Trying to find our way to happiness

[kml]

JV -
Have you ASHKED your H if he would go see a psychiatrist, or are you ASSuming he wouldn't go? Sometimes, when they confess all this to you, it means they are actually ready to get help.

If he's not willing to go - please go out and buy two books by Julia Ross - The Mood Cure and The Diet Cure. The Mood Cure addresses nutritional approaches to depression and other disorders, using diet and supplements. The Diet Cure has a chapter which deals specifically with nutritional repair for bulimics and anorexics. (You may also want to get a book by Dr. Amen, Change Your Brain, Change Your Life ).

If H will read these with you and try some of the approaches, great. If not - would he be open to taking vitamins that you give him? Based on what he's saying, 5-HTP would be a good start - he needs to have his serotonin levels raised, and quickly. It also helps with bulimia and compulsive behaviors (that's why Prozac is used for these things, because it raises serotonin levels too).

Now - as to the gambling - you need to protect yourself financially. He's confessed he can't stop. Cut up the credit cards, move the money in the bank, do what you need to do.

Approach H kindly and with confidence - that he is sick and you WILL help him get BETTER, you will NOT give up on him.

Ellie

[ValerieA]

Mellanie -- Thank you so much for your concern. This is the scariest ordeal imaginable, and I wouldn't even wish it on my worst enemy (if I had one ).

------------------

Ellie -- THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU for all your help and suggestions. I am so glad that someone here is able to offer me all I need to know and do. Thank you!

Have you ASHKED your H if he would go see a psychiatrist, or are you ASSuming he wouldn't go? Sometimes, when they confess all this to you, it means they are actually ready to get help.

No, I'm not assuming this at all. I HAVE asked H to get help many times, but he has always said no or just shrugged me off, so I quit, but when H told me the other night just how BAD his depression really is, I asked again for him to get help. He said nothing.

If he's not willing to go - please go out and buy two books by Julia Ross - The Mood Cure and The Diet Cure.... (You may also want to get a book by Dr. Amen, Change Your Brain, Change Your Life ).

Will do!

If H will read these with you and try some of the approaches, great. If not - would he be open to taking vitamins that you give him? Based on what he's saying, 5-HTP would be a good start - he needs to have his serotonin levels raised, and quickly. It also helps with bulimia and compulsive behaviors (that's why Prozac is used for these things, because it raises serotonin levels too).

I don't think I could get him to follow along with the books, but I may be able to get him to take the vitamins if I were to tell him they would help his heart and/or weight management.

Where can I get 5-HTP? Any pharmacy or would GNC have it?

I have bought him multivitamins, and I know he was taking them for awhile, but I think he may have stopped. I'll gently bring this up and try to get him into taking them again if he did stop.

Now - as to the gambling - you need to protect yourself financially. He's confessed he can't stop. Cut up the credit cards, move the money in the bank, do what you need to do.

This is a tough one. We have separate accounts -- H has everything in his accounts and gives me what I need to pay the bills, etc, etc. I do see the bank statements all the time, and everything has always been fine -- even now.

You may think I'm being naive or I'm just ignoring the truth -- maybe I am. But I have ALWAYS had complete trust in H when it comes to money issues. Yes, he loves to gamble and can't really stop -- I've known this for a long time, but let me just say this. H has always been a "tightwad", if you will, with money -- ALWAYS. He is awesome at making money and at saving it. Sometimes I have resented him for being so frugal, but I also respect him for it because I know he is looking out for our financial security.

H always takes a set amount of money with him when gambling and never takes any more than that amount. If he loses once, no biggie. Twice, still no big deal. Three times, H will then give it a rest for a couple of weeks, and let me tell you, H doesn't lose often. This is why he plays so much. Why would anyone want to stop doing something that is making them money? I don't like how often he goes, but I can understand why he wants to all the time. H plays in high limit games where the players are very disciplined, intelligent, and respectable. Of course, there are some players that play wrecklessly, and those players are targets for great poker players like H. By the end of the night, the bad players will have given all their $$$ to H and others.

Again, maybe I am naive, but I am not at all worried about the money.

