The bomb woke me up, but she won't talk

[sandi2]

Wow! I am so impressed with your big 180's. I think you did an excellent job in pulling back......not only from eating meals at her place, but in how you handled the other situations.

I wished I had seen your previous post sooner. I would have warned you that you'd probably experience a down day, following your great progress. I see it happen with almost everyone. You will be so pleased with your accomplishments, and suddenly you'll have a day you feel totally depressed and lonely.

Try to think of these as your "rainy days". We don't hear so much about saving things for a rainy day anymore, but try this as an experiment. You know these days will come, so have something special prepared to do on those days. Save a book you've wanted to read, or call an old buddy, change your usual routine of the day/night (if possible), watch a comedy show, go see an action movie, buy some new clothes, go to a new resturant or cook something special and invite a friend over, etc. In other words, be your best friend on those rainy days. Keep a running list of activities, as they come to mind, and then on the rainy day......you'll have some ideas saved. Some guys notice their hardest part of the day is in the beginning of the morning time. If you have a particular tough time of the day, do something different........like playing big band music, or a motivational speaker on YouTube, or take a walk, etc. Don't watch love stories or sad movies. Don't listen to sad songs.

I am even starting to feel some relief and pleasure, but not at her expense, its more due to me finally remembering how to be the man I really am.

Observing the situation as if you were the third party helps give you a more detached and balanced view point. If you can take pleasure, I think you deserve it. Free the man you are meant to be.

The one question I have ATM is how do I answer when she asks about this pulling back behavior? She has definitely noticed and Im sure the question will come soon. The current answer I have is I am just working on myself and learning to let go.

I don't think I'd tell her you are working on yourself. Too much implication, there. There are some things you just don't share with her. You could say, "I've decided it's time to let go". That makes you sound a little stronger, as if this is your choice.

I turned down another meal there yesterday and turned down calling in after work today

.

That must have been really difficult, since you were having a down day. ((hugs))

She has responded by calling more and talking about her work stuff more, not just kids stuff.

That's good. Now, let me warn you of something else that will probably happen. Since you have really pulled back.......I think you can expect her to temp check you. She's wondering what is up with you, and if she doesn't get satisfactory answers (and she shouldn't get them), she will do something to test you to see how much you are still emotionally attached to her/MR.

[lusa]

I think Ive made more progress on this scary path by following through on my commitment to detach with love and stop pursuing. Realising the pursuit had taken the form of family time is a big breakthrough and has definitely helped me detach. I think our normal conversations have been nicer too.

Having said that Im disappointed that me pulling back like this has resulted so far in her now asking me less to be there with the kids, less offers of meals and her doing all the house jobs herself.

I am going to continue walking this scary path as I can feel it helping me to finally find myself. Even though its counter-intuitive and feels the wrong thing to do for the MR and the family ATM. Its laughable that I feel Ive been demonstrating so much patience with this but Ive only just finished day 6.

We had an interesting text exchange this afternoon, which Im sure I made mistakes with but I think her reply was very significant so Im going to post it here.
Regarding my 97yr old Grandma who has recently passed away, she messaged

I miss her warmth and her kindness and her solidness, do you know what I mean?

I replied
Yes that sums up what she gave out very well. We were lucky to have had that time with such a wonderful lady. I think youll be like that when youre a grandma too.

I think this was a mistake, but she was, and sometimes I think still is like that.

Then she replied
I want to be a wild grandma after all these years of sensibleness.

Shes actually telling me this, and of course i straight away think of this thread. She has never been wild and sometimes I think that was partly my fault.

Heres my other mistakes

I replied
Even if you were wild you would still be warm kind and solid
Go for it, Im sure our grandkids would love a wild grandma

I really regret sending this now, i feel it goes against all the principals and has undone all my hard work.......duh

On reflection I think I still haven't detached properly and was desperate to communicate that

I still know and value that she is still warm and kind inside and she always has been to everyone.

I want you to remember we will have to share grandkids and BD, EA, D, etc will even affect them all those years into the future.

[SteveLW]

lusa,

yes you made mistakes. You should have kept the text about your grandma, not about your W.

This: Yes that sums up what she gave out very well. We were lucky to have had that time with such a wonderful lady. I think youll be like that when youre a grandma too.

Should have been just: Yes that sums up what she gave out very well. We were lucky to have had that time with such a wonderful lady.

Remember, you are detaching, you are validating her feelings (which is what the edited response above would do). What you did was pursue and pressure by making it about her. Essentially what you were saying is: "Our future together, with our grandkids, you'll be a grandma like that too!"

