Pattnee, please read DR. You're making a lot of mistakes. This is not a chatisement but I'm trying to get you to see where you need to change how you deal with him. You're holding on for dear life and that's almost certainly a guarantee he'll never come back.
I always feel bad for LBWs. LBWs feel a obligation to keep having sex with their walkaway husband. It's as if the LBW feels "if I give him what he wants physically, then the emotional and mental will eventually come around". The problem is that most guys are perfectly fine with, and actually love, having unattached sex. For WAHs l, having sex with their LBW is having their cake, and eating it too. They get to have the pleasure of a wife (sure thing) without the responsibility of being a husband.
As far as your affair 9 years ago. That's water under the bridge. However, he's using it as an excuse for what he is doing now. It's an easy scapegoat. But it's complete bologna. He's been okay with it for 8-9 years and suddenly now he's not ok with it again? Too convenient. Listen, all of us heard about past transgressions in our situations. And they always get blown up to be even bigger than they actually were. He has an easy excuse to hold onto for what he's doing, but no judge or jury in the world would ever lend a shred of credence to it. So if you're beating yourself up over what happened 9 years ago, you should stop. You've made up for it and proved that you are past it. He did too.
Here is my immediate advice for you:
Stop saying "I love you". When your say that all you are doing is reminding him that he doesn't feel that way anymore. Stop having sex with him. Take his cake away. When he protests (he will protest this one!), just simply state "I'm no longer comfortable being intimate with someone that doesn't want to be with me." Read DR. Cover to cover. And start implementing the DBing tactics. You're already in IC, that's a great start. Learn to listen and validate him. Read the sticky thread on validation. Be sure to do this right away, you'll need validation as a skill to deal with his protests over no longer having sex.
Finally, I know you've convinced yourself that there is no one else. However, I see a huge red flag on the gaming. Is it online gaming? If so, I'd bet dollars to donuts that there is at minimum an emotional affair with someone on the game. I've seen this a lot with gamers. Have a good friend who lost his wife to someone on an online game. In fact, he very well could be using you as his sexual outlet with her (she likely lives somewhere pretty far away). Let that sink in, and remember that if you have any qualms about stopping the sex.
DBing is about changing your approach. Gottman is great for strengthening marriages when there are two spouses at least willing to try. DBing is about changing your approach when your spouse has walked away.
Last edited by SteveLW; 04/24/2312:40 PM.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Thankyou so so much Steven for your brutal honestly. I think I need this especially validated from people who have been there done that.I received DR and will read it in the next day or so. Still recovering from surgery. I think you are so right I need to pull back and not be so available.it’s a whole mind shift that’s for sure. As for the gaming he plays in our living room ( literally where I am in the kitchen and tv area all the time) and our 14 year old daughter is often online with them too with his high school friends who life interstate. So yeah I am not worried there too much but the thought that one day he may find someone else ( and let’s be honest if he gets on a dating app someone will def snap up a good looking successful and nice guy) it cuts me up to even think I may lose him. Okay I’ll try the book first and read validation etc. so much to learn. I def want to be intimate with him when he loves me and looks at me again and not just to get off. It certainly hurts and I am glad you said about what happened 9 years ago. He forgave me he wanted to move forward bsck then, and never bought it up. Only the last year when he started to withdraw and get angry and drink was when he would bring it up. So I too am no buying it. Thankyou again Steven your honesty is exactly what I need
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
Did you guys ever work on the first affair? Did you go to counselling? Did you guys ever work through it, or was it literally swept under the rug and never worked on?
Me: 40 EX:37 Together 17 years Married 16 years 5 kids, 20,18,15,14,11
Hi Joseph We worked through it, we went to counselling together. He was was I was so remorseful and apologetic, it took a while but he said he forgave me and wanted to move on and we did. Trust took a while but he did tell a close friend of ours he knew I would never do it again and trusted me completely. It was a bad time for me and in our relationships and I didn’t handle things very well or very maturely. Obviously he played a part too but nothing excuses it for how i handled it. It took a long time and a lot of hard work to move forward, I know I pleaded alot for our love then ( even though It’s not right). After a while he stopped bringing it up. And didn’t for a very long time until he started to have issues and get drunk a lot on his own and get angry. I don’t know whether he blames his current situation and feelings on himself for not leaving 9 years ago and feels if he left then he wouldn’t be like he is feeling now
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
I keep re-reading the detach forum and validation. Z I feel like I need a cheat sheet so I don’t say the wrong thing. It’s almost like I need to think before I talk now 😂😂 Half way through reading DR ❤️ best way to recover from major surgery. Man I have been doing everything so wrong. So so wrong
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
It’s almost like I need to think before I talk now 😂😂
Lol!