I am here for H, and I will not give up on him. I told him this the other night. I love him and I want to help him get better. I think he wants it, too, but I think he is really afraid. Of what exactly, I don't really know.

---------------------

Well, this weekend didn't turn out the way I had hoped, but with all that happened the other night, I kind of knew it wouldn't.

No Magic Mountain or any other amusement park this weekend.....maybe some other time.

So what did we do? After sensing that H really didn't want to go to a theme park, I suggested, "Alright. We can either go to Great America (it's closer), or maybe go to the city and hang around the pier and take an Alcatraz tour (something I've always wanted to do but never have), or go to Stinson Beach for the day, or we can just go to Reno. What do you think?".....What do you think H chose?

We spent Friday night and all day yesterday in Reno . Not what I wanted, but I did suggest it to make H happy, and it did.

We did have a really good time though . We were with each other the whole time and enjoyed it. We played poker (what a surprise ), but this time we played on the same table which means H let me play high limit for once . Pretty fun! I was nervous playing in that big of a game, but hey, I won some $$$ ! And I got to keep it, too ! LOL!

We also played in a tournament together in which I placed 3rd and won $600. Very cool ! H said he was proud of me; he said I did such a great job, and he thought I was an awesome player. BTW, $600 isn't much to H since he plays big games, but it was to me since I've only played in small games. And the fact that H played in such a small tournament with me said a lot to me. H wanted to share his time with ME instead of being somewhere else in a much bigger tournament.

And in spending all that time together, H did not drink. Not once ! Can you imagine? In Reno? Where everyone's drinking and having a good time? And H CHOSE not to drink. Nice !

Another a BIG plus -- H didn't purge at all this weekend. I've been watching and listening. I think this may have something to do with something I said before we left Friday for Reno. H was looking at a picture of himself taken on New Year's Eve and asked, "Do I look any different now than from then?" I looked at the photo and said, "You look more muscular in that picture." -- Is that an OOPS? I knew not to say "you look good/great" or "you look thinner/fatter". -- Well H seemed stunned and said, "Are you serious?!"

After that he was really quiet and in deep thought. I asked him what was wrong, and he said, "Nothing. I'm just really mad at myself because I'm losing muscle mass.....I'm going to start taking my protein shakes and working out again. I haven't been doing it as much anymore; I've just been hitting the treadmill and that's it.....No more. I'm going to stop throwing up; it's f***ing me up. I worked so hard to build up more muscle and now it's fading.....I'm not mad at you for saying that either. I'm glad you said it because it made me realize what an idiot I've been. So no more."......Yes, these were H's words, but I know many bulimics say they will stop and don't, so I'm still looking out.

I also had another insecure moment while in Reno. While playing in the tournament, H and I were on different tables at one point. After the tournament was over:

H: "One of the cocktail waitresses was flirting with me."...... ......
Me: "Really?...hmmm...Which one?"
H: "I don't know. I just remember she was blonde."
Me: "....How was she flirting with you?"
H: "I was ordering a hot chocolate and she said, "You're not allowed to order anything from me if it doesn't have any alcohol in it." I wasn't sure if I heard her right so I said, "What was that?", and she repeated it. I said, "Why's that?", and she said, "How else am I supposed to get you liquored up?" I didn't say anything to her, and when she came back with my hot chocolate, she said she was sorry if she upset me. The guy next to me said, "Man, you got ice coming off of you!" I asked him what did he mean, and he said that I was cold to her."

I think H picked up on my feelings. H grabbed my hand, held it, and smiled at me. OH! That reminds me -- H walked BESIDE me all weekend holding my hand ! I initiated it sometimes, but only after H did MANY times (including the first few times) on his own!

Above all, we did have a fun time together . And did I mention that there was involved?

Thanks for listening.

JV

PS -- I got 2 replies to my post on that depression forum I joined. One was pretty encouraging, and the other......very, very, very troubling, and pretty horrific. I'll talk about them soon.

