Thanks. I don’t feel strong or brave or healthy or anything of the sort right now. I feel overwhelmed with sadness. I’m trying to pull myself together before H drops off D4. I don’t want him to see my pain and vulnerability anymore.
I’m sorry that you are feeling down right now. My H has said the same thing when he mentioned D - it’s just a piece of paper! It’s just a form to fill out! I actually agree with the former, yes at this point our M is indeed only binded by contract, a piece of paper, an intangible computer file even. When you start looking at it that way, maybe it could be less scary for you to accept D. The M is already over. But the relationship will never end because you are forever bonded by your daughter.
It is not wrong to have hope, but you need to be brutally honest with yourself about the reality too - that M might not be what your one version of your hope is. With that said, you can have many kinds of hope- hope of R, hope of becoming a stronger HopeCA in the end even H might not be in the picture anymore, hope that you will be the best mom you can be to your daughter, hope that life will work out somehow. Hope is not the enemy, delusion is.
I have t posted in a while. Since our last court date I have crossed a threshold into the beginning stages of letting go and true detachment. I’m by no means there or over it, but I’ve entered a phase of it I have not entered in this sitch thus far. It’s a relief.
This has had a marked effect on H. He has been texting me regularly with pointless things that are obvious tests/temp checks, bringing my daughter to visit me at work during his time with her for no reason and generally trying to engage me in chat and jokes. I’m not allowing myself to be engaged, and I’m no longer overly concerned with how that may or may not be perceived. I’ve exhausted that route. This reaction in his part does not give me hope. It’s just something I notice and I assume it’s a natural shift in the pursuer-distanced dynamic. I hold a tiny amount of hope that the feeling of loss of our family may cause H to turn back. But I do not in any way EXPECT that to happen. Intellectually I understood the difference between the two before this point, but I didn’t really believe it was possible to have joe without expectation. I feel the difference now. It’s a really strange feeling for me, but I’m grateful to have finally experienced it.
Last week H texted me to ask if he can take D4 on a short trip soon. He has asked before during this situation and I’ve always said no for various reasons. This time I accepted that it’s a matter of time before this happens, put my anxieties and concerns aside and said yes for the first time ever. He didn’t respond (or even mention it when we saw each other) for 4 days until last night when he texted me to say that he had forgotten to respond and to thank me. I think this is BS, but it doesn’t matter.
On Thursday when he dropped of D4 he brought up a stack of art she made at school and mixed in I saw an envelope with his return address, addressed to the court. I don’t think he knows I saw it before he took it and put it aside. This is curious and somewhat alarming to me, as it’s my understanding that for where we are in our divorce process there is nothing he needs to submit to the court. We have always agreed to do things amicably and transparently, and I would be blindsided and really upset if he is doing something without at least letting me know first.
Then yesterday was just plain weird. When he came to get D4 he was going around cleaning things, tinkering with things around my house, talking to me about his ideas for the garden (whaaaaaa????) After they left he calledabput something he and D4 wanted to come back to grab, and he was overly familiar, calling me a nickname. It was seriously weird. Later he texted to say that D4 wanted to come to my house to eat dinner (???) and was that ok with me. In those moments I have to take a fake it til I make it approach to detachment, so I decided to say it’s fine and then leave my house. When they got there he was just being way to comfortable and familiar. I was annoyed bordering on pi**ed off about this. I attempted to keep my distance and detached air without coming off angry.
With all of this, the text about the trip, the envelope and his weirder behavior I’m feeling really anxious and uneasy. I’m contemplating asking him if somethings up, but debating if it’s a good idea. I’d love some advice or input. Here are my thoughts so far:
1) I recognize I’d be asking purely to soothe my anxiety. I’ve done things before for that reason that I’ve regretted afterward. The alternative is to wait and see.
2) on the other hand it could be empowering for me to ask about it rather than waiting and seeing.
3) there is a chance that nothing is up/the envelope has nothing to do with me or isn’t important/that he was considering doing something that he is now reconsidering. In any of those cases I would not want to draw attention back to it or force his hand on anything.
4) bringing it up does not contribute to my air of detachment. Much of my detachment is real, and much is still in fake it til I make it mode. But I’m actually succeeding at it somewhat for the first time and I don’t want to burst that bubble unnecessarily.
Turning around. Say nothing. Act as if you don't even notice.
Mine did that too. I don't want to put too much detail here because you never know who is reading but he did a 180 in his behavior and I thought for awhile he'd lost his mind.
Mine came back. And we were in the same place as you. All he had to do was go to the court and finalize it. He didn't.