Her rebelling against that was obvious. "I want to be a wild grandma!" she is saying "My future doesn't include you, and I will be out sowing my wild oats for the rest of my life!"

The key to DBing is to 1) prepare yourself no matter what the future holds 2) remove all pursuit and pressure from the WAS to try to coax them to get curious about why that went away and come looking 3) to not remind them of what they have stated they want or how they feel

1 is what GAL, detachment, and 180s are all about. 2 is as I described. But 3 is a really big key. This is why saying "I love you" is something LBSs shouldn't say. Because it reminds the WAS that they DON'T love you. At least that is not how they feel at the moment. When you take away pursuit and pressure it allows the WAS room to breathe and to even potentially forget that they've already decreed that they are leaving.

In my sitch, I spent just over 2 months pursuing, pressuring, reminding my wife inadvertently that she wanted out of the MR. When I got better at detachment, and removed the pressure and pursuit, then my W slowly started to give up her waywardness, and she slowly, even reluctantly, started to move back towards the MR.

She even said to our MC "as we talk about fun things, and have fun discussions my desire to leave decreases and my desire to stay increases". That meant I stopped initiating any and all relationship discussions!

So remove that pressure. It isn't a guarantee, but if you continue to pursue and pressure I guarantee you will push her away.

[Davide]

The key to DBing is to 1) prepare yourself no matter what the future holds 2) remove all pursuit and pressure from the WAS to try to coax them to get curious about why that went away and come looking 3) to not remind them of what they have stated they want or how they feel

I love this. I think 3 is tied in with 2, as all that sort of talk puts pressure on them. But this is a great summary.

[SteveLW]

Yes Davide, I agree that 2 and 3 are related. But I thought it was important in this case to point out that 3 is important because we sometimes think we can "hint" our WAS into wanting to come back. So we try subtlety to get them to "think" about what they are doing. lusa was being subtle (but still obvious) in his "I think you'll be like that as a grandma too".

But really what he was doing was reminding the WAW that she doesn't want to be co-grandparents with him right now. That being a warm, kind, solid type of person isn't who she wants to be right now. While it WAS pursuit, it was more just a bad idea because it made his WAW start to think about how she feels towards being "sensible" right now.

So yes 2 and 3 can be combined. Pursuit is reminding them of how they feel. Reminding them of how they feel IS pursuit. Good observation.

[lusa]

Thanks for clarifying the stupid mistakes that I had a feeling I had made. Apart from this bad text exchange I think Ive done really well this week avoiding family time when she has requested it.

She called me again today to discuss D10s birthday presents, and asked if all four of us could go on a family walk tomorrow. I automatically said yes, but having had some time to reflect I now know I again have to decline. I want my family back together all the time, not just when it suits her. So I am going to decline, not sure how to say it yet, but if she pushes for a reason I will say I have decided to let go.

D10 will be staying with me overnight tomorrow, so I will simply go and pick her up when shes ready, instead of playing fake happy families all day with my WW.

[lusa]

I've changed my mind again, Ive cut down so much on the time ive spent with her this week, I need some chance to showcase my changes and then refuse invitations again. I wish I wasnt so indecisive about this, its hardly showing the strength I wish I had.

[Maika]

Your decisions to spend time and not spend time is solely based around what her reactions will be. That road leads to expectations and that leads to disappointment, and that leads you back to square one.

You need to showcase your changes? Then do it for yourself and not her. She'll notice. She'll also notice if you're faking those changes. You're not doing any favours to yourself with this approach.

[lusa]

Thanks for your input Maika, its much appreciated. I have thought about it long and hard and realised I have still been basing all my decisions regarding spending time together on the reaction I want from her. I have kept this thought with me over the weekend where we did spend family time together.

We went shopping and swimming saturday, d10 stayed with me overnight and all the next morning and then I gardened all sunday wth them, WW cooked meals for us and we interacted nicely.

She said she had noticed I'd drastically reduced my alcohol consumption in the last few months and we briefly discussed the impact alcohol had previously had on our relationship and the kids.

I feel this is significant progress compared with the months of zero MR communication from my hardened hearted WW. I realise the fact I see this as significant is because it relative to 6 months of absolutely no MR talk since BD.

Thanks again for leaving me with a thought that helps remind me to assess my intent before making a decision.

[Maika]

Great update lusa! Keep working on your changes. Don't base your decisions around her reactions. Be authentic to yourself. Looks like you can spend time with her without it being emotionally taxing to you.

I haven't read your whole sitch, but what happened to her EA?