You've been a good friend and continue to be so. I really appreciate your opinion.
If I go dark it will be for myself. It just seems I go more grey, recharge and get on with my life only to have to talk to her at some point and it feels like starting over again in terms of having to detach. I'm not used to the two steps forward one step back dance.
My conundrum with the dog is the same thing. I'm debating and wanted some opinions because I want to make a decision on this and move forward for good, but I may just have to accept the dance will continue for now.
The other thing is DR efforts vs. personal motivations. Yes I remember to think of me first, and DR efforts if they are comfortable to me. I'm the type of person that pushes himself so it is hard not to get carried away. I need to remember the priority is me now, hard to step back from the provider role and wanting her back in some sick and twisted way.
I'm going back to boot camp tonight and hope to have figured some of this stuff out. By looking at my bookshelf one would think I've got some major problems.
Quote: It just seems I go more grey, recharge and get on with my life only to have to talk to her at some point and it feels like starting over again in terms of having to detach. I'm not used to the two steps forward one step back dance.
I know what you mean! Actually, thinking about detachment as not trying to solve the WAS problems or getting enmeshed in them versus trying to shut them out helps me a good deal. Strong and healthy relationships include a measure of detachment. Think partner, not provider or caretaker.
Quote: I'm going back to boot camp tonight and hope to have figured some of this stuff out. By looking at my bookshelf one would think I've got some major problems.
LOL! One might think that of any of us! Or, that we've decided to take an active approach to living a fulfilling life and dealing with the obstacles on that path. I'd hate to think what my bookshelf might look like to someone who's never met me! Scary thought.
Hey Seattle! Sounds like you've got some issues to handle. Well, I can only offer advice as it suits me and give you as many (((((((((()))))))))))))) as wonder does.
But, I just want to let you know that it sounds like you're hitting that break point. Once again, the BB seems to be all about this right now--making decisions on whether or not to fully let go, release ourselves, etc....
I would have to say it's your choice (you know that) and it's really hard to do. You follow Underdog's thread, right? I think there have been some insightful points made there lately and they kind of opened my eyes a little.
Sounds like your WAS is very depressed. You can't change it. You could throw jabs in to her about pregnant but what good would that do? You did the right thing. She needs to deal w/those things herself. Again, you can't be her crutch any longer. You did good when she threw out her line about being tired. You need to do it some more. Hard, I know. But I have started to release myself from it as well coz I can't keep holding H hand either. He needs to figure out on his own that the kids have certain needs and I'm not gonna keep telling him or buying things for his place so they are "taken care of". See, it's their choice. They want to be done w/us, so don't share your life w/me (comments) coz I can't do anything for you----BECOZ you won't let me. So go have your pity party somewhere else. Sorry if this seems harsh but it's where I am. I would do no harm to my kids but if they are w/him and get sick, it's not my job to be sure that he has the proper medication at his place to care for them. If he has to run out and get something w/3 kids, then so be it. I plan ahead for these things and would be ready if they were home and sick. He needs to plan too. Same for you. She needs to deal w/her sister and OM and pregnancy, etc...not your decision to become disconnected, it was a result of her leaving.
As for the dog...I"m not sure what to say here. I want to tell you to let go but I know how much she (?) means to you. You are right though that possibly some day you will need to stop the visitation but if it makes you feel good now than keep it up.
I guess the big question is: Are you ready to let go of life as you knew it w/WAS and dog and put those thoughts to rest once and for all or do you want to hang onto them bcoz you can't let go due to the pain still? I know I'm not totally there yet like I said before. I'm stronger. So are you. So are a bunch of people here but some of us have this deep-seated urge to continue on and believe that our WAS will return some time. Hope is okay. That's all we have right now but we need to decide sometime.
Your WAS seems like mine in that they are so focused on the negative that they see no positives w/us. Everything about us reminds us of sadness, pain and lost dreams for them. When we see them, we think of unconditional love, how much we're doing for them now, what we could have w/them in the future if they would just turn around, how much we want to change for them and us, etc..... This is why it makes it hard for both of you.
Going dark may help you to move forward even more. I don't have that option but I believe it would help me. You need to grieve more ? and forgive mostly. I think forgiveness is the biggest gift you give yourself.
Seattle, you have endured. You have tried. Now you need to decide whether you are ready or not to let go. Letting go may mean going dark. In the end, she is still in control because you're waiting for her to complete the paperwork--not that that's a problem; but in some ways is she still holding on????????
Take care Seattle. You've been through a lot and you're a good man. ((((((((((())))))))))))) Tootles................
I can't believe its been over a month since I last posted. I'm bumping myself up to the front just so my thread doesn't get lost forever. I will post an update soon. As soon as I get enough energy and time to write somthing clear and eloquent. Just so you guys aren't left hanging, not much has changed with her, but lots for me. In the meantime take care everyone.
My thoughts are with you all. I have been keeping up with you all just not posting. It has been a long time since my last update but I’ve really been trying to use my energy for my own mental, physical, and most importantly my emotional well being. If there is a group of people in this world that I know understands where I’m coming from it is you all. My apologies for not checking in and posting more often.
Since my last post I’ve done a tremendous amount of healing and growing for myself. However I am constantly reminded how much more I can continue to improve, but I guess that’s life.