You’ve pointed out how it’s impossible to tell what he’s thinking or why he’s acting that way. I’ve noticed from time to time my WAW will become nicer for awhile and I’ve never figured out why. Sometimes I think she is alleviating her own guilt. Sometimes I think it is genuine. Sometimes I think she forgets what we are going through. But one thing for sure... as long as I am confused, I keep trying to stay detached and not get sucked into wondering what she is thinking.
That being said I’m sure seeing the envelope was tough and has you wondering what is going on? Do you have any reason to think you would need to protect yourself legally?
To clarify though, I did NOT mean at all that I was considering asking him about his strange behavior or his mindset. The only thing I was considering asking him about was the envelope, which is the true cause of my anxiety. The rest just provided a weird context for the whole thing
Hi, Hope! I’ve been thinking about you and wondering how you are. I have a similar experience from time to time with wanting to ask questions to calm my anxiety, when that is really something I can do on my own, by accepting that I don’t know but I really want to, and that’s okay. Many times my anxiety ends up being over nothing. I would lean toward number 4 too, while considering unchien’s question about whether you really think you might need to protect yourself legally for some reason. Maybe this is something you could run by a lawyer if you’re worried, and that will calm you? I.e. What are all the possible scenarios; of those, which seem likely or most unlikely, and would any of them end up affecting you negatively in the end anyway? Maybe you have done all you need to to prepare for them, and you can let it go.
Originally Posted by HopeCA
Intellectually I understood the difference between the two before this point, but I didn’t really believe it was possible to have joe without expectation. I feel the difference now. It’s a really strange feeling for me, but I’m grateful to have finally experienced it.
Bravo, Hope! I have hope I will get to this point too.
Hope ~ for anything that may have legal consequences, I wonder if you can take detachment out of your thinking process? It is really hard to weigh these decisions. Do you need to know what the letter was about? I don’t know the answer.
I do not recall the details of where you are in the process. I’m at a stage of extreme distrust while on the surface trying to mediate through things, so my advice is grey tinged for sure. I lean towards advising you have L advice just in case - a decent L would give you advice without pushing you to do anything. Perhaps you have no reason to be concerned and then could let it go
I decided to let the anxiety about the envelope go—-I’m not worried that there’s anything he could be up to that would affect me in an immediate sense, and I decided that I should wait and see, rather than ask questions just to soothe my anxiety. Nothing has come of it so far.
H’s behavior continued to be weird, seeking my attention and trying to be around. I have made myself scarce for the most part. Last night I gave in a bit; H came to pick up D4 at my house because she didn’t have school yesterday, and when he came in he was being that weird way again, trying to catch eye contact with me, commenting how cute D4 and I are together. He asked if I had dinner plans (I’ve gone made sure to be out the past few evenings) and I didn’t have time to think and said no, and he offered to go get take out. I knew right then I should say no thank you, but I said ok. We had a nice evening, after we ate I tried to keep my distance and let him be with D4, and he kept chatting me up.
After he put D4 to bed, he brought up wanting to figure out a custody arrangement for the D. I kept composed and we started a long conversation about custody stuff. We had some sticking points and he was frustrated and wanted to see a mediator. That frustration (re me not giving in to what he wants) quickly devolved into him expressing his anger at me for OLD things from our past (the same things he has brought up over and over again since BD, which we have discussed at length, I’ve apologized profusely for, etc) He expressed feeling that I was steam rolling him in the conversation, that I let my emotions control all me decisions, I’m inflexible and I always get my way.He brought up wanting to have taken D4 on trips in the last year and I’ve always said no. I told him I realize that and wanted to do the right thing despite my feelings and anxieties, and that’s why I’d said yes this time. It almost feels like my giving him what he wanted triggered his anger about all the times I didn’t.
I was genuinely shocked, I hadn’t heard that kind of anger and animosity and resentment from him in a while, and I validated and let him know I was surprised as I didn’t realize he still felt those ways. He said of course he does, it’s old scars and ptsd from what I put him through and he doesn’t know if it will ever heal. I tried to validate as much as I could. He also said that “the only thing he ever did wrong in our M was to kiss your a$$ and bend over backward to make you happy”.ummm ok. I breathed and said I hear what you’re saying, but I don’t see it that way. I told him that I know it’s possible to forgive and get past that level of pain and anger, because I’ve largely done it with therapy during all of this. He got quiet and said he was tired and left.
WTF. I don’t know where all of that came from. I guess I was naive in thinking he had been working through all of that (he had told me he was in IC a while back, from what he said last night it sounds like that was short lived). It’s just so frustrating. It feels like he just does not WANT to forgive me. It feels like he sets himself/us up ass a test and when he enjoys his time with me it makes him angry and think about past resentments, or something like that. I don’t know. It’s just so frustrating that he is seemingly choosing to remain resentful and resist healing/forgiveness at all. I just don’t get it.
Sure am wishing I had followed my gut and said no to that &@!$! dinner.
