busted affair again!

[newman7977]

Newman,
Good job with spending time with your kids. I to have admitt I have the same questions about detaching and waiting to make that first move. You want to make that first move but scared to try b/c of the possible outcome. If you detach will that send a signal that you don't care about your S? Will H or W who are WAS position decide that moving out is what we want also b/c we have detached?? So many questions and emotions-DM

Dman,

Thanks good to hear from you. You got to update us on your sitch.

I know what you mean about detaching. I think that's what it is to send them a signal, but not necessarily that you don't care but the signal to let them know you'll be alright with or without the WAS. And for them NOT to think that you don't care is by being polite and cordial. To me is to get them confuse that if one foot is out the door and they see you strong and withstanding the sitch, this will make them think twice leaving LBS. That's why I'm trying to be strong. It bugs the hell out of me that she's not wearing her ring, but in front of her I'm fine and had not mention about it since I did 2 weeks ago. So things like that IMO is detaching, you don't let their actions bring you down. The best way I'm practicing this is treating w like a co-worker.

I've been actually paying attention to myself lately, how I talk and interact with co workers and I apply the same to w. Theres a lot of respect but at the same time their actions doesnt affect me. After all she's the one that told me she only sees me as a friend and nothing else. So I'm respecting that and will treat her that until her feelings come back.

Anyway, I rather detach than be attach in this sitch, when you're attach you beg, pursue, say ILY. All those things didn't work, heck I hated myself doing that because all I received was cold shoulders and it hurt like hell. At one point I even cried and followed her like a puppy dog around the house. She would watch tv and I would be there in the room every commercial break I bring up sitch, I cuddle and beg her to cuddle me back--I was pathetic! I was suffocating her (don't worry guys this was last year). Yes I did all that because I was attached. That's when I decided something's gotta changed, I surf the net and I tumble across this forum and bought the DB books.

DM, I have the same fears as you such as what if WAS think we dont care about them or since we detach they need to move out, but to me I rather have those fears than lose self respect such as begging, pursung etc.

...I'm not saying I'm totally detach now but I'm definitely not that attach like I use to. I still need a lot of detaching though, because there are days that I react pretty bad. And that this sitch is far from being fix, and therefore W can potentially still can hurt my feelings.

Dang detaching is hard--lol.

Newman

[newman7977]

One other thing, IMO the 180s will compliment detaching. So WAS feel you don't care anymore but at the same time you've changed for the bettet (doing 180s). So then not only you look strong (detached) and now you're also a better man (180s).

Then GAL helps to cope, since this is a long process. GAL will basically keep you busy from obsessing with the sitch and will keep your sanity.

So this is what I tell myself daily to cope, this is what I've learned so far from this forum and DB, I just got to put it into practice.

Newman

[25yearsmlc]

Newman

a lot that makes sense. Here's a short post on detachment, I find helpful. There are amny more around here.

"This was originally posted by Peanut.
============
II. Detachment

Detachment is critical to the process of altering and repairing a relationship. Attached, we take personally all that is said, not said, done and not done.

Our ego gets wounded and we are more inclined to those actions that will undermine our very best chances of accomplishing our goals.

We can not control the actions of another. We are, however, responsible for our own actions. We are responsible for our own happiness.

If we are detached from the actions of another, we can meet anger or indifference with love. Met with love we are in a position to diffuse the situation and transform it in a way that will be in alignment with our goals.

On the flipside, detachment allows us to play it cool when we do get a positive reaction from our spouse. It is a way to break the distance/pursuer cycle.

Detachment is not withdrawal. It is not the mind saying, ‘I am not getting what I want so I must pull back.’

It is the natural acceptance that I am alone responsible for how I act. I can not control another person, but I can control how I respond to them."

[newman7977]

I like that post 25...copying that and save on my phone as notes.

Newman

[newman7977]

But stop showing her your neediness. IT is not attractive

25yrsmlc, am I still showing neediness? I thought I haven't been needy for a while at least since the last time I meltdown about two weeks ago.

Thanks
Newman

[25yearsmlc]

I don't know if you are SHOWING it but you are radiating it here...it's safe to do that here --

but know that if you keep focussing on how much you miss her touch, and wish you could just reach out to her, and yada yada,

it might keep you stuck there in your unmet needs

AND That often shows.

I believe where the head goes, the heart will follow, if we let it.

KNOW your plan and why you are implementing it and then stick to it.

WHEN Will she believe in your changes?

small consistent changes + sufficient time = change she can believe in.


You will backslide but the thing is to see it and learn from it and then get back on the horse so the backslides come less often and are smaller too...

If what you recall are good memories of close times, then trust that she'll eventually have those memories resurfacing in her heart too,

unless you chase them away by making her defend her choices.

Let her figure HER part out - while YOU do your own stuff.

[newman7977]

Oh shoot good call. I was only radiating here, but unconsciously I was starting to focus on missing her, touching etc...& you're absolutely right it was starting to show. Last night while she was asleep I almost tried to cuddle with her because of these feelings. But I didn't.

I have to stray away from these feelings and focus on something else. I'm glad I ask because I wasn't seeing it coming. Thanks 25.

25, what do you think about my goal trying to win her emotions back? And my plan to get that goal is to have small talk with her about our kids and how her day at work, I believe this is how I can be close to her feelings again. Do you think this is being needy/pursuing? I'm watching it though, so far she seem receptive by me asking and she's actually volunteering to talk. But anything I'm missing here?

