I [34/f] am the LBS. My husband [33/m; 6 years married; 8 years together] is moving out for a trial 6 months separation in two weeks.
We still love each other as friends and as family, but he is no longer attracted to me or in love with me. He has let little things in our relationship build up without expressing them to me, without expressing or understanding how to properly deal with emotions... and they have festered to the point where he has been avoidant and felt trapped for about a year. He told me this about two months ago.
I knew he wasn't doing well, but I thought it was external stresses. He has had serious health issues we worked through and are now managed; had issues finding a job, got a new job, and is now working nights. His parents came from halfway across the world (he is an immigrant) for almost two months, and that was also stressful. I thought that his distance was him dealing with anxiety and depression due to these external issues.
He says it is all because of us. He has "worked on" our marriage for the last year and a half and it feels unfixable to him. (I feel like you can't "work on" a marriage alone without communication... he just sucked things up and didn't communicate).
We're in couples therapy but we both dislike the therapist; it's hard to find someone who is on our insurance who has availability that works with our backwards schedules (he works nights; I work days). I am in individual therapy; he went once (and it seemed to do a lot of good and give him some clarity on things) but refuses to return.
He says that his goal is for us to be together, but he doesn't see how he can fall back in love with me. He loves me, but he can't "flip a switch to turn off his feelings." He knows that he has built up resentment towards me unfairly, but still doesn't know how to fix it. The relationship stress has also caused some intimacy issues that need to be resolved for us to work as well.
He says the only way he might be able to think our relationship could be fixed is for him to have space... which is why he is moving out and has a six-month lease at a place about 10 minutes away.
I spent a few hours yesterday reading through these forums, and wow. I already feel a sense of peace and like this has affirmed a lot of what I have been doing and also completely shown me where I am going wrong (in many ways!). I've ordered the books but they haven't come yet.
The good:
- I have been doing lots of 180s (without knowing that terminology) -- with the primary motivation being for myself; secondary motivation being for him. I've lost 12 lbs over the past month or so. I am going to the gym 3-4x/week and feel so much better when I do so. I am cooking and cleaning more (part of what he wants from me; but, to be fair, that was a two-way street and we had BOTH given up, not just me)... knowing that this is good for me too and I am happier when I am saving money, eating better, and in a cleaner environment. I have surrounded myself with friends more. I have started meditating some. I am wearing makeup more.
I am proud of myself for all this.
But the bad -- I am a mess when it comes to Sandi's rules, detachment, and pursuing.
- I have talked to way too many people about this, and really regret that. I needed affirmation and support, but probably went the wrong way about this.
- I am pursuing, pursuing, pursuing. Like... I am saying "I love you" to hear him say it back. I have been pushing sex because I want the physical connection. I told him all my insecurities about him leaving. I've asked him to stay. I have pressured him to do therapy. I have pressured him to read resources. I even bought him flowers a few weeks ago. I pressure him to talk about problems to try to "work them out." I have done everything that I shouldn't do. Like, probably every single one of Sandi's rules... I am breaking. Constantly. No wonder I feel like we are stuck.
And I feel sheepish about it, but also have some grace and forgiveness for myself. This is new territory for me. I am doing what I can, and learning through the process.
I am not sure where to start with some of this. Detachment is hard. I feel so connected to his moods that it's tricky to figure out how to get out of it. I feel like connection and communication is important.
I am afraid if I let him go, he won't come back. I know that it's important to let him go. But it's so... hard. Counter-intuitive.
With the whole pursuer issue... I wonder how to do this (not pursue) in a way that's not performative or manipulative. I don't want to be dishonest. That is a tricky one for me.
I read somewhere on the boards about the tactic of saying "I had a great time today even if I know it doesn't change anything." I like that line. We've actually had some great times over the last week or so. I know his feelings haven't changed and he still wants/needs space. But I used the line last night, and it felt good to me, and he responded well.
I love the lighthouse metaphor. It's a good thing to strive for, and it helps me see the point of detaching and not pursuing.
Last night, I wanted to text him or call him when I couldn't sleep. I didn't. It wasn't as hard as I thought.
We've been trying to figure out "rules" for the separation. Yesterday, he said I should come up with the rules that work for me and he'd let me know if they were okay. Today, I sent him an email saying that since this is for him and what he needs, I'd prefer him to let me know what works best for him so I am not imposing or pressuring him into something unhelpful.
It's a weird place to be in, because I get mixed messages all the time. He says that he hopes we can make things work. He hopes we can stay together. He's been more communicative about things over the last few weeks. I have thanked him for communicating and the feedback. But when he talks about things being hopeless, or how he feels things are "unfixable..." with the fact that he is literally moving out.. what does that mean? When he refuses individual therapy; refuses to do workbooks or homework... how can he be "working" on things or towards something? (I know now, after reading the message boards, that space actually IS working on things, for him).
