Thank you, everyone, for your responses. It has been invaluable to my process.
For all of those that are slightly ahead of me in your situations, I hear repeatedly that everyone wished they had ‘dropped the rope’ sooner. Or put more boundaries in place sooner. I would love to hear what that would have looked like in your situations as I navigate my own.
H’s letter makes me feel slightly sick. He is so wrapped up in his own process, his own feelings and his own struggles. It seems ludicrous that he needs to be alone to process his innermost thoughts, and yet he will make no move to end his EA. His letter makes me truly understand that he has no thoughts or cares for me or my feelings. And if he is not going to care, then I guess I am the only one that can care for myself. So in a way, I guess I am taking ownership for my own needs over his. Finally.
But now that I am taking true ownership of my feelings and needs, absent of him, I am struggling with what to do next. I have time to decide, it’s on my terms. And this is where I am seeking guidance: what would you have done differently in your situation?
Thank you, everyone, for your responses. It has been invaluable to my process.
For all of those that are slightly ahead of me in your situations, I hear repeatedly that everyone wished they had ‘dropped the rope’ sooner. Or put more boundaries in place sooner. I would love to hear what that would have looked like in your situations as I navigate my own.
H’s letter makes me feel slightly sick. He is so wrapped up in his own process, his own feelings and his own struggles. It seems ludicrous that he needs to be alone to process his innermost thoughts, and yet he will make no move to end his EA. His letter makes me truly understand that he has no thoughts or cares for me or my feelings. And if he is not going to care, then I guess I am the only one that can care for myself. So in a way, I guess I am taking ownership for my own needs over his. Finally.
But now that I am taking true ownership of my feelings and needs, absent of him, I am struggling with what to do next. I have time to decide, it’s on my terms. And this is where I am seeking guidance: what would you have done differently in your situation?
This is really hard, Sage. And you know, even in the thick of the first weeks of my separation, when I was posting here and getting very clear advice and suggestions - I still wasn't able to detach and drop the rope as well as hindsight makes me wish I had. So I'm not posting as a 'successful expert' at this. We do what we can do. I guess for me, staying attached enough to let H abuse me and string me along for a while hurt less then detaching from him and feeling the grief. For a while, at least. So please take my words in answer to your question in that spirit - I'm by no means perfect at this stuff and no doubt never will be. And all the 'right actions' in the world are not going to save you from feeling the pain of this, and it [censored] and it isn't fair and I'm sorry.
So - I wish that when H moved out, I'd have gone as NC as possible right away. For a while he visited me in the house and I allowed that to happen, pretending it was what was best for the kids, but really because I wanted to see him because I felt lonely and because I wanted him to have the chance to see my changes.
I often phoned him up when I didn't need to, and when he was drunk and angry, I stayed on the phone trying to convince him to be nice to me, rather than acting with self respect, giving both of us space, and finding other ways to deal with my feelings.
While we were separated, I'd make these bargains with him - he wanted me to text him encouraging messages for a while, and I did that, but became furious when there was very little coming back. I wish I'd have withdrawn from him and only put the effort into the relationship that he was able to extend himself.
I read relationship books like crazy, and while I did learn some useful things (most useful were articles about boundaries, about manipulation, control and abuse, and about the pursuit-distance dynamic) I actually wish I'd put all that to one side and sought out books and films and music to comfort and soothe and entertain me.
I wish I'd been more assertive - saying 'no' to things that didn't work for me, rather than twisting myself up trying to get them to work for me, or trying to manipulate him into offering or saying something more to my liking.
I made excuse after excuse after excuse for the way he was treating me and had treated me, and I wasted hours and hours and hours of reading and rumination on trying to figure out what his issues were, what the causes of them were, and what he needed to do next. I also spent a lot of time envisioning what an ideal R would look like, what my demands for what would be, and what I would and wouldn't tolerate. I wish I had spent that time on GAL and self development. His improvements or flaws are none of my business and my concentrating on his issues was just a way of postponing work on my own and trying to control the situation.
Last summer, when he said he wanted to come home, I expressed, tentatively, the feeling that it was too early for me. We were communicating well, but there was more I wanted to see from him (an understanding of what he felt his part in it all was, and how he wanted to change in his behaviour towards me) and I wanted to carry on growing the confidence that was just starting that I would be okay on my own. He responded to that very sulkily, and it terrified me, so I backed down right away and let him come back full time pretty much the instant he wanted it. I wish I'd lovingly held my ground and I suspect we'd be having fewer issues now if I had.
