I'm on my second M. First M 18 years, two kids. My current H, after 1 year of M, had a l 1/2 affair. Do the math - it almost killed me! We're together now after a year of separation and things are good! To sum it up, it's not hopeless. I can't tell you the number of times I said I wanted a D! But deep inside, I knew that is not what I wanted. It sounds like your W may be in the same boat. She wants the best of both worlds. Is it possible for you to give her an ultimatum? Or do you think it would backfire. One thing I learned in all my research, is that reconciling is almost impossible while the A is still in progress. I think you know this since you said that your just sitting back. Don't do that! GAL - do things for yourself - go out with your buddies, enjoy doing things with friends. There is no reason why you should just sit around and wait for the the A to fizzle out. Once your W sees that neither of you are going to "wait" on her, she just may see the finality and the reality of the D. D always sounds wonderful, free to do what you want, free to come and go as you please, etc. But from experience, and having children, that isn't the case. It's full of strife, anxiety, hurt and devastating to the kids. I think your W knows this so put it a reality for her. Don't be her permanent babysitter! Tell her that she needs to take the kids for a weekend because you have plans. This sounds like I'm being vindictive, I'm not, I'm just trying to give you some suggestions that may make her see things more clearly. Right now, she starry eyed and sees romance and bliss. I can tell you - having someone other than the natual parent, telling the kids no or trying to discipline them will not set well with her. I know it won't with you but believe me, it won't with her either. She'll begin to resent his interference.
Thanks Tim and Gwyn. With regards to the comment about OM, the 'ultra moral' label was my attempt at sarcasm or irony. He is moral enough to feel uncomfortable about dating a married woman, but he apparently has no problem in taking part in breaking up a family with two small children. Is he shallow enough?
With regard to hiding her affair. Virtually all of our friends and acquaintences know about the affair. Those that don't know are our families, her colleagues at work (OM shares a cubicle with her), and friends that are close to family members. W had suffered some amount of shame from friends and their extended families. She is a strong person and while not unfazed, she weathered their disgust quite well so far.
Regarding ultimatums, I think my wife saying its time to divorce is quite an ultimatum on her part. I don't know what I could do to trump that.
As far as getting away from my wife and letting have the kids, etc. Essentially the 'after the last resort technique' I have a problem: My wife has expressed an interest on several occasions of introducing our little ones to the evil OM. I never liked the idea and once I spoke to my attorney about it last Fall, she was adamant that our kids shouldn't see OM until after the divorce was finalized. I told this to my wife, and while she wasn't happy about it, she has succumed to my wishes in this matter. There have been a few occasions when she tried to sneak in an intro under the guise of work event (she regularly gets free tickets to pro sporting events in her capacity as a big-ticket corporate sales rep), but I have warded off these attempts so far...by asking a lot of questions. W has felt all along that in her indecisiveness between marriage and choosing a life with OM, that the kids played a major role. What if he met them, saw them acting up or taking a huge amount of mommy's time, or what if he decided that he just didn't like them (which for anyone is an impossibility )? This would certainly help her decide if she is running off with the young bachelor or hanging on to her marriage with a man that she still says that she loves.
She has been in this decision mode for several months now and finally, and suddenly, the scales, she says, have tipped against me....And OM still has not met the kids...
Anyway, what has been stifling my attempts at total disengaging from my wife is my fear that leaving my kids alone with her will at some point lead to a surreptitious meeting. I believe she would cheat in some way to arrange it...even if the kids ran into OM at the mall and had a little innocuous meet and greet.
Am I being overly paranoid? Is it time to drop my guard and take the chance that my kids will finally get to meet the devil? Is getting a life worth taking off for an afternoon? Or a long weekend?
I'm thinking so....
I've rambled enough. There was an interesting conversation this evening that I will get to later...
Thanks Tim and Gwyn. With regards to the comment about OM, the 'ultra moral' label was my attempt at sarcasm or irony. He is moral enough to feel uncomfortable about dating a married woman, but he apparently has no problem in taking part in breaking up a family with two small children.
Is he shallow enough?