I’ve made new friends, been involved in many activities, and basically have had a great time enjoying the summer and living life. I’ve realized how many things I am thankful for.
I have also realized why I chose her to be my wife. Not that I’m holding onto anything at all, but being single again has reminded me that no one is perfect, LOL!
Many things have happened between us that shows signs of ambivelance and maybe more from her. But since she is unwilling to clearly communicate, I’m not going to interpret her words. I do wonder sometimes if there will be so much BS said that I will need to be hit on the head with a 2x4 if she ever were to want to reconcile. Like “I want to reconcile you idiot”. But shouldn’t this be the clear communication among adults? If any of you have had experience with your WAW and how they came about this subject (this means you Betsey! As well as others) I would be interested to know.
She seems like she is trying harder to connect lately. She’s more friendly on phone and in person.
She still continues to cry often and at any moment
Some soundbites from the recent past:
I've been thinking a lot about you lately and I’m kind of looking forward to getting away just to have some peace of mind for a little while.
I don't know
Our marriage wasn’t all that bad
If you want to get together and talk when I get back that would be great (this is the first time she has offered this, especially after saying she would never have another R talk with me again. Of course she didn’t follow up on having this talk)
I would like to bring my sister over to act as a mediator (figuring out settlement agreement) in case we can't agree on somthing. I also think it would help me be less emotional.
(After stating why I would really prefer that her sister didn't come over) Ok you are right, I just think that my sister being there might help me be less of an emotional wreck. Everytime I'm over there we never seem to get much progress and it ends badly. I leave and cry for hours and hours afterwards.
No I didn’t go to their wedding (mutual friends), I'm pretty depressed lately and didn't feel like going to a wedding.
I'm not going to buy somthing off their register because they would have to split things up and this process is too painful (Positive Attitude? Not Really!)
Can the dog come over (I invited her when we were figuring out the settlement)? I thought you didn’t want to see her anymore? (I said I am choosing not to see her right now, there is a big difference.)
I don’t believe in love anymore. I don’t believe in marriage anymore.
After I asked some questions as to why. She said she still believes in these things but just isn’t going to be all “gung ho” on them now. WTF????
Packing and moving the rest of her stuff was very emotional. It seemed much more so for her than for me. She cried often and pretty heavily. I reached out to hug her a couple times, it seemed like she really needed it. She embraced me and was sobbing heavily. I pulled back to look at her face full of tears and was going to kiss her forehead, she gave me her lips instead. Again, WTF????
Regarding the papers, I just got the “filled out” version from her attorney. There was a period when they were supposedly lost in the mail. Should I believe this? I have let go. It seems she is holding on?
I then received a short note from her recently that said
Thank you for your generosity and tolerance of my tears. This process is hard and so sad for me even thought it was/is my choice. I miss our life and your friendship. My heart aches and I cry over the pending end of something that was so precious to me. As of course tears flow now and I’m at work so I’ll wrap it up. I’m truly sorry and appreciate your kindness.
Then she goes into writing about something we already agreed upon.
The year anniversary of the bomb is a few weeks away and her birthday is this week. I’m thinking of writing a short birthday card essentially saying that we all make choices, make choices everyday, and it is up to each of us to choose to change the things in our lives. Choosing to change the present and the future. We can’t change the past. And leave it at that.
I’m not sure under what situation I would entertain her coming back, but it would have to meet a lot of my needs before I would consider it. But I do want her to heal, find out what she is really looking for, it is too important to not clearly communicate.
Whatever she is looking or wants there is no way she will get it unless she asks for it. It just seems to me that she is afraid of losing face with the rest of the world if she stops this.
My connundrum with my priorities is I really don’t want to deal with this craziness anymore. I want some forward progress and her ambivelance destroys that and my sanity.
Holy cow, Seattle! Look at what happens when you stay in the bat cave for so long?
Okay, I have lots of thoughts running through my mind now. But you have 2 opposing thoughts going here and I guess I really want to explore how you feel before we venture into the realm of me thinking your W is rethinking all this stuff. My question really is about you...
Okay, you mentioned all the interesting things she has said which certainly sound as though she is reconsidering her R with you at whatever level she feels can be possible.
But in your bottom paragraph, you indicate that you don't want to deal with the craziness anymore.
You know I certainly understand that, and you are definitely allowed to act on the latter if you feel that this is absolutely true. That being said, are you willing to really hang on, be more patient, and be her friend until she is able to be more forthcoming with answers? (and knowing you still might not like them?)
I guess I want to push a button here and find out how amenable you are to spending more time on the DB path.
HOWEVER (you knew that was coming, didn't you?)...
I see some major league baby steps here in her communication with you. Hey, back in April she didn't want to talk to you at all, let alone make any R statements or even statements that would segue into R talk, right?
And now this stuff is pouring out of her mouth freely?
Methinks that your strategy is working, my dear.
When she says all this hooey about not believing in marriage or not wanting another R, how do you respond?
Have you visited Jerry G's thread in newcomers lately? I think it's worth a quick click up there to see his latest, as you might find some nuggets to use yourself.
In the meantime, I am encouraged by this softening in her. The big question is can you handle her as the package you see right now? Knowing she has a lot of healing to do?
Big hugs, my friend. I've missed you!
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