In my situation I wished I would have said “you want a divorce? Do you need help packaging your bags? Then when out and started my new awesome life. It’s really that simple and it gives you the best chance of your spouse changing their mind.
Right now you’re in a tough spot because if you give him six months to try out his new girl it will psychologically beat you down for another six months. Then if it doesn’t work out you get your husband back only because his affair fizzled out. Is that what you want? Or you make it clear that you don’t want a divorce but you refuse to live in limbo for another z6 months. You go out and live your best life. If he wants to join you later on then it’s something you will have to discuss then.
I wish I didn’t spend so much time still trying to “fix” him after BD. I read and researched like crazy about depression, alcoholism, psychology of survivors of child abuse....etc. I even made doctor’s appointments for him (which he did not go). Although I did learn a lot through my reading, my focus was wrongly placed on thinking that there was something I could do to help him. No, there is nothing. It’s really his journey and I can’t travel it for him.
Others like detachment and boundaries...sure I could’ve done things better/differently, but I think you have to go through the mistakes and possibly even more heartache yourself to come through a better person. You wouldn’t know what doesn’t work and what does unless you make that journey.
So your H asked for 6 months. You don’t have to agree or not agree right now. Are you ready to D? If not, give yourself more time. You may be ready in less than 6 months, or maybe more, who knows? I understand LH’s concern about the affair fizzling out and then your H comes back to you because of it. And it is legitimate. But at the same time I would put the focus more on yourself than what might happen with him. 6 months is a long time, this world was entirely different 6 months ago. Don’t even think about the 6 months. This is your life, you’re in it for the long haul. You should be thinking and doing things based on your own timeline. Do not let H dictate that.
Who is Sage? Who are you when uncoupled with H? Take time to figure that out.
I've always felt things happen for a reason. I tend to agree with Wooba on this.. yes, of course many of us wish we had set out our boundaries earlier, been quicker to detach, etc.... but ultimately it is up to you. What you're ready for now, or later, once you can fully process everything that is going on and make a good decision with your own needs as the focus.
I don't think I could have detached from my H any earlier or asked him to leave any earlier than I did. I needed to have the information I had at that time and have made the journey to be at a place where I could finally say I was really to walk. So I guess my advice to you would be to honor your own feelings and listen to yourself.
I one thousand percent agree that you need to be putting the focus much, much more on yourself and what you need, and do your very best to stop giving a $hit about what your H may want or need. He's being incredibly selfish and sad right now and the best thing you can do is leave him to it and focus on your own journey. So he thinks he needs six months to do "deep work" with his IC (I hope you are rolling your eyes as far as I am right now)... BS. He is scared to lose you but also in the midst of a sad MLC and A fog where he's thinking he maybe found something special with this OW. He doesn't know what to do and is desperately trying to hang onto both.
My H finally, in the last weeks of limbo with a discernment counselor, finally admitted he wanted both. Both me as his co-parent and best friend, and AP as his romantic partner. He didn't want to have to choose. It blew my mind that he could admit to this, but he was being honest at least. It may be that your H is in a similar place, scared to lose "true love" with her but scared to lose all he has with you too. Unfortunately, life doesn't work that way and he'll need to make a decision... but it unfortunately that decision isn't up to you. Your H will need to pull his own head out of his a$$, or not. Some do, some don't. (well, from the boards it sounds like most do, just that the timeline may be long enough that the LBS is long gone by time time the WS realizes what an idiot they are.) And, all you can control is you. So you either wait around for him to decide what he wants-- while enabling his cake-eating-- or you don't. Or you set a time limit for yourself for the continued limbo and then stick to it.
You've got this, Sage. You're so strong.
Me (46) H (42) M:14 T:18, D9 & D11 4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs 9/20 - present: R and piecing
Gosh, what wisdom, thank you all so much. Some of the thoughts that really impacted me this morning:
Originally Posted by AlisonUK
I read relationship books like crazy, and while I did learn some useful things (most useful were articles about boundaries, about manipulation, control and abuse, and about the pursuit-distance dynamic) I actually wish I'd put all that to one side and sought out books and films and music to comfort and soothe and entertain me.
Alison, absolutely everything you said resonated with me and gives me strength and clarity. I am beginning to understand the depth of the abusive behavior I have accepted from him. Although there are some differences between our situations and H's, there are so many similarities that I find your advice very comforting. Thank you.
This gem about getting of the R books, and onto that which satisfies and feeds my soul was perfect advice and exactly what I needed to hear. I want to use my time so much more constructively moving forward.