[cally]

JV......I think your husband is severly disturbed. I think you need to schedule him an appointment and get him some help A.S.A.P. He sounds like he may even be manic depressive. Some of things he said would have really scared the crap out of me. JV..I would be be very careful of letting him alone with the kid's. I think he very clearly was letting you know that he is disturbed right now and going through a lot. Even with this bulimia of his sure he may say he is not going to but that is just talk with someone with an eating disorder. He is like a walking time bomb walking around with this eating disorder on top of bulimia. He may come crashing down at any point with his health and how would you feel if say he fainted when he was driving with one of the kid's or something severe happened.

I also think you are being naive about his gambling problem. Why would he have to have a seperate accounts from you and only give you what you need? Also you asked him for a compromise and within the first week went back on it. Then blames YOU for his outburst and said it could have been avoided if you didn't get mad about his card playing.

He seems like he does A LOT of blaming. Just like his affair is that YOUR fault also? He does have a lot to make up for and has to change his ways also. I just want to give you my advice that you don't deserved to have everything blamed on you. Marriage takes two. It also takes two to cause problems and have differences.

His whole demeanor just sounds very very troubling. He sounds selfish. Just like this weekend. he don't get a gift and then tells you he will make it up. He has the chance to take you somewehere that you would like to go. Then what happens is YOU compromise and end up playing poker. Because of course that will make HIM happy. What about you? JV just don't forget about you. Maybe the best thing would be to seperate for just awhile so he can sort himself out. Maybe that will be the push he needs to get some help. I think you tend to just push this down so you don't have to deal with his tirades and health problems and demands JV. Because it just don't sound like this kind of behavior scared you. Just a couple weeks back this is same man that ripped off a door just because you needed just a little space to yourself. Rip off a door when his children are close by and could have witnessed this. Again just think about it....he really needs help.

[ValerieA]

cally -- Thank you for dropping in.

.... He is like a walking time bomb walking around with this eating disorder.... He may come crashing down at any point....

He is.... he really is . He has said so many, many times that he feels like fighting. Like just picking a fight with a total stranger and beating the crap out of them. He has said that he even wishes someone would just look at him the wrong way to set him off.

He has so much RAGE inside...I know it, and I can feel it, and I am so very worried.

I also think you are being naive about his gambling problem. Why would he have to have a seperate accounts from you and only give you what you need?

Yeah, you're probably right. I am being naive about his gambling addiction, but I KNOW that the money sitch is not in any trouble. It's hard to explain, but it's the truth. H would NOT bury us in financial ruins. He is TOO proud of what he has accomplished with our money. We've always had separate accounts, too. Never a joint one -- Why? I don't know.....maybe because I never asked or insisted to have the accounts changed into both our names. This is just what works for us. It always has. I wouldn't mind having a joint account, but I'm not sure how H would feel about that.

He seems like he does A LOT of blaming. Just like his affair is that YOUR fault also?

Yes, H does tend to blame things on everyone else. It's everyone else's fault because they are "idiots". Except he never outright blamed me for his A. He has taken the blame for that and said that he somehow got lost.

He does have a lot to make up for and has to change his ways also. I just want to give you my advice that you don't deserved to have everything blamed on you. Marriage takes two. It also takes two to cause problems and have differences.

I know this. Does H? He says he does, but he is in such a deep, dark place right now that I don't think he can truly comprehend it.

His whole demeanor just sounds very very troubling. He sounds selfish. Just like this weekend. he don't get a gift and then tells you he will make it up. He has the chance to take you somewehere that you would like to go. Then what happens is YOU compromise and end up playing poker. Because of course that will make HIM happy. What about you? JV just don't forget about you.

You're right, and I felt/feel the same way. H keeps saying at least once or twice a week that he wants to make things up to me, but.......I'm still waiting.

I felt like this weekend was going to be a good start for H to do that, but he didn't use this opportunity. He had the perfect chance and didn't take advantage of it. But at the same time, how can I expect -- wait, scratch that -- how can I even hope that he will do these kinds of things when he is so severely depressed? I can't. I just can't have any hope, I guess, until he gets help.

Maybe the best thing would be to seperate for just awhile so he can sort himself out. Maybe that will be the push he needs to get some help.

