Flying_Solo, It sounds like your W has the guilts! If she discovers you cheating (and you aren't, of course)then it will legitimize what she is doing. I wonder if not going on the weekend is also the guilts? You say she's depressed and that would be a pretty natural response to putting yourself and your family in one sh!tty position. As for the hurt you feel inside, in what way are you doing it to yourself? Are you ruminating over the sitch,over your W's betrayal, feeling sorry for yourself or is it something else? Some more info would be helpful. I do think it is positive that she is not going on the weekend but it's just a beginning. Again, think about what was missing from your M and try to fill that void as much as possible. I you were a lousy listening, learn how to listen better...you know the drill by now! Keep on Flying high.
Glad to hear your wife cancelled her trip. Obviously you are not out of the woods but that is good just for the simple fact you will not be tortured while she was gone.
Her snooping on you and accusing is probably pretty typical. My wife did sort of the same...encouraging me to go out and meet people etc...makes it easier for them to go down the path that they want to explore...a way to deal with their guilt. If they can get you to do some things that are negative they feel justified in their mind to do things.
Keep DB-ing...really sit and think about what is/was missing in your marriage that has gotten you to this point and start making changes.
She may be making an effort to stop communicating with the other man it is going to be a real struggle for her. Give her some space...support...she will likely be very depressed. It would seem easier if she was more open with you so then you could openly offer some support but I guess in the end this is really something only she can do. I really hope she is going down the path of wanting to salvage your marriage and stop what she is doing. Just be a good/great man and do not give her any excuse to retake the other path.
Don't really understand your pain reference...maybe you could be more specific?
As for GAL...listen to what your wife says if anything...has she made any suggestions as to what she would like changed? If she still complains about things in your marriage...listen and start making changes...make them lasting changes...she may have stopped complaining at some point...this is typical of WAW...this is probably when she started giving up on the marriage and started planning her out...but if she used to complain what did she complain about? Maybe do more things with your kids and give her some free time.
Good luck...
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
Thanks for the advice, it is good to hear from both of you and hear your prospective on my sitch. I am clearly not out of the woods, in fact I would say I am in a swamp up to my neck. I am in the process of discovering a new way to live my life. It is very easy to talk about; however, extremly difficult to implement. The pain I feel is related to a couple of things, projecting a negative future of how life will be for my two sons and feeling sorry for myself regarding the position I am in. These are both a waste of time and I have reframed my way of thinking. There is no need to focus on a bad outcome and even if that does happen, it does not mean that it will be bad. I need to GAL that includes my family. In the past I would work ten hours a day, workout 6 days a week and really just be a weekend dad and husband. I did not listen to may wife, validate her thoughts, show compassion, be romantic on a regular basis or anticipate her needs. He$$ I thought my needs were her needs. In the process I became a very boring person that could only talk about work, kids, and current events. I was also not in touch with my own feelings and therefore had difficulty expressing my own needs. I have been working with a C to understand my background. With all this being said, I now work 8 hours a day, spend time with my family each night, work on projects at the house and try to engage my w in conversation. The engaging in conversation is the hardest for me when we talk about trying to connect at a deeper level. I realize God gave me these skills; however, I feel that I am learning how to use them for the very first time and as my w points out I am like a grade school kid in this area. She has doubts that I can ever get to a level that she would be happy with. Again it seems so easy when we talk about loving someone the way they want to be loved, but somehow my words and actions sometimes sabotage the goals I have set for a new R with my W. I question if at a subconcious level I am scared to change? I have done things one way for so long that is fear sabtoging the efforts I am putting forth. I now see when I miss opportunties to love my w in a way she would like to be loved. This is progress given that in the past I did not even see these items. I now know some of the things that need to be done, I just need to do them and at the same time keep impoving who I am through development of other skills. Any suggestions regarding GAL that includes the whole family would be appreciated. I need to bring something else to the R other than boring conversation and money.
Sometimes it is really great to just sit back and observe your R as a witness rather than a participant. You can see things more objectively, it sounds like you are doing this. You are picking up good insights into yourself and therefore the R. Keep looking and coming up with actions that will turn things around. You are seeing your part in the sad situation, that is so important. It is so easy to sit back and attack the wandering spouse for their wrongdoing but it's a hell of a lot more productive to look at yourself, as you are doing. So, yes, GAL and spend time with your family. As strange as this sounds, this may actually make you a happier, healthier person in the long run with or without the W. Hang in there, Flying_solo! I'm in a rambling mood tonite, I hope I made some sense
whatis, you make alot of sense and I enjoy reading and following your sitch to gain insight not only about my R, but about life in general. It is hard to imagine how I have gone through life and never bothered to try and become a complete person. I like sports and a good analogy that my C brought up is that I have become very good at one position; however, I do not have knowledge of the other positions on the field. My W asked me this morning if I love her. I was shocked to say the least given all that we have been going through. I then realized that what she was really asking was if I loved her for her not for what she does as a mother or for her appearence, but for what is inside of her. This is my demon, the ability to express my true heartfelt feelings to her in a way that touches her deeply. My tongue seems to sabotage what I am trying to say and I often wonder if maybe I am fearful to be vulnerable or to make a mistake. I have never been afraid to make mistakes in the past, but then again I never let anyone in any R get close. I understand that now, why is it so freaking hard to open up for me. What is stopping me from making the next step on this journey of faith. I can honestly say that if I do not continue on this journey and face my demons that I will not have the R I want to have with my two boys as they grow up, and it will not be because of them it will be because I do not have the skills. Therefore I will keep struggling forward with yours and everyone else's insight and help. Thank you.
