Any differences between WAH's and WAW's? (2)

[Vanilla]

OK Juliw,

Suppose I accept what you say, about who you are and how you were in your M, what are the 180s?

How will you achieve those?

With or without H.

V

[JulieH]

OK Juliw,

Suppose I accept what you say, about who you are and how you were in your M, what are the 180s?

How will you achieve those?

With or without H.

V

My 180s..
1. Stop asking for reassurances. It was controlling and annoying and broadcasted my
insecurities. Just because i keep asking , doesn't mean my husband would give me
the answer I wanted to hear. (Stopped for 9 days)
2. Showed my appreciation more. I always complained about what was not there instead
of appreciated what we had. (I have to recognize the good things and verbally
acknowledge them) I focused on what my husband was doing wrong instead of right.
(The journal my DB coach recommended is helping with this)
3. Stop the controlling behaviors. I Needed to accept my husband for who he was
instead of pushing him to do things he didn't want to do. I like to go places with the
kids and he didn't like to wake up early. I should have just accepted this and went out
in my own, instead of getting angry and using guilt trips so he would do what i want
when I wanted.
4. Communicate differently. Listen better, use softer words, validate. I misinterpret a lot
of what he says and does. I should have asked him to,explain what he means instead
of assuming he meant something and then becoming defensive and argumentative.
(Have a lot of trouble with this one)
5. Make time for myself to spend with friends. Since the birth of my sons 5 years ago I
went out with my friends possibly 2 x. This wasn't healthy. My husband encouraged
me to do so, but I wanted spare time to be family time.
6. Dress up more. With the kids I just didn't want to spend money on myself and didn't
feel like it mattered how I dressed anymore. ( just got a haircut in city and started
wearing makeup again and sexier clothes)

There is more, but I need to reflect and get some sleep.

[V2pt0]

it's only hours later and now I miss my husband so much and I regret so many ways that I behaved in the past. I was so immature, I could have done so many things differently, I took for granted that he would always love me. I worry right now because anyone he meets will be so much better then me the past few years. I wish he would give us a second chance. (BT13. Your right, anger can feel better then regret)

Try not to be too hard on yourself, Julie. We are all inperfect when it comes to love and marriage. The silver lining is by having this all happen is that you now have an opportunity to work on you and become a better person moving forward. Yes, anyone your H meets now will on the surface seem better because it will be in the early stages of infatuation, but that will soon wear off and he will quickly realize that person is not perfect either. By not doing the work to repair his first M, he is just preparing himself to run again.

Yes, when you let the anger go, the pain, hurt, and sorrow come flooding back to the surface. What I am realizing is that it is easy to want to go back to feeling anger to get rid of the pain, but it inhibits personal growth because you spend too much time focus on what the other person did wrong and not on improving ourselves. It is easy to do this when your spouse does stuff that leads to resentment. That is where detaching comes in, but easier said than done.

It does sound like you are doing better with you 180s. Keep up the great work!!

[Vanilla]

Julie when you are happy with your answers I have some further questions!

V

[JulieH]

A couple more 180s...

1. Be more independent. I asked husband for too many things I could have done myself. Probably a combination of wanting his attention, laziness, insecurity. I justified it by saying I have to watch the kids, but really I could have figured it out. (This I have done out of necessity the past 6 months)

2. Clean more and be better organized. I love to read and exercise and (currently obsessing over these forums) but instead I should be doing more domestic stuff (something I hate)

[JulieH]

11 days and no pursuing behaviors. Just staying detached. Kids started kindergarten yesterday. Husband came by to see them off and we were polite. He went out of his way to walk me to car. Conversation was about children. I was polite but distant (being warm and friendly is so unnatural right now). He called me later and was asking about how I felt regarding kids starting school and growing up. I stayed away from relationship talk. In the past I would have brought up how the real sadness is the kids have separated parents or something like that but I am trying to act like this doesn't affect me.
As the days go on its getting easier to not feed into my obsessions regarding asking him what he's been doing and if there is other woman. The feeling comes and I will call a friend (don't want to bother her too much though) or write here and then I can get through it.

[Vanilla]

Julie

I think WH was baiting your sadness in the convo, then temp checking with his later call.