Do you really think so?

I have struggled with this decision myself for these past few months. Many times I feel like I SHOULD give H what HE wants -- many times I feel that I should leave to see if it would really help him. Then again, how can I bring myself to leaving him when he is so, so sick? I feel like I really should go, but at the same time, I can't bring myself to actually doing it.

And what if I do leave? And H does the fatally sad and unfortunate act ?

I think you tend to just push this down so you don't have to deal with his tirades and health problems and demands JV.

Thinking about this.....you're right, I do .

I don't want to cause any friction between us, so this is why I change plans for him or agree to what he wants. I don't know what else to do. I'm afraid if I speak up again like I used to, this will push him away again. Even if I try to compromise like I do now, H doesn't take too kindly to it. He doesn't blow up about it, but he does become irritated easily. I think H perceives this as nagging or controlling even when I am NOT doing that at all. I speak to him calmly, and I do not get bent out of shape when he disagrees like I used to.

When I think of how things are in the R now compared to before, I see many changes in me. In H, all I see is that he is a bit more caring about my feelings, but everything else is the same. H is selfish -- he wants what he wants when he wants it. If something doesn't benefit H, then it doesn't matter. This is H -- even SIL (who you could say is neutral) has said this about him.

Because it just don't sound like this kind of behavior scared you.... Again just think about it....he really needs help.

It does scare me ! I'm scared everytime I think about it or remember it.

It scares me when I think about H talking about all his horrible nightmares, and that he said, "If you even knew half the s**t I dream about, you would leave me in a second, JV!" It makes me wonder out of concern and fear if H has dreamt of physically harming me and/or the boys since he also said, "You have to know I would never hurt you or the boys.".... ??? I have thought about this everyday these past 2 or 3 days when H said all this, and I have been keeping it down inside because I don't want to show H that fear.

But I have been thinking I should say something about it, and very soon, but am I misinterpreting doing this as pressure? Is this because I am also in DB mode and trying to keep H close? That I'm afraid to say anything for fear of losing the ground I have worked through such h*ll to regain?

Here's one of the posts I received from the depression forum that has me terrified :

I know what it is like to be married to someone who was depressed but refused medication and drank and took illegal drugs until he killed himself. I was only married to him for 16 months but we had been together for 8 years.

Tell your husband for the sake of your marriage and your kids to see a psychiatrist right away. There is no shame in seeing one. There are tons of men out there that are on antidepression meds which is much better than alcohol. You need to be prepared to leave him if he won't do this for the safety of your children and you. His dreams are very disturbing because my ex went out and killed his cat of 9 years two weeks before he killed himself.

Do you want to be alive with your children or possibly be a statistic of an alcoholic who kills his family then himself. You need to be ready to leave at any time with the kids and possibly leave him for good. I know you love him but if he isn't going to help himself or listen to you and have emotional affairs it says something about his character. Please do what is right for you and your babies.



Frightening, so very, very frightening .

JV

[kml]

JV -
you can find 5-HTP in a health-food store - possibly a vitamin store (like GNC?) might carry it too. I haven't seen it at the big drug store chains.

Fish oil capsules may also be helpful to give him. I think telling him these are for his heart is an excellent idea. A multivitamin and a B-50 complex too (make sure he takes the B in the morning, because it can increase dreaming - not such a good idea for him right now?). Read the books and you will see what else may be helpful.

Sounds like a lot of positive steps this weekend - H may even be a bit relieved that he told you about some of his problems and you didn't abandon him.

It scares me when I think about H talking about all his horrible nightmares, and that he said, "If you even knew half the s**t I dream about, you would leave me in a second, JV!" It makes me wonder out of concern and fear if H has dreamt of physically harming me and/or the boys since he also said, "You have to know I would never hurt you or the boys.".... ??? I have thought about this everyday these past 2 or 3 days when H said all this, and I have been keeping it down inside because I don't want to show H that fear.

