Hi everyone! I have been following here for awhile, but just became brave enough to post myself. My H and I have been married for 13 years and have four children under the age 11. Our marriage, while not perfect, has been the type of relationship that all our friends and family look up to. We were great teammates, loving, supportive, affectionate, loved our children and spent time appreciating what we had built together and each other. We run a business together that requires lots of travel (for H, although we travel a lot as a family as we are dual-continental) and lots of time running the ship at home (me, both in business and household/children). The past few years we have gained a lot of success in our business, but it has taken a huge toll on the amount of time we have been able to spend together as a family.
After a family tragedy and the birth of my 4thchild (4 kids in just over 5 years), I lost my spark. I had a tough time losing the baby weight, was sad about the family tragedy, no sleep from so many tiny humans and the escalation of our business meant that I was home dealing with everything alone. In retrospect, I was slightly depressed and took out my frustrations on the only adult in the room (when he was actually there). It became a SSM and I definitely had resentment for being left behind while raising our family alone. He would make a comment or two here and there about my weight or sadness. But then we would have breaks, or time together and things would quickly go back to our usual, loving R. Or so I thought.
Early on in our business venture, there was a woman that H has since worked with 3-4 times a year. Traveling to exotic locations and living a ‘work-hard, play-hard’ existence for a week or two. I have always had a slight ‘ping’ about this person, but my H treated me like a goddess and kept telling me she was nothing compared to me. And because he was so loving and committed to our R and our family, I believed him.
About a year ago, he came home from a work trip and things felt ‘off’ but it was easily explained by constant travel and stress. Fast forward to Oct 2019 and his distance and scorn for me started to get really intense. I kept asking what was wrong (we have always been good communicators) but he would brush me off or snap at me about how stressed he was and how demanding I was. I discovered shortly after that he and this woman were in the midst of an EA. He promised to end it (though he kept telling me they were just friends, I was being crazy) and to go to MC, but the whole time I felt that he wasn’t really ‘there’. I changed, went to regular IC, kept up with the MC, lost a ton of weight, started antidepressants, validated and GAL’d like crazy.
He was still checked out. Things started to get worse in the New Year and I kept pressing him to work on us and he kept pressing on how confused he was, then kept saying how miserable he had been for so long. In March, he finally said he didn’t want to be with me anymore, seriously wanted a D and was moving out, although we would ‘nest’ for the kids. I was devastated, but tried to keep DBing. We had a moment of reconciliation in the past month, but he immediately went back to his ‘confusion’ and has since double-downed on his meanness and dismissal of me.
Like a lot of other situations I have read about on this forum, he has completely re-written our history. It’s been 13 years of misery, he never had that ‘spark’ for me (complete BS), ILYBNILWY, etc etc. All amidst this pandemic and now homeschooling 4 kids. We maintained a schedule where we were both in the house during the day, but one of us would sleep in a different home at night.
This weekend, I discovered that the EA is still going strong and that ‘I love you’ and pet names were exchanged. He keeps saying they are just friends. I am back to feeling hopeless and devastated. And once again, he has doubled down on the spewing, hateful meanness.
I am trying to be hopeful, but it feels so far gone right now.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Your H or W is giving you a GIFT. THE GIFT OF TIME. USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Me-66, D33,S32
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Sage, sorry you are here. But I am glad you found us because we can help you. It seems you already haven an idea what DBing is, that is great. I recently wrote a post in a thread I entitled "How do I DB when I love them" . I suggest you go read that post. It has a post about affairs and how in denial a LBS can be about them.
What I say next I do not say to hurt you. But to prepare you for the other shoe to drop. Likely, this EA is already a PA. EAs rarely go on for very long before they fizzle out or progress to a PA. My W has had 2 that I know of, and I have had a couple myself. I'd put the max an EA can last without dying out or moving to a PA at 6 months, but many of them have a breaking point well before that. Most men, especially, do not have the patience to keep up an EA without getting what they are really after: a PA. So brace yourself for the reality that likely this has already gone physical.
And even if it hasn't, EAs are nothing to wink at. In some ways they can be worse than a PA. The fantasy and addiction are real. Lots of WASs and WSs have gone from one EA to another, since their shelf life tends to be short.
Now, I gave you some props for knowing what DBing is. However I see your understanding is limited. Why? Because of this line: " and I kept pressing him to work on us". That is not DBing. That breaks one of the first rules of DBing: remove all pressure and pursuit. Nothing pushes a WAS away more than pressure and pursuit. When a spouse says, essentially, "I want less of you". The worst reaction to that is to try and give them more of you. I equate it to being full from just eating a big meal, and then having someone try to get you to eat something. It is annoying, and the last thing you want to do is annoy your WAS.
So please read all of the welcome thread that job sent to you. There is gold in those threads that can help you IF you listen, learn and implement. Further, please get and read DR if you haven't already. No one says it better than Michelle herself!
I see you mention GAL. I see you mention 180s. Great! However you are still attached to him and that is where you need to work the hardest at. Detach from him. Learn what that really means and start working on it. In fact, doubling down on GAL (I know, hard in the COVID world), continue to 180 and improve yourself (become the woman only a fool would leave!), and detaching (which includes removing all pressure and pursuit) should be what you are solely focused on! No one ever saved their marriage by focusing on saving their marriage. You have keep your focus on the one person that you can control: YOU!
Finally, buckle up. I know you feel like this has last forever. However these are long marathons, not sprints. As a guy he will likely drag out this state of limbo for a very long time. Why you might ask? Most of the time men do that for financial reasons. He knows you will get half of everything, and he will still have to pay child support out of the half he gets. Almost all WAHs have done that math. So do not be surprised if he never actually files for divorce, yet continues to act as if he is completely single. At some point you will have a decision to make about how much more you want to let him cake eat.