With regard to hiding her affair: Virtually all of our friends and acquaintences know about the affair. Those that don't know are our families, her colleagues at work (OM shares a cubicle with her), and friends that are close to family members. W had suffered some amount of shame from friends and their extended families. She is a strong person and while not unfazed, she has weathered their disgust quite well so far.
Regarding ultimatums, I think my wife saying its time to divorce is quite an ultimatum on her part. I don't know what I could do to trump that.
As far as getting away from my wife and letting her have the kids, etc. (essentially the 'after the last resort technique'):
I have a problem: My wife has expressed an interest on several occasions of introducing our little ones to the evil OM. I have never liked the idea of this, and once I spoke to my attorney about it last Fall, she was adamant that our kids shouldn't see OM until after the divorce was finalized. I told this to my wife, and while she wasn't happy about it, she has succumed to my wishes in this matter (so far..... )
There have been a few occasions when she tried to sneak in an OM/kids intro under the guise of work event (she regularly gets free tickets to pro sporting events in her capacity as a big-ticket corporate sales rep), but I have warded off these attempts so far...by asking a lot of questions.
W has felt all along that in her indecisiveness between marriage and choosing a life with OM, that the kids played a major role. What if he met them, saw them acting up or taking a huge amount of mommy's time, or what if he decided that he just didn't like them (which for anyone is an impossibility )? This would certainly help her decide if she is running off with the young bachelor or hanging on to her marriage with a man that she still says that she loves.
She has been in this decision mode for several months now and finally, and suddenly, the scales, she says, have tipped against me....And OM still has not met the kids...
Anyway, what has been stifling my attempts at total disengaging from my wife is my fear that leaving my kids alone with her will at some point lead to a surreptitious meeting. I believe she would cheat in some way to arrange it...even if the kids ran into OM at the mall and had a little innocuous meet and greet.
Am I being overly paranoid? Is it time to drop my guard and take the chance that my kids will finally get to meet the devil? Is getting a life worth taking off for an afternoon? Or a long weekend?
I'm thinking so....
I've rambled enough. There was an interesting conversation this evening that I will get to later...
I too faced the struggle about OM and my daughter. He desperately wanted to meet her. (I'm putting in the past tense because I think the A ended yesterday - we'll see).
I very much wanted to protect her from that, but in the end, I realized that I ultimately can't protect her from the truth. When my W told me on Sunday that she was going to invite OM to move back in with her, I was prepared to let him see my D. I believed that my D would make W completely aware of the difference it makes for kids to be with their parents.
Your kids would be your best allies (not talking about recruiting them or coaching them, just natural things that they would say and do). It could be the thing that shocks your W out of it.
The LORD is near to all who call on him, to all who call on him in truth." (Psalm 145:18)
Look, IMO when the OM and your W sees "the family" as it really is, kids, laundry, cooking, cleaning, attending to the childrens needs and wants, it's the same. Different person maybe, but the same! I think you're wise not to allow your children to be caught in the middle of this. They don't need to be, however with that said, if she is intending to D you, they're going to meet him. Are you paranoid that they may actually like him? Well let me tell you, they will. He will try to show the best side of him and the kids will eat it up. There is nothing that you can do about it, but I'm telling you, the OM is not going to want to raise someone elses children. It may sound to him like a fairy tale right now, but when day to day life hits him square in the face, he is going to resent the children for being around. Harsh, I know, because your kids mean everything to you, but they are not HIS flesh and blood and they never will. He will never love your kids the way that you do so you see, no matter if your kids meet him or not, you are and will always be their father - no one will ever be able to take your place! Your W is in la-la-land. She thinks it will be a bed of roses and romance and wonderful times! When they get down to the everyday life, the hum drum of daily chores, homework, etc. that romance will go away! I'm with RBinBR - she may need to be shocked into making the decision that will be the best for the children. After all, it is about them, not you, not your W, not the OM. The children should come first! Again, I'm not saying that you're not putting the kids first, but your W and the OM sure are not looking out for their best interest!
The interesting conversation I had the other night (mentioned above) revolved around my wife's desire for breast implants to prop up her once ample bosom.
I have been quietly nixing the procedure without coming out and saying 'no way,' until the other night when she forced the subject. She pushed and I said given that she wants a divorce, why should I agree to finance 50% for a gift for her boyfriend?