First of all - dreams are dreams - just because he has terrible dreams doesn't mean he has any intent - do you do all the things you dream about? Probably this just means he is having disturbed sleep. Another possibility, though, is this: there is a form of obsessive compulsive disorder where the person is bothered by persistent intrusive thoughts of doing something horrible - even though they don't want to do that thing at all. The guilt and shame they feel is horrible - because they don't understand that this is just like a mental "hiccup", and not a reflection of any hidden "inner feelings". Since 40% of anorexics also have OCD, it is possible that your H is experiencing something like this.

As for him not throwing up - that is great that he has decided to try to stop. Most bulimics will need help, though - and I can tell you, they sure can hide it well! We had NO idea my D was doing it, because she would do it at school and in the shower at night after dinner. Be supportive, give him praise and tell him you understand how hard it is. He may backslide somtimes but reassure him that he CAN beat this.

Of course, I think the best thing would be for him to get professional help - I am offering these other ideas only because I think they are better than doing nothing, and I know how hard it can be to get him into treatment. (The woman who wrote those books has a clinic in Mill Valley, btw - is that anywhere near you?)

Act As If he is going to get better - I know when my D had her eating disorder, she really relied on me to be sure she could succeed - it scared her to death if I looked like I was giving up hope.

Ellie

[ValerieA]

Hey, Ellie! Have I thanked you enough lately? I feel truly blessed to have someone give me all the help and support that you have like so many others. Really, from the bottom of my heart, thank you.

JV - you can find 5-HTP in a health-food store - possibly a vitamin store (like GNC?) might carry it too.... Fish oil capsules may also be helpful to give him. I think telling him these are for his heart is an excellent idea. A multivitamin and a B-50 complex too (make sure he takes the B in the morning, because it can increase dreaming - not such a good idea for him right now?). Read the books and you will see what else may be helpful.

Thanks again. I was busy all day yesterday, and today H and I have been doing things around the house (replacing a couple of ceiling fans that went kaput, shopped for a new kitchen light fixture, etc). He just stepped out to go look at a car he's thinking about buying. So this is my first chance of having spare time to post. Tomorrow H is supposed to work with (bf), so I should be able to go to GNC and get the vitamins -- if they don't have them, there's a health food store in the next town over (only a 10 minute drive). I also will be going to the bookstore to get the books and some others I've been wanting.

H has been loading himself with bananas and orange juice like crazy, so I am DEFINITELY telling H the vitamins are for his heart !

Sounds like a lot of positive steps this weekend - H may even be a bit relieved that he told you about some of his problems and you didn't abandon him.

Yes, LOTS of positives ! And yes, H seemed to be much more laid back/at ease this weekend. I would imagine keeping all that inside for so long and then finally letting it go could have given H some sense of relief (???). I know he's far from being well though.

First of all - dreams are dreams - just because he has terrible dreams doesn't mean he has any intent...

You're right, and I know this. Me being so scared -- that's what my rampant thinking does to me . I think I am much more concerned and worried than scared.

As for him not throwing up - that is great that he has decided to try to stop. Most bulimics will need help, though - and I can tell you, they sure can hide it well!... Be supportive, give him praise and tell him you understand how hard it is. He may backslide somtimes but reassure him that he CAN beat this.

Yeah, I've heard they can hide it well.....Keeping my eyes and ears open -- always -- and I will do whatever I possibly can to help H overcome this.

Of course, I think the best thing would be for him to get professional help - I am offering these other ideas only because I think they are better than doing nothing, and I know how hard it can be to get him into treatment. (The woman who wrote those books has a clinic in Mill Valley, btw - is that anywhere near you?)

Again, Ellie, I am so grateful for all you have offered me. This is such an enormous help!

I would love for H to get professional help, but yeah, it doesn't look like he's willing.

Mill Valley -- I believe it's about 1 1/2 to 2 hours away from us. I'm not exactly sure, but I know I could find out (duh! )

Act As If he is going to get better - I know when my D had her eating disorder, she really relied on me to be sure she could succeed - it scared her to death if I looked like I was giving up hope.

This brings me to last night. I wish I would have been able to login then.

