[sandi2]

When it comes to exposing, it something part of me thinks could work because she is so secretive and very religious, although not acting like it.

You don't really want to shame or embarrass her back into the R, do you? Do you want her back regardless of how you get her?

I feel without letting her know i 'know about her cheating" my actions will just be seen as standoffish or ignoring her for no reason and since 'lack of affection' was an issue, she my think ive fallen back to old habits or i just dont care?

That is why I am saying you aren't prepared. There are links on this subject, but you are too emotional to digest it all.

I feel without letting her know i 'know about her cheating" my actions will just be seen as standoffish or ignoring her for no reason and since 'lack of affection' was an issue, she my think ive fallen back to old habits or i just dont care?

No, that is your own fear talking. A WW doesn't care about your feelings. You are the one who is scared to back away and not get her affection (which you said it was killing you). I think every newcomer LBH says this same thing, but it's not her, it's you.

I then brought up the religious aspect, and as I have been reading about it more as a way of improving myself since she had wanted me to show more interested, I said I looked up in the bible (something she strongly believes in) what is mentioned about marriages and infidelity. She went crazy, and yelled for a couple minutes “don’t bring God into this…etc”

Man, you are really grabbing for straws, trying to guilt her back. You said she was very religious. So was I, believe it or not. My H pulled the same stunt with me, and I reacted just like your W. She sees you preaching to her, and it does not work!! Don't you think she knows what it has to say about adultery? You are trying to guilt and shame her!

She cares deeply about her image also so I didn’t know if that could be used, at least so people she has been lying about me and the real issue too, which is mostly why im wondering?

Used to do what? There is a right way and a wrong way to DB. Guilt, shame, and punishment does not work. Those things are not attractive in a man, and it will not bring about love in a woman's heart.

Having an A means she has lost respect for you. She doesn't desire you. She must respect you as a man, before she can love you. She needs to feel attraction for you, but the things you are wanting to do will not bring about that attraction for her.

[Vanilla]

Angels

This is really going to sound far fetched to you, but truly an A and an OM are in the long term less important than you taking care of you.

Only a tiny minority of As survive long term. OMs who seduce married women are scuzz buckets and eventually show true colours. Infatuation is an addiction and it's called limerance. At this stage WW will be so hormonally charged she can't see the truth about scuzz. The more you focus on it the more it becomes you and me babe against H. It's lurve isn't it?

Well actually no it's not.

That does not stop it hurting and being something you want differently. Right now you are in the emotional state of wanting to take action that might be knee jerking.

Sandi is correct in every respect and wise beyond measure, you are fortunate to have such a wonderful guide. Read her words carefully over and over.

A cool head and detachment are essential before you act on boundaries that are not properly set.

Stillness, space and prayer (meditation) will help you breathe. Settle, relax and consider as your actions may cause you to act in damaging ways which are hard to repair.

Peace

V

[Angels]

Should i tell her to leave?

1. What do you want?

I feel like ive been a doormat to much and now she is just taking advantage,

2. If you feel like a doormat, then there's a good chance you've filled the position. A WW will take advantage, even of the toughest guys. That is how she thinks and operates.

i am falling apart and just trying to hold myself togather.

3. Then don't confront yet. Don't discuss anything with her until you can control your own emotions.

should i expose to everyone and let everyone know i still want to work on my M.

4. I don't think you are ready for any moves such as that. You are desperate and wanting to do something to shock sense into her. However, you likely will kick it into higher gear if you go at this unprepared.

1. I do not want her to leave, i love my wife, i have made that known and want to work on things. I just read other place if the A is still ongoing, there can be no improvement to the M until that stops. I do not want her to leave, and you are probably right, i would have even more pain because at least when she is here, i know where she is so my mind can calm down and not be dreading.

2. Your absolutely right, which is why im trying to change then and 'man back up'. Obviously cheating on me is unacceptable and disrespectful. I have come out of the delusion i was i and i do see the gravity and what im dealing with now...

3. i am able to control my emotions, i do have moments and fall apart when im alone, which i thought was healthy? But i can carry a conversion with her while staying calm like the one i mentioned before. While the content was apparently bad, i was very calm about it, even after she flamed on me

4. you are probably right, i do want to shock her back into reality, but i understand what your saying and i guess there is no way to do that right now which wont make things worse

[Angels]

When it comes to exposing, it something part of me thinks could work because she is so secretive and very religious, although not acting like it.

You don't really want to shame or embarrass her back into the R, do you? Do you want her back regardless of how you get her?

I feel without letting her know i 'know about her cheating" my actions will just be seen as standoffish or ignoring her for no reason and since 'lack of affection' was an issue, she my think ive fallen back to old habits or i just dont care?

That is why I am saying you aren't prepared. There are links on this subject, but you are too emotional to digest it all.

I feel without letting her know i 'know about her cheating" my actions will just be seen as standoffish or ignoring her for no reason and since 'lack of affection' was an issue, she my think ive fallen back to old habits or i just dont care?