Keep posting! We are here to help.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Steve85, thank you so much for your response. I love your ‘being full’ analogy (read it before in another post). So true.
I also appreciate your last statement about the length of it all. I am a bit confused as to why he hasn’t pulled the D trigger if he really is planning on doing it. Maybe you are right.
Two things that are making me feel absolutely crazy (my friends and family consider me to be a grounded, calm human, so this is out of the norm for me) are 1) whole re-writing of our history; and 2) denial of the EA, they are just friends, despite things I have read with my own eyes. I suppose even the most sane of us has our own path to madness; he may well have found mine.
And regarding detaching (for all those vets out there): I know intellectually and emotionally what it would look and feel like as I’ve truly been there in moments (it just doesn’t last long). But my question to those who have come before me: what were your tricks for getting there and actually STAYING there? Mantras? Meditations? Time? (Besides the GAL, 180’s, etc) Are there any short cuts? (I’m pretty sure I know the answer to this
Steve85, thank you so much for your response. I love your ‘being full’ analogy (read it before in another post). So true.
I also appreciate your last statement about the length of it all. I am a bit confused as to why he hasn’t pulled the D trigger if he really is planning on doing it. Maybe you are right.
Two things that are making me feel absolutely crazy (my friends and family consider me to be a grounded, calm human, so this is out of the norm for me) are 1) whole re-writing of our history; and 2) denial of the EA, they are just friends, despite things I have read with my own eyes. I suppose even the most sane of us has our own path to madness; he may well have found mine.
Hi Sage, first, let me start with some compassion: you are going through an awful situation, but I applaud you for being strong, asking for help, and beginning down the road towards a brighter tomorrow. There's going to be lots of ups and downs, but you're strong and you will be happy again. This I promise you.
As far the WAS not pulling the trigger on D, in most cases it's because they simply don't have to. Why deal with all of that drama if you don't have to? As strange as it may sound, in a lot of cases on this forum, it's actually the LBS that ends up pulling the trigger, because they've decided that they're no longer interested in letting the WAS have it both ways.
I'm sorry and I feel you on the history re-writing. It's painful and it makes you question the life that you knew. But please keep in mind that the re-writing is just a defense mechanism for the WAS to help them compartmentalize the pain they're causing. When you're out the door - and especially when there's a EA/PA involved - it's not about logic, it's about justification.
Please post here often. The community is supportive, and will help you when you need it the most, even if it's not exactly what you want to hear. There are lots of success stories from veterans, so it can be done!
Thanks so much, SteveS... I went dark after this weekend’s discovery, but we had to talk (on the phone) about our business and the kids today and I got pulled into a light R talk. I kept calm and detached, but when he came by the house to grab something, he apologized in person for saying mean things and wanted to give me a hug. I’m so uncertain, I don’t really know what to do in these situations, but I allowed it. Then he gave me a little peace offering (something he got in the mail and thought I would like). I accepted it without fanfare, but felt dirty in the Plan B sense. How should I respond in situations like this? When I feel like I am encouraging the Plan B, but not wanting to?
Steve85, thank you so much for your response. I love your ‘being full’ analogy (read it before in another post). So true.
I also appreciate your last statement about the length of it all. I am a bit confused as to why he hasn’t pulled the D trigger if he really is planning on doing it. Maybe you are right.
Two things that are making me feel absolutely crazy (my friends and family consider me to be a grounded, calm human, so this is out of the norm for me) are 1) whole re-writing of our history; and 2) denial of the EA, they are just friends, despite things I have read with my own eyes. I suppose even the most sane of us has our own path to madness; he may well have found mine.
Rewriting history is something almost all WAS do. If you read my threads you'll see my W had convinced herself that she wasn't happy a single second for the 18 years and 9 months that we had been married. On BD I even repeated to her "You were never happy?!? Not even for a minute." Her claim was that if she was she couldn't remember it. WHAT? Picture albums full of pictures of vacations, and events, and the birth of our daughter, and her growing up, and doing things as a family. And she was saying she was unhappy through all of that?!?
Remember though, at this point their perception is their reality. And to buck against that is to try to them that their reality is wrong. Something most people do not react well to. So just understand where he is coming from. He is convincing himself that he is justified in what he is doing. You don't disagree with him through words, you do it through actions. This is why we suggest kicking a cheating spouse out of the MBR. You can tell them you don't agree with what they are doing, but it is better to show them that.
As far as denial. Some folks will deny even in the face of incontrovertible evidence! After I found the nudes that my W had sent to her EA partner, she still denied that they were more than just friends. In fact, when I confronted her about the nude photos, since I didn't actually produce them, I think she still thought I was bluffing. Weeks later, while we were dealing with her final act of defiance towards Ring (she had been moving towards that slowly but was still resistant), I finally convinced her that I had seen them. She actually said "how awful for you". But remember, this was after weeks of diverting and denying attention from her online activities with other men (looking back I am guessing there were others though maybe not as intensely as the EA AP).
WSs are also notorious for gaslighting. If you are unfamiliar with that look it up. It is is a psychological manipulation where the target of it begins to question their own sanity. "I know you are sleeping with her! I saw the text message where she thanked you for last night!" Gaslighter: "No you didn't because that text doesn't exist! I can guarantee you I never ever received a text like that from her. Maybe you dreamt it?" And then you start to question if you really saw it or not. Gaslighters are master manipulators. The victim often thinks "surely they wouldn't be so insistent about this if it weren't true".
So your line: "I suppose even the most sane of us has our own path to madness; he may well have found mine." Yeah, you are being gaslit.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