This conversation was going on in front of the kids, so we were dancing around certain things and spelling others. She actually had the audacity to assert that she should have control of our disposable income since she is (now) the sole breadwinner....
The tiff worked around to why things finally tipped in favor of divorce - namely that I didn't try very hard to show her that I wanted her while she was in the second evaluatory phase since we came to the brink of divorce last Fall.
An acquaintance of both of us ascertained this a few months ago in a conversation with her and he prodded me to pursue her. I tried half-heartedly (it's tough when she is regularly screwing another man) and I asked both her best friend and our marriage counselor about this theory. They both told me 'no way' that's not what she wants right now.
DBing also says 'don't pursue,' so I backed off. Again, with her actively involved in an intimate monogamous relationship with another man, I found the idea of trying to woo her a rather daunting task.
My wife's main problem with me over the years has been that I am no longer that guy who was ga-ga over her like in our first 6 months of courtship. Our sex life was good, we were affectionate, but after eating steak every day for 13 years, I had a hard time acting like I couldn't take my eyes or hands off of her. I loved her, she loved me, we have two wonderful kids a relatively normal sex life, what could be so wrong?
Now I am being faulted once again for not acting like a young lover around her. This is her psychological crutch - to be adored.
She has already said that the shine is wearing off with OM, and it probably has something to do with the fact that they have been intimate for nearly a year now and I imagine he isn't all dizzy with excitement when he sees her any more. She is like an attention junkie and will have to hop from lover to lover to keep that high she needs. Too bad for our kids....
Yes, I could have been more attentive, but my informal survey tells me that I'm not all that unusual. But her faulting me for not pursuing her takes the cake.
Given her wants and needs, should I have abandoned the DBing tenet that says 'don't pursue'?
Well, I was going to take the night off from posting but this got my attention. This idea that somehow my W is waiting for me to "adore" her or somehow pursue her while she is possibly with another man is really bothering me. I know how you feel. You read all this stuff about not pursuing and then come to find out that she was waiting all along for you to do exactly that. I wish I could give you advice but I am right here with you on this one. How do you pursue someone who seems to want nothing to do with you, at least THAT way? If someone knows, please tell me/us.
That's it for me tonight. I'm off to bed with my W who curls up on the edge of the bed lest I somehow come in contact with her...sigh.
SAH, I think you can start trying to do little romantic things and be flirty and fun -- without coming across as sexually pressuring her. Keep it light and it can be done.
The LORD is near to all who call on him, to all who call on him in truth." (Psalm 145:18)
In know in my sitch, I am doing these "little romantic things" to no avail, or at least not yet. She doesn't really seem to mind but then again, she doesn't respond in ANY way to my little touches, gifts, things I say, etc. I don't know if that's good or bad. Sometimes I think she is just tolerating it to be nice and not hurt my feelings, and other times I think she just needs more time to believe it's real. I will get more into this on my thread I guess.
Long time no post. I suspect that the suggestion I'm about to give has been mentioned on your thread before. I may have read about it on your thread. Who knows.
As you probably know I was/am in the same boat as you and GH, only I'm filing for D right now. Since I told W I was filing I learned a few things that were hiding in her head. I recommend trying this. A book by David Cunningham. It's a lot like DBing but in a more "manly" way. Just like your W, mine thought I had done nothing to try and get her back. That I was just waiting. She was waiting for "the feelings she should have for her husband" to return and they haven't (yet?). I wish I had read David's book a long time ago. It was very informative and worth every penny. You don't have to buy the book. Just read his daily messages. I did then I bought the book. You can even email him and he's very helpful. He doesn't quite grasp/agree with DBing but I think he's really just a different flavor of DBing. DBing says to try different things, quit doing what doesn't work, continue with what does work. Because what we have been doing over the past year hasn't brought back "the feelings", I am doing what David recommends. Even if it's too late for my M it will help in the next R. He helps with communication. Decoding female speak. Lots of pointers that lead to self confidence. Things that we would call GAL in the DB world. I have nothing to do with David other than I'm a customer and trying to practice what he recommends. So check it out.
If you need answers to question about the above I'll gladly try to answer them.
)? This would certainly help her decide if she is running off with the young bachelor or hanging on to her marriage with a man that she still says that she loves. 
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