Yes, one does get more measured with their responses and interactions.
A good strategy for communicating with H is the 24-48 hour. Give yourself 24-48 hour before responding to a text or communication from H. This gives you time to not respond from your emotions and to instead speak from your rational side. Lot less chance of blurting things out or getting embroiled in a fight too.
Even in a direct phone call or face to face interchange one can delay certain topics. “I’m not sure, let me think about that and I’ll get back to you”, works pretty well.
Another good thing with giving yourself time to respond, is that some (most) things do not require a response. And for those that do, a simple acknowledgement - yes, no, ok - covers off a good portion of them.
This all helps with detachment and letting H feel what it is like to lose you.
Originally Posted by Pattnee5
I think it’s a MLC but who knows. He kept making comments he is old he feels old he is tired he is exhausted. He buried himself in work, has withdrawn socially for the last 12 months and literally plays video games to avoid spending time with me (this has all come to light now as I self reflect). He has changed massively as a person in the last 12 months and I was so busy I didn’t even see it. He’s 48. Needed glasses and procrastinated for. Months before finally getting them.
Be it a life transition or a full blown crisis or something else remains to be determined.
For a midlife crisis, the start of such a path usually happens 18-24 months before bomb drop. Emotional turmoil caused from past trauma(s), and triggered by some event. A death, wedding, birth of grandkids, or some other significant major life event. This event dredges up long ago and buried pains that they really do not realize. The MLCer honestly has no idea of why they are feeling what they are. And they are feeling lost and utterly unhappy.
This unhappiness and confusion is very disorienting. They suffer along and alone in silence. Firstly, because they feel it will be temporary and it will pass. And secondly, they do not have the words to describe their present state. It is very difficult to put words, rationalization, to one’s feelings.
During this time, lots of them double down on their marriage. Of course, us, the LBS, have no idea this is happening. A nice vacation, family time, more sex, etc; things are going great. Yet, for the MLCer, none of this fixes their emotional stress and torment. For it cannot, since that is not the cause. However, they do not, cannot, and will not see that.
Eventually, their inner torment starts to show through. Around 12 months before BD, behaviours start to alter and external signs start to emerge. This has been a slow hidden change, and goes mostly unnoticed by the LBS.
Months later, we have a sense that something is off. We then do what our spouse did like a year ago. We deny it. It’s temporary. It’ll pass. That’s pretty standard, most people don’t like to poke the bear. We just don’t want to wake it up. Whatever it is.
At this point, long before bomb drop, the MLCer is well started on their journey. A crisis cannot be stopped. It can be interrupted for a time, years even. But, when they circle back to its consuming embrace it will be far worse than the first time.
We all transition from stage to stage during our lives. At midlife, our career is mostly behind us, kids are grown up, and so on. We look back at our accomplishments and accolades. We look back at our regrets and lost opportunities. We all have dreams we let die, times we regrets, moments we’d love to have again.
A healthy transition, which doesn’t mean speedy or easy, has one find acceptance in their life. And the choices that they’ve made so far. It’s when this process goes wildly off the rails that is a crisis.
A MLCer has far too much pressure and stress from lost time, regret, and past trauma(s). Things unrealized and unreconciled rise up from within, and consume them.
A MLCer cannot handle their inner pain and pressure. Long ago events, usually something traumatic from a person of authority, happened when they were young and too immature to know how to handle it. The only thing their tender under-developed psyche could do was to push it down. Denial is our protective mechanism for things that would break one’s mind. We deny it, until we can handle it. It’s how grief works.
In the case of MLC, a trigger, decades later, uncovers these lost and forgotten trauma(s). The suffering person cannot reconcile what they feel, for they just don’t realize the corroborating event.
For the lost and hurt soul that is our once loving spouse, they cannot be the cause of such inner pain. They look desperately in their present life for a reason, for a cause. And desperate people, do desperate things. Career, kids, marriage. Eventually, usually, they focus upon their spouse. It has to be us. It must be. For it cannot be them. That is their conclusion and new life’s narrative.
All manner of things get blamed on the LBS. There is so much projection upon us. Anything and everything will be utilized to justify their position. Which is to run from their feelings and pain.