No, that is your own fear talking. A WW doesn't care about your feelings. You are the one who is scared to back away and not get her affection (which you said it was killing you). I think every newcomer LBH says this same thing, but it's not her, it's you.

I then brought up the religious aspect, and as I have been reading about it more as a way of improving myself since she had wanted me to show more interested, I said I looked up in the bible (something she strongly believes in) what is mentioned about marriages and infidelity. She went crazy, and yelled for a couple minutes “don’t bring God into this…etc”

Man, you are really grabbing for straws, trying to guilt her back. You said she was very religious. So was I, believe it or not. My H pulled the same stunt with me, and I reacted just like your W. She sees you preaching to her, and it does not work!! Don't you think she knows what it has to say about adultery? You are trying to guilt and shame her!

She cares deeply about her image also so I didn’t know if that could be used, at least so people she has been lying about me and the real issue too, which is mostly why im wondering?

Used to do what? There is a right way and a wrong way to DB. Guilt, shame, and punishment does not work. Those things are not attractive in a man, and it will not bring about love in a woman's heart.

Having an A means she has lost respect for you. She doesn't desire you. She must respect you as a man, before she can love you. She needs to feel attraction for you, but the things you are wanting to do will not bring about that attraction for her.

Well, i want my wife back because she does mean everything to me and my M and what it stands for has always been important, but i understand what your saying and if she is 'shamed' back, she would always be resentful most likely? Thinking of this more, i can see how since she tends to run, like now, instead of facing the issues and working on them, this plan could backfire because she could just plain run... thanks

you are correct about my 'fear', i would be lying if i said i am not terrified of everything happening right now. i saw in your other 'newbie' thread and i def match the part of how i feel very 'i cant do anything right', or the 'damned if you do, damned if you dont'. Its like when she wants to leave to go home and i now know where she is going, should i stop her or just let her go, knowing where she is going? following the DB approach, i should just let her go... but how can that be rationalized and not considered enabling?

i see what you are saying about the guilt and i guess i didn't see how much i was doing that. that you for letting me know that is how i am being viewed.

and you are right she has lost respect and and clearly doesn't act attracted to me anymore. I guess thats why i was so worried about why i should put a stop to the A. To make it clear, i have been DBing with myself and i think she has noticed as i have heard she 'loves' the things im doing to the house etc... so i guess thats a positive. I have returned to working out, doing chores and working on house projects. I have recently starting to reconnect with my friends too as i know i need there support through this and they all already knew something was up... to further db though, it sounds like from what your saying im still too attached and pursuing/begging by way of guilt and i need to stop that. I guess for now i will try and look the other way this weekend regardless of how i feel. i will try my best to hide it and just stay busy with the house/yard

i have noticed if im quite, like last night after i saw the true evidence of the A, she does act very nice and start talking and questioning like "is everything ok" or why are you just staring at the tv and not talking, or you didn't come see me when i came in the door (last night). She almost looks upset when i do this and i can see the concern grow, so is that why i need to keep trying to force from her? make that feeling of her grow more? or is that also just a game and it basically means nothing...

i have also stopped cuddling her at night after i mistakenly smothered her, and after the 2 weeks of no touching and back to me, i noticed last night that the last 3 nights she has gone to sleep facing me and scooting closer and i can see her staring at my lack of movement out of the corner of my eye...

thank you for your help so far, its nice to know im not alone and while slim, its possible to come back from this disaster. She is currently getting groceries, getting dinner and renting a movie for us. Even with the A she still acts so normal with day to day stuff, im so confused how she can do this...?

[Nettles]

Hey Angels,

I'm sorry you are in this situation. You have already attracted some heavy hitters to your thread, so heed their advice.

I was wondering if you've had a chance to read UpperCut's 3 threads in Infidelity/Extramarital Affairs/Jealousy? Here are the links:

1) http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2496690&page=all

2) http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2509227&page=all

3) http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2528952#Post2528952

The thing that strikes me about UC's thread is the level-headedness UC demonstrates through the process. He really is at his center for all his interactions with his W. I encourage you to read through it and envision yourself having that centeredness in dealing with your W.

I also love the advice given, in particular by Starsky309. Please look at it and envision yourself saying similar things when he advises UC on how to react to W's actions and words. Centered. Focused. Planned.

Unfortunately, UC hasn't achieved his goal yet. And that happens sometimes. But did UC give his best effort and do things that gave him the best chance at achieving his goal? I think so.

I hope you achieve your goals Angels. I'll be praying for you.

[Cristy]

Hi Angels,

I am sorry for the situation you are in. The best advice I can give you is to speak with a Divorce Busting Coach today.

You have a lot a of questions regarding if you should confront your wife with what you know or not. You need to be very careful with how you proceed from this point forward.

Divorce Busting coaches will give you the best guidance on how to save your marriage and get things moving in a more positive direction. Please call me to discuss our coaching program 303-444-7004.