I asked him about the mixed messages and said it was hard for me (I know; I shouldn't have -- I know that now). He said it was annoying that I overthink things -- that he has said he ultimately wants us to work out, and I should believe that. So, I'll trust that.
Our marriage isn't bad, from my perspective. We've taken each other for granted. We've fallen into routine. But we support each other in many, many ways. We don't yell at each other or cut each other down. Even in this process, we both have tried (as much as possible, which isn't always the "right" way but the intentions are there) to make things as easy for the other. We disentangled finances a few weeks ago in preparation for the separation, and he gave me 3/4 of our savings. I tried to get him to take more; he wouldn't. He says "I know you are hurt by this and sometimes I want to just stay in this to make you happy because I don't want to hurt you." Obviously, that's the wrong approach, but we are trying to care for the other.
It's been the little things that build and fester. It's an identity crisis (we met abroad; he's an immigrant... and he wonders if he has lost his identity by becoming too "American."). It feels fixable to me, but I'm the LBS, so that's normal.
So -- help? Any thoughts? Advice (besides read the articles, books, and newcomer posts -- I've read most of them and the books are coming).
In particular, how can I manage detachment?
Even the first step in the post ("First: Establish emotional boundaries between you and the person, place or thing with whom you have become overly enmeshed or dependent on.")... how do I do that? How do I establish emotional boundaries? How do I convince my emotions to not be irrational, but to be logical? What are the steps to get to step one?
And how do you stop pursuing while not becoming "manipulative" or inauthentic?
Thanks in advance.
Me- 34/f H- 33/m No kids 8 years together 6 years married
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
No infidelity that I know of. A few years back, he kissed someone... but I could tell something was up and asked; he fessed up. That's it.
Back in late February, a friend found him on a dating site. He admitted it, said it was just up for less than 24 hours, and that he knew it was stupid but he wanted to feel "wanted." He deleted and hasn't been back on it; said he hadn't even talked to anyone about it. He apologized; I told him I deserved better and that it was disrespectful. He understood but said it meant nothing and was just him being lost and confused.
No kids. We both want kids. He said about two years into the marriage that it'd be too hard and maybe he doesn't want kids anymore. It took me awhile to come to terms with it, but I did. Now, he says he has always wanted kids but just didn't think our marriage was strong enough for it, which is why he said he changed his mind. My sister (3 years younger) getting pregnant was the impetus for him to express his unhappiness because he wants kids, but thinks it would destroy us more than we are already in the weeds.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
This is great advice. The book is being shipped home, but I've had about a dozen marriage or self-help books shipped to me in the last few months and H never even glances at them. So I think we're okay there.
I'd like to think he doesn't go on my computer, but who knows. Ugh. What a pain... but probably worth it. Good insight.
So. I feel like trying to follow the rules and being detached makes me cold. Like... I feel artificially cold and weird around H. I know he's been surprised that I haven't brought up the relationship, that I seem to be doing okay. He said he might go spend time in a cafe alone tonight, and I encouraged him to do so. I think he is puzzled. We'll see.
I am torn between doing 180s that are doing things for him and not doing them. Thoughts?
They are to make you into a person that only a fool would leave. They are not to try to attract him back. He must decide that for himself.
Fellow newbie here and relate to a lot of your post, mybest. It is VERY difficult to truly detach and shake the feeling that if you let them go, they won't come back. After all, we are here because they have already said they wanted to go! Very counter intuitive. I am struggling to establish emotional boundaries and letting go of the idea that maintaining connection and communication is so critical. I can do the physical distancing by force, like you described just willing yourself not to call or text. But in my own head and emotionally, I don't think it's true detachment.
My question for you Cadet, in regards to the piece I quoted, is "making you into a person that only a fool would leave" and "not to try to attract him back" seem like conflicting statements. You are making yourself attractive so no one would leave, including him. I get the idea that the change is for yourself and not the other person, but at the end of the day how do you separate the fact that all this is brought on during an effort to win them back?
M: 26 W: 26 M: 1.5 T: 3 No kids BD: 31 March 2018
W's affair began: 23 March 2018 Affair confirmed: 18 April 2018 Confrontation/claims she ended A: 14 May 2018 Ended in-house separation: July 2018
How would your H describe the MR, if he were telling us about it? What would he tell us about living with you?
Why has he lost attraction for you?
Why was he working on the MR alone for a year and a half?
I hope you will be painfully honest.
The 37 rules were written as bullet points. If I can help you with certain ones, let me know and I'll try to explain them more.
You are reacting mostly out of fear. Your actions are not attractive to him. Surely, knowing you are pushing him out of the door will help you resist pressuring him to stay with a desperate wife. ((hugs))
I'm glad you found this board. The more you can tell us, the better we can see the bigger picture. Get ready for a lot of hard work.
P.S. Would weight gain happen to be one of the issues for his lack of attraction?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
