and dad was huge. You should be very pleased with yourself and proud -- it is very honest, and very strong. So, Wahoo
Quote: I was torn between saying: "Ding ding ding!!!" and "B I N G O!!!" So, I guess I'll put both
Wouldn't the word be "DINGO"?
Next, in therapy, our old wounds are called "unresolved" issues. What may be unresolved for you is why your father is the way he is. Or accepting that he is the way he is and not the way you wish he were.
I've recommended a couple of books for you, but I really, really, really want you to get this very special book which may just help you immediately. It's called "The Journey from Abandonment to Healing" by Susan Anderson. This book has helped so many of us attend to our unresolved issues, regardless of their origin. There are plenty of exercises and guided assignments -- it's really great.
Also, please realize that what you're starting here is a path to personal growth. It's not a straight line, it's not done overnight, it's not always easy. But when you know who you are and why you're here, you will be a better wife, a better partner, a better mother, a better person. Because you will be more at ease with yourself and your life.
I am a little jealous of all the wonderful things which lay in front of you!
Hi Oldtimer, I can't begin to tell you how much your post really hit home. At the time of my H saying he 'couldn't miss work', I was torn between knowing full well that he was right (we only have his income and things are tight right now.. also why I didnt' want to call a tow truck) and wanting him to come to my aid, and not sure where to turn if he didn't.
Quote: Hey, on the bright side, it is pretty darn easy to make me pretty blissful, lol, with a bit of tender care and attention.
Oh my goodness.. this is me to a T. Any little bit of attention and I am in heaven. Problem for me is, this is just not something my H does with any type of regularity, very, very sparse.
I will definitely do what you suggested, as soon as I get the nerve. :P I promise. I know over the years, I have just had try to get over the things my father has done or said, or didn't do. And there have been so many, I couldn't possibly begin to count. I think the worst is now when he makes a derrogatory comment about his own grandsons (and they are good, loving boys). Another short example is when I was dev. diabetes, he stated that why couldn't I just 'change what I ate' (which of course I had to right off the bat) or if you can believe this one... 'maybe you just need to get outside and get some fresh air sometimes'. Downright caveman mentality, and he does not want to hear, or learn any type of education about it. He doesn't want to hear, that if left to diet and 'fresh air', I would already be dead. And this is all after everything that has already happened. I have resorted to basically not telling him anything about my health. Just a couple examples I do love him, but I have to distance myself from him emotionally and never have an expectations, be thankful for the little crumbs he may throw.
I have never really thought about how this might affect things with H. He grew in a household, where rules were very lax, but he had much loving.
How could I possibly go about healing lack of emotions from my father?
Quote: "The problem is that you want to control the finances by controlling whether H succeeds in his job or not. You were frustrated because H wouldn't let you dictate whether or not he would be to work on time."
Well? Does that hurt? I expect not, lol.
You are so right, this does not bother me at all! Not in the least. Besides of course, of wanting my bills paid and food for my children to eat, that sort of thing means nothing to me.
I will surely take your words to heart and think about it. I was even thinking about your post lying in bed last night LOL So it sure must of had me thinking :P