You did well, really well.

Impressed

V

[JulieH]

Yes, when you let the anger go, the pain, hurt, and sorrow come flooding back to the surface. What I am realizing is that it is easy to want to go back to feeling anger to get rid of the pain, but it inhibits personal growth because you spend too much time focus on what the other person did wrong and not on improving ourselves. It is easy to do this when your spouse does stuff that leads to resentment. That is where detaching comes in, but easier said than done.

Yes you are right. I bet this is true for the WAS as well, so I should avoid pushing his buttons, (something I was doing a lot of in past)
The problem is the majority of the time I am angry and it comes through. The DB coach and books recommend being upbeat when interacting with spouse. This has been impossible for me because of my resentment. I think I come across as distant and cool.

H stopped by yesterday to see kids and it was his suggestion for us all to go out to eat. I thought he just wanted to be with kids but he indicated in indirect way over phone that he was including me in visit. He Actually seemed frusturated when I assumed it was just him and kids but would not directly say the words...hard to explain. When he got here it was clear I was invited. He was surprisingly agreeable to go to a restaurant that the kids and I like, but One where he does not love the food. (I forgot when I made the suggestion thinking it was close by and kid friendly ) We both made polite conversation catching up on each other's families. Kids started fighting half way through and it got tough and we both wanted to just get out quickly! Still felt the distance though. I'm worried he's doing these things to prove that we can coparent and keep things amicable, or because he thinks it's good for the kids to have us all go out together. (Personally I would not want that if i knew no chance of reconciliation. I figure if he definatly tells me he wants to pursue divorce or legal separation, i would have not want to do any family outings because it sends mixed messages to everyone kids included). I would be hopeful that this is a baby step, but I know I can't count on that. I have read others posts where this happens and it means nothing. I was polite, but certainly no warmth because of the underlying anger. For a while We had become that couple that had nothing to say when we went to a restaurant, and it's even harder to be friends now cause outside of the kids there is nothing. That's why the marriage was failing. I wanted him to take up hobby with me but work and sleeping late was his life. I wanted connection for past year but he was too far gone.

[JulieH]

Past few days were very rough. Husband on business trip and of course I am filled with anxieties. He only texted 1x to check on kids. I am feeling hopeless right now. I am sick that he will come back and tell me no chance of reconciliation and that he wants to move on.

I long to call him and ask questions about his goals for reconciliation but know any answers this early will only be ones I dont want to hear. I want to call about reassurances that there are no OW. I Know that this will diminish my power and self respect and broadcast my continued attachment. The only thing I have left is to do nothing.

Hard because I am still so attached. Only good thing is I have followed rules and no pursuing behaviors for 17 days. I feel like right now all I am doing is trying to get through my day. i don't feel like I have much to look forward to. If I break these rules i will be starting all over and will have to wait longer to see if they actually work.

He has not said that he wants to end things yet (accept after our fight and my blow up) and he did say after our big fight that he would not just send divorce papers without telling me first (the fact that he told me this is a bad sign). I just feel hopeless without contact.

[JulieH]

There were so many signs that husband had mentally checked out this past year. I feel like he was just waiting for me to do something wrong so he could leave. I was trying but it was never enough. He feels like he was trying but it wasn't enough.
We had financial difficulties, health issues, car troubles,we were living in my relatives home with no privacy, and we came from a past where we were fighting a lot because of being overwhelmed with kids and finances (although his perception is that I was the problem, and I was to an extent. There are so many things I Should have done differently). He now lives in more comfortable environment, and has very little expenses, can sleep late and only has to worry about his car and work.

We are physically separated so little chance for him to see 180s.

I have no proof of OW and he has repeatedly said that there is no one, this is about us making each other miserable despite both of us being good people. In a situation like mine, are the chances slim that he will want to work on things or is he already committed to separation but scared to pull trigger (A while ago when I talked to our marriage counselor privately about this she had advised against the separation because she felt once he was gone there would be no reason for him to return. Things would be too easy for him)

Would love insight of my chances for reconciliation. Am I just fooling myself? I feel like that right now. I feel like he is again looking for that 1 excuse to end things.