Running behaviours. They run. Futile attempts at recapturing what they feel is their lost life. They long to be young again. Lots of MLCer spend money like it’s going out of style. They find new friends. They dump old one. They take up dangerous and illicit behaviours and adventurous activities. They drink, do drugs, drive fast, and so on. All to keep their demons at bay. All to feel something, and to feel nothing.
Yet, in the still of night, while they lay in bed, their demons come out to play. One can run, but one cannot outrun themselves.
Bomb drop is call such for a reason. MLCers are in such pain and turmoil, they are trying to destroy their life.
A few hallmarks of a MLC are confusion and depression. The depression is always at the heart of it. The hurt and lost soul is dragged back to their torment, dragged back to “then”, to their younger self, and needs to grow up from then/there. It’s why they behave like teenagers. For emotionally they are. Rebellious hurting teens with a huge bank account.
As I said, be it a life transition or a full blown crisis or something else remains to be determined. The path of the LBS is pretty much the same regardless, especially when starting out. Time and space, and no pressure. They need to find their way.
The LBS needs to find their way too.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Stop saying "I love you". When your say that all you are doing is reminding him that he doesn't feel that way anymore. Stop having sex with him. Take his cake away. When he protests (he will protest this one!), just simply state "I'm no longer comfortable being intimate with someone that doesn't want to be with me."
I don't know if you heard the story about Princess Kate and Future King William during their breakup prior to their marriage.
She went on living her life "as if" nothing was wrong and causing him to miss her and re-engage in the chase. She did this very well and married a future king.
Start living your life "as if" and follow DB - and POST your thoughts.
Thankyou so much Caset and D, I’m half way through DR at the moment. Still feel waves of emotion and sadness then waves of strength and positivity. My situation is a difficult one to handle in regard to pulling away. H is living a few minutes away and very much wants to see the kids every day and hands on. Taking them to school picking them up, sport ( especially now that I am recovering from major surgery and can’t drive). Communication happens daily via text based on kids and their needs. The hardest thing for me is seeing him bounce in happily and cheerful ( more cheerful than he’s been for years) and meanwhile I’m internally combusting. He keeps saying he cares for me, small touches of affection like before BD smiles, bringing me coffee from the coffee shop in the morning, inside jokes. I am trying now we I read DR to start implementing some things, trying ro validate, to listen etc. it’s hard to GAL while I’m recovering but I’ve had lots of friends and family visit me and have a few social things lined up in a few weeks. I guess it’s hard to see him GAL and acting like he’s all happy when I am not happy. I can’t tell him not to come around it’s his house and we are trying to keep this as least distrusting for the kids as possible. But I have been very clear if he decides we are done for good then I won’t be seeing him or cross paths as I will need to fall out of love so one day I can love someone else. I will keep reading. The posting helps so much it’s like speaking to someone who has walked my path. In regard to a MLC or just emotional turmoil or whatever it is I don’t know. His job has been work from home for several years even before covid. 15 months ago he took a very senior position in a company and at the time was doing his old and new role for several months. He didn’t and doesn’t know how to disconnect from work and kept working but never speaking up as he didn’t want to show his boss failure. He worked long hours then also because he worked from home felt he had to also do household errands in between ( while I worked). It’s almost like he didn’t know how to separate his day and prioritise. There’s almost like this fear of doing a bad job. Then the comments started about losing his body shape, lack of motivation from gym, concerned he needed glasses, stopped wanting to go out socially, drank isolated at home and would get angry. It’s almost like this needed to happen so he can reset himself out of whatever hole he has put himself in and I can’t het him out. It’s almost like he feels old and tired. The spending and expensive sports cars hasn’t happened. The A hasn’t happened that I know about.At this stage I am certain it hasn’t but that’s not to say in the coming weeks or months something will. That’s also not to say something hasn’t happened months ago that’s eating him up and I don’t know about. I guess I have to be prepared for anything It’s funny now I can see the old him creeping back in. I always told him he needed to not work from home, find somehwere away to call his office, separate his work day and home day, and take personal and family time and not work 7 days a week. I can’t make him see that I suppose. I can’t fix him like you said. I’ll keep reading. I have gone through the validation page, the detachment ( man that’s hard) I find my situation is so hard because he is still acting so loving and nice and wants to be around and we don’t have screaming matches or fight. He just said his emotions and is head is all a mess and he doesn’t know what he wants, and I guess someone who has bottled stuff up for so many years and never learnt to talk is struggling with it I will keep reading and Thankyou for letting me keep posting. I finally feel I have found my people who actually understand
M:41 H:48 T:20. M:16.5 BD: 15/12/22 -moved out 17/3/2023