It all started when H wanted to go play cards last night. I wasn't happy about it, but I didn't want to fight with H about it either. Plus, that would have been wrong of me seeing that we have a compromise -- BTW, H said he would stick to it this time......we shall see .

Before H left, he was giving me a hug then a kiss, and that's when I thought I could smell (yuck) on his breath. I slighty cringed -- well evidently it wasn't so slight to H -- and H asked what's wrong.

Me: "Did you?"
H: "Did I what?"
Me: "You know what I'm talking about....I can smell it on your breath."
H: "Smell what?...Oh - NO! I HAVEN'T! NOT AT ALL!"
Me: (silent)................
H: "JV, I swear on everything I haven't thrown up today....I did yesterday, but only a little bit, and I only did it that once."
Me: (still silent)..........
H: "What are you thinking about?"
Me: ........................
H: "Tell me what you want, JV. Get it out."

It was a very lengthy convo. I let it all out. I told H just how worried I am about him, about his ED, about the gambling, about his depression, everything. I was being as calm and as gentle as I could, H did get a bit defensive at times, but I think he understood what I was saying and why I was saying it.

When I brought up the gambling, H said, "You know.....it's still really hard for me to be here. I convinced myself for so long that I didn't want to be here, but I didn't feel like that was right. I don't know. Maybe I gamble so much so I don't have to be here as much. And it's not you. It's just me."

I told H that I have been struggling myself with the decision of whether or not to leave. I told him that he has wished me to leave him so many times, so sometimes I think I should just give him what he wants. He didn't say anything, but he put his head in his hands.

When I told H that I wanted for him to go see a psychiatrist and reminded him that his doctor told him the same over a year ago, he said, "I'm not as f***ed up as you think, and I can do this on my own.".....????

Towards the end, H asked if there was anything else I had to say. I said, "Yes, but I won't because I don't want to get you anymore irritated than you probably already are." H said just to tell him.

I told H that I hated to sound so "cliche", but "actions do speak louder than words", and I told him that I was a bit disappointed when he didn't get me anything for our anniversary even though I said it was alright. I wasn't alright with it at all. I told him I didn't expect nor did I want anything spectacular, but I would have appreciated something, ANYTHING, a small card or whatever, as long as it came from him. That he told me as he has many, many times over the past several years that he would always get me something for whatever the occasion, but never does. I told him it makes me think that he doesn't care. H said alright, he was sorry, and he would do this from now on.

I also told him (and yes, I TOLD H, I TALKED to him ; I never attacked, nagged, or condemned him -- it might sound like I did, but I honestly didn't) that I had a really nice time this weekend -- I really did, but it wasn't what I wanted to do at all. I told him that he had the chance to start "making things up" to me this past weekend but didn't because I changed everything for him. I told H, "I would like for you to take me out at least once a month. Whether it's to a theme park, the city, a movie, or wherever, but just not to go play cards." H said, "Alright. You're right. Let's do something this week. Will your parents watch the kids?" I told him that was unlikely for at least a couple of weeks since they just had them for 3 days. H said he would talk to his mom, but I reminded him that she's on vacation with her boyfriend, so H said he would talk to SIL, and if she couldn't, we would just take the kids with us and HE would handle them ALL ! (Now I do not expect that much !)

Just before H left, he said, "I need you to have faith in me, JV. If you don't, then I might as well not even bother trying. I can do this. Have faith in me please."

We hugged, kissed, then he left.

H wasn't gone long. He made a quick score and came right home. Some flirting and then !

Ok, I gotta go now. H just got back.

Thanks for listening.

JV

[ValerieA]

BIG OOPS!

I was logged into the site earlier reading up on others' sitches, H walked in (he didn't have to work after all), so I just quickly shut the monitor off.

Time had passed and I guess H decided to get on the computer and saw the site (obviously I had forgotten by then that I didn't log off).

H called me into the room and asked what was all this about. I was at a loss for words, didn't know how to explain it since H said he read some of the stuff (he was reading another's thread), so I just told him that I joined an online support group and H said, "Great.....You see what I mean. I'm never going to live this s**t down because there are constant reminders. Now everytime I see you on the computer, I know what you're doing or I'll think about it all the time. And you're obviously not over any of it yourself.....Support group.....I wish someone on there would tell you to leave me."