I'm sensing it may be a good time for a heartfelt letter or card. When she asks "Do you love me" it takes you right off guard but it leaves an opening for a true heartfelt love letter, not the gobblygook kind, but one that really expresses how you feel about your W. Something like "last night you asked me if I loved you, tonite I'm going to answer straight from my heart... and go for it! It allows you to really open up without the anxiety of having to come up with stuff right on the spot (we guys aren't so good at that!). I'd like to know what others on the BB think about this idea?
Just to add quickly, I think your W is really pondering her life and your future together right now. Give her something to make her choose you! Good luck.
It does sound like you have the right attitude and a good opportunity to make things right. Sounds like we are very similar as I had/have a lot of the same problems with intimacy and like you I always focus on $$$ and sports and whatever else instead of my relationship with my wife. It is like we get complacent because inside we know we love our wife and kids and we think they should know that...that is why we work so hard ...that is why we come home at night...etc...but what we need to realize about women is they need to feel loved all of the time...they need a lot of little gestures constantly. They need us to keep things interesting...we need to make them laugh...we need to tease them sometimes and make them feel a little giddy...women are different creatures...they need constant reassurance and constant confirmation that they are loved...you cannot let them get bored or they will start looking elsewhere. I think many many men struggle with this info...it is our instinct to not fix something if we do not feel it is broke and we all get complacent and focus on the wrong things.
It sounds like your wife wants to give you a real opportunity and you sound like you have the right attitude to make that happen. Read a couple of the books people have recommended in other threads...cause it sounds like you want to make things happen but you are not quite sure what to do.
Check out this web site and subscribe to the daily email newsletter and read his free breakup busting guide...I have found a lot of invaluable tips: http://www.makingherhappy.com/
A lot of good advice about turning into the man your wife desires...
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
whatis & SRT.. Thank you for your comments and advice. They are very much appreciated. With the upcomming holiday I have been extremly busy and have had a difficult time finding time to respond. I have signed up for the newsletter and I am enjoying reading it on a daily basis. As my wife makes attempts to turn back toward me, I catch myself now feeling resentment towards her for her actions and realize that this is a normal feeling that I do not need to respond to. The greater difficulty is trusting what she says and does. For example she is now more interested in our finances which I tried to get her interested in the past and when I asked why the sudden interest she stated at first that she needed to watch out for herself. That I was the type of person that would take advantage of her or not put her needs first. I find it difficult filtering the comments that are important with those that have no merit. I need to stop making negative assumptions and let everything just play out. There is nothing gained by negative thinking and the worst case actions played out in my mind of her planning an escape with OM can not be controled by me anyway. She opened up to me last Sunday morning regarding how she felt that I do not share my feelings with her and therefore it makes her feel that I am either not that smart or I am hiding something. Well I am not hiding anything, instead I am working on skills that I do have that have been utilized very little in the past. I don't know about anyone else but this is a very exhausting process. I am recognizing that I look for other peoples words of encourgement to push me forward and now I am being forced to do it on my own. I catch myself allowing her to hurt my self esteem by what she says at times when she is frustrated. I should be stronger within myself, and be able to let those words fall by the wayside. I am disappointed that I am not farther along and I catch myself all to often backsliding and talking about what needs to be done verse actually doing it. I guess I need to keep reminding myself that this is a zig zag line with hills that will take alot of perserverance to move through. I am trying to implement life changes. My W is at a place in life where all she sees is the glass being half full. There is nothing I can do about that except keep focusing on myself and working on GAL and making good permanent changes.
FS, I think it's great that she wants to learn more about the finances. She needs to feel like an independent person too. I know my W always resented me "controlling" the finances, I too tried to get my W involved and she wasn't interested! Go figure. So tell her you think it is wonderful that she wants to know about this stuff. Maybe set an "appointment" monthly where you sit down and go over the finances together. Maybe she can pay the bills or whatever. Use this as a chance to be a team, working together on this. The more you do things together the better for your sitch. You mention your percieved lack of ability in expressing your feelings. This is another big thing you can do. Start reading and expressing. Start small and work your way up. Many have suggested "men are from Mars, Women from Venus" as a good intro into the differences between male and female communication. All this turmoil could result in a better, more complete man here. Keep moving forward FS, it's getting better.