Cristy
Resource Coordinator
The Divorce Busting Center
303-444-7004

[Matt777]

Should i tell her to leave?

1. What do you want?

I feel like ive been a doormat to much and now she is just taking advantage,

2. If you feel like a doormat, then there's a good chance you've filled the position. A WW will take advantage, even of the toughest guys. That is how she thinks and operates.

i am falling apart and just trying to hold myself togather.

3. Then don't confront yet. Don't discuss anything with her until you can control your own emotions.

should i expose to everyone and let everyone know i still want to work on my M.

4. I don't think you are ready for any moves such as that. You are desperate and wanting to do something to shock sense into her. However, you likely will kick it into higher gear if you go at this unprepared.

1. i would have even more pain because at least when she is here, i know where she is so my mind can calm down and not be dreading.

Hi Angels - Im so sorry youre here, but youve gotten a ton of great advice already. After reading all of it, this one line here really struck me.

Worrying about this right now is like closing the barn door after the horse has already run away. Your wife has already said she wants a divorce and is in the throes of an affair. What difference does it make if you know where she is? Are you going to follow her around the rest of your life to make sure she doesnt see OM again? The more you push and cling, and hang on, the more she is going to try to sneak around.

Heres another analogy; if youre walking along, and something grabs onto your leg, you are going to try to shake it off, right? What if it won't let go? You shake harder, right? This is what your wife is trying to do! Youve been laying it on so thick and clinging so tightly, that its making her shake harder so that you can get the idea to LET GO.

Look, everyone here is here because at one time or another, they were just where you are now: in complete love with a spouse that wants to leave them. Im not sure how much you have read the DR/DB books, but the next step is to STOP PURSUING them. Everything you have tried so far hasnt worked - the extra affection, the trips, the cleaning, the cooking, etc...Now, it's time to do the opposite.

Leave. Her. Alone.

There are so many threads on detachment, that I wont try to rehash in a sentence or two. But you need to find your own way, so that you can LIVE YOUR LIFE for you. Your wife has already fired you. You cannot "nice" her back to your marriage. You cannot shame or punish her back to your marriage. The only way to get her back is to get her interested in you as a man and partner again. And the only way to do that is to turn yourself into that man.

So read and re-read the homework threads. It's time to detach. it's time to get your own life. It's a hard road, it's a lot of work, but it's worth it, because you deserve it. You dont deserve to be somebody's plan B.

[MrBond]

Have you bought the books yet?

[Angels]

Have you bought the books yet?

In the process...

[Angels]

Thanks for the help guys, especially Sandi! I hope you will continue to follow this thread and i will update when i get a chance as how things are going. I am trying to apply what you are all saying even if it seems so backwards to me right now. I am trying to keep conversations very short though and only try not to be rude basically, and answer when asked. Im trying to stay busy around the house and stuff so im not just 'sitting in front of the tv' or anything like before, unless she does. We watch a lot of movies together, so im not sure if i should try and stop that, or when she offers, just say sure and go along as we always have? also i wanted and offered to go to the movies this weekend, which is nothing out of the normal, should i be stopping that as well?

i can tell the big struggle Sandi helped me see, is as much as I lie to myself, im still too emotional. i have to fight crying off still when i concentrate to much on us, and i am not a 'cryer'. I am better about hiding it though, i do not let her see me, i just walk out of the room composed and go to the bathroom or outside with the dog. She has cuaght me 'glaring' as she put it since she doesn't know i know, and i just said i was just looking at you playing on your phone in the corner and walked away. I just keep envisioning her and the OM and the messages/emails i read. My question is, what do i do when she wants to get intimate? Im very sexual so starving myself hurts as it is, but im not sure i can look at her the same right now since i 100% saw the proof she slept with OM, and so recently. We have not been intimate since then. She's talking about hanging out with her BFF again soon, who is against us now, so im sure thats another ploy to go see him... is getting intimate a bad thing? or should i just ensure i do no be the one to initiate it?

I have seen the texts previously where her friend and her mock my 'stupidity' thinking they are pulling something over me when she saw the OM, which is why i was wondering if i should call her out on it with the evidence or not. For now, i am listen and trusting you all while i sit back...

as some more background to help with my sitch also, as i stated before, i have apologized for my neglectfulness and essentially taking her for granted that helped start the issue of her not trying. she had accepted it months ago and seemed sincere, but obviously she is still holding a grudge and not working on things, especially now that she deeply in the A. Anyways, what got my attention was when i was being ignored, I realize today, she was GAL and thats what got me to come back. This was when i said I came back on way to strong. Before that, she had tried to get my attention and i was too stupid to see it, which i discovered myself by 'replying' our convo's in my head, reading old texts, etc... im so mad at myself for missing these signs. Anyways, she still is working, hanging out with the girls alot (i know she is with them), working out, so my real question is, if she is still GAL, should i be also? What if we are both GAL? She certainly is, so i want to make sure this doesn't change anything with how i should be applying the DB's?

thanks you all so far for reading, helping!