Originally Posted by LH19
In my situation I wished I would have said “you want a divorce? Do you need help packaging your bags? Then when out and started my new awesome life.
LH, you could have said this to me a few weeks ago and I would have dismissed you as being too harsh. But I am there now, I get it. And I too wished I had said it earlier.
Originally Posted by wooba
Who is Sage? Who are you when uncoupled with H? Take time to figure that out.
Yes, Wooba, yes! I loved all of your advice, but this is my biggest next step. Thank you for the refocus.
Originally Posted by may22
You've got this, Sage. You're so strong.
May, everything you said was relevant to me and my stitch and I appreciate you sharing what happened in your sitch. It really is astounding how similar all of our stories are in terms of the things that we are told or the way that our H's have acted.
Well, H asked for a response to his letter and I told him that I respected his need for self-discovery for those 6 months, but that having three parties in our M was a deal breaker for me. Silence.
We agreed that we would let the other party know before engaging with a lawyer and/or making any other big changes. We have both been good about this. So my next step is to let him know that I will be engaging with a L this week.
In my situation I wished I would have said “you want a divorce? Do you need help packaging your bags? Then when out and started my new awesome life.
LH, you could have said this to me a few weeks ago and I would have dismissed you as being too harsh. But I am there now, I get it. And I too wished I had said it earlier.
Wait until you're a couple years out. You will look back and cringe at the BS you put up with him. The funny thing is that as crazy and as harsh as it sounds, it would have given you the best chance to get him back.
Sage, I am so glad this is useful to you. Perhaps as well as a lawyer, you can make a list of loving and soothing and interesting and developing-yourself sorts of things you want to do over the next couple of weeks?
(This is advice I was given, and which I spectacularly fail to take - preferring to meddle in the lives of my children and ruminate on ways my H needs to improve. So I am also going to take it myself and post something on my thread to that effect tonight. Perhaps we can be accountability buddies for each other?)
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You will look back and cringe at the BS you put up with him.
This is SO TRUE. And if you do R, the less BS you expose yourself to now, the easier piecing will be. Don't put yourself forward to accept more behaviour you will have to work to forgive and heal from later. Boundaries are the best friend you have for either an R or a good divorce.
Well, H asked for a response to his letter and I told him that I respected his need for self-discovery for those 6 months, but that having three parties in our M was a deal breaker for me. Silence.
Perfect.
my recommendation to you now-- follow Alison's advice, fill up your days over the next couple of weeks as much as you can. be extra kind to yourself. Also, be prepared for him to find a chink or two in your armor and instead of coming back with a straight OK I'll end it or sorry I can't do that, he'll have found some squirmy way to respond like asking for a smaller amount of time or say some things that will make you feel like he might be leaning in. What will you do then? Just be clear on what your boundaries are and what you will or will not accept.
Me (46) H (42) M:14 T:18, D9 & D11 4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs 9/20 - present: R and piecing
Last week was super tough. After H’s letter saying he wanted more time, I found out that he signed a 1 year lease for a large house. He didn’t ask me or tell me before he did this, which violates our agreement that we will consult with each other prior to making big decisions. I was both angry and super hurt.
A day later, we had a big discussion about D and what it would look like in terms of our business, finances, and the kids. I have been asking H if he knows what the financial implications would be for us in the event of D and he got upset that I was undermining and underestimating him (‘which you always do, that’s why we are in this position…’). Well, during our big D talk, it became clear that he had NO idea what a financially precarious position D would put him and our family into. That our business is both of ours and I would get half, that me being out of the business leaves me without a job (alimony) and that his travel schedule means that he would need to pay a lot in child support to maintain our children’s usual lifestyle, something he is very committed to. We both panicked at the enormity of his choice, but I think the reality of it all hit him really hard. We have each had a consult with L’s months ago, but nothing more.
We had an unexpected expense come up late last week that means we simply cannot afford to maintain two large homes for 6 months, let alone a year. When I found out about this expense, I shared it with H and asked him what the status was on his lease and deposit and could he cancel the lease so we could reconsider our strategy for financial reasons. He said he has been thinking these last few days and that wants to rethink everything anyway. That he has been questioning what he is doing to our family and that he wants to talk when he gets back from a work trip that he is on, that he needs a few days to think.
I am so relieved from a financial perspective, but nervous about what’s next. I guess I will know more in few days, but I feel like we have been forced (by finances) back on the rollercoaster.