Can anything else possibly go wrong please? I feel like my whole life would make one interesting Lifetime movie.



JV

[sage]

JV,

If your h is anything like mine (not saying he is..just IF), the idea of a support group is completely counter to their mindset. My h told me a while ago (not about DB but about a different newsgroup that I belonged to) that it felt like maybe I would listen to them before I listened to him.


I wouldn't overreact here...h is still reeling from his own guilt so he's reacting to that. If he brings it up again you can tell him that it's a "supportive" group -- people who have worked hard to save their m's. maybe that will help.

Sage

[dodgermf]

JV,

Bad beat, sorry. Back when my W was still living at the house, I used to have this site up on my laptop all the time, even when she was down at the other end of the couch. I didn't care but I'm sure this is just another speed bump you'll manage to navigate. Keep up with the strength...he's still there, you are ahead of many out here.

DMF

[ValerieA]

Sage and D -- thanks for your replies.

I'm just not feeling much like a DBer right now. It's been one long day. I've been feeling stressed all day, and almost as if I just want to give up and throw in the towel.

This morning started off bad to begin with. I was fixing my hair when H was getting out of the shower. H made a comment about buying more bananas and OJ and not purging anymore, so I felt this was the right time to tell H that I was going to buy him some vitamins for his heart. I noticed he rolled his eyes at me when he asked why. I told him I thought they would be good for him, that I thought this would be a good start to recovery. H started getting defensive then said, "I told you I could do this on my own! I don't need to take anything. Why don't you just leave me alone about it!" I told H since he has made it perfectly clear that he won't seek help that I'm going to do what I can to help him if he'll let me. H said, "I haven't done anything bad in a couple of days. Are you telling me you still think I need help?!" I said yes, and H asked, "So you still think I need to see a psychiatrist?" I said yes, and H screamed, "I DON'T NEED A PSYCHIATRIST, JV! I already know what my f***ing problems are, and I already know what I have to do to fix them! Don't you f***ing get it?! I don't need help! I just need you to not bring this s**t up to me and leave me alone about it!"

I sort of yelled back, "I didn't bring this up! You did! And you need to stop yelling at me right now! I am only trying to help you, H. All I said was that I was going to buy you some vitamins for your heart, and you blew up on me for that?!" H said, "No! I'm mad because you think I need to see a psychiatrist when I don't! If you want me to take some stupid vitamins, I will! But I'M NOT going to see a shrink, and that's the end of it!"

About an hour later was when H saw the website . After my earlier post today, H irritably said to me, "So do they tell you what to do?" I told him no, that this was a place for me to talk about my feelings and everyone here is very supportive. That was it - he didn't ask anything more.

My PMA left today -- I don't know. Maybe it needed a vacation of its own . I tried to bring it back, but....oh well. Of course, H took notice and kept apologizing for our fight in the morning. I told him I was alright and to forget about it. H said, "Well, lighten up please. Whenever you're quiet, it always makes me think you're mad at me, and I can't stand it."

Yes, H said he was sorry a few times today for getting angry. H said, "I'm sorry, alright? Look....I'll take whatever you want me to take. Just please don't tell me you think I need to see a psychiatrist again. Ok please? It's not going to help me. They'll tell me what I already know -- that I need to be more involved with the kids, I need a better job closer to home, I need to take my wife out once a week -- I already know all this. Or they'll tell me I need to go my separate way -- is that what you want to happen?.....I'm sorry, ok?" I just said ok.

Later I went to the grocery store, and when I came back, H was right there waiting to help me bring in the bags, but he was also dressed (he had on "lounging" clothes earlier -- he was putting up the kitchen light fixture today and doing other little things in the garage), so I knew he was going to ask if he could go play cards seeing that Wednesday is the big tournament night at one particular card room. I was right . That's makes the 2nd poker night this week.....we'll see .

I'm sorry. I've just had a bad day. Hopefully tomorrow will be better.

Thanks for listening.

JV