Newman

[newman7977]

Journal:

Yesterday, like any other weekends started extra focus on 180s, GAL, & detachment. Weekends are normally tougher to focus on these things because I'm with w pretty much all day.

Yesterday sat (9/28) rode my bike in the morning. We then went to funeral service. At this service, I kept my 180s by being independent. I usually follow my W's lead in any gathering but this time I was a big boy. I didn't follow her around if I didn't like to. I don't know how to explain this but at one point s13 and I ended up in a good spot (sorry didn't mean to be insensitive abou the funeral) but a good spot where I can hear the grieving H's speech. Before you know it here comes my W standing next to me, in a few more occasions my w was following me around. I say this because I feel good and for once I can make my decision--maybe I'm finally detaching?

In the afternoon I got some tickets to watch a live show, again I didn't think W would go but I did ask her once if she wanted to go and she said yes, so we all went. The show was suited for kids even for s3's age. Kids had fun and W also enjoyed the show.

We went to dinner after that--a few observations from W, pretty much all day that I would noticed she would be blanked out then try to brush it off. I think what's happening is the withdrawal from OM. It sux but what can I do? Nothing right, so every time I noticed her like that I focused more on the kids and totally just ignored her swings (I just kept thinking Newman don't let this bring you down). We got home and had a positive day overall. No R talk, no pursuit, and I really tried to detach.

Today sun (9/30): another good day, nothing really extraordinary other than consistent 180s. It was FILs bday so we took him out to eat lunch. We had a good time, s3 pretty much kept me busy, this is actually the first time in a long time my W had a peaceful lunch since s3 was just all over me. Sometimes I feel bad that my w might feel left out because s3 kept looking for me. I think I have to watch this because I don't want my w to feel left out with the kids. Is there such a thing of overdoing my 180s wih the kids? But this is really what I feel, especially knowing that my future my mean I'll only see them 50% of the time...this 180 is sincere.

I'm trying to break that wall to get to my W's emotion back (one of my goals) I think I have the recipe to slowly chip that away (by keeping the light talks with W, her work, kids). Please point it out to me if this is some kind of pursuing.

I want to get some of her emotions back before OM tries to contact her. As far as i know, Its almost a month since the last contact with OM. if it is I suspect OM is getting desperate and will try to lure my w again. It is really up to her how she would handle this. I honestly feel that she would be a fool to choose OM. And I'm hoping some of our positives will be enough to deflect OMs advances.

Anyway,I feel better, I feel good, my kids reciprocate my love. In some ways I feel complete and of course the pain of the sitch is still there but neverthe less i feel better. I hope these feelings doesn't dip down, the good thing is that I have control to handle these feelings.

Oh one more thing, for the first time since the bomb, my w actually hit me on my shoulders while we attended back to school night at s13's school last week. I was kidding around with her didn't even remember what it was but out of her laughter she hit me...that remind me back in the days when we were dating. I think I can claim this as an action base on emotion. I'll take it as a small response from my work in a month lol. Geez one month, and a hit on the shoulders...there's a LOT of work to do. But it's ok as long as I see little improvements it's worth it.

Newman

[25yearsmlc]

I sent you a long post but my power outtage must have killed it.

I can recall saying this, What's the problem NOW? Your wife is trying, per YOU and you can see the efforts she is making. That's what YOU said.

She is doing no contact w/OM and SHE is making loving gestures.
So all that is missing is sex for a few weeks? Is that it?

Do you know how lonely your w has been in the marriage, for years?

Don't forget that. SHE has a lot of forgiving to do and I'm not sure she knows that yet. She probably has trouble expressing anger so she converts it into letting love die out...

So the problem seems to be, to me, your wounded ego and constant obsessing about OM, instead of working on you.

What self improvements are YOU working on?

Why not monitor YOUR OWN growth and ability to stay on target,

instead of what you get From her? What exactly are your 180s? Be specific.

The more specific you are the easier it;ll be for you to know if you are on target.

[25yearsmlc]

Journal:

Yesterday, like any other weekends started extra focus on 180s, GAL, & detachment. Weekends are normally tougher to focus on these things because I'm with w pretty much all day.

Why don't you GAL with a child of yours? Get away from w and give her a break and give her some space AND let her see your child return with a happy smile.

Yesterday sat (9/28) rode my bike in the morning. We then went to funeral service. At this service, I kept my 180s by being independent.
I usually follow my W's lead in any gathering but this time I was a big boy. I didn't follow her around if I didn't like to.


this^^^ change is mandatory. The behavior you are describing puts your wife in a Parent mode and that's not healthy or attractive. So I'm glad you see this. Also, did your w need comforting at this funeral? IF SO, it'd be nice if she had a partner she could lean on, instead of another child to care for...


I don't know how to explain this but at one point s13 and I ended up in a good spot (sorry didn't mean to be insensitive abou the funeral) but a good spot where I can hear the grieving H's speech. Before you know it here comes my W standing next to me, in a few more occasions my w was following me around. I say this because I feel good and for once I can make my decision--maybe I'm finally detaching?

Maybe...or you are becoming more aware of how needy it is for you have her handling your social behaviors.

We went to dinner after that--a few observations from W, pretty much all day that I would noticed she would be blanked out then try to brush it off. I think what's happening is the withdrawal from OM. It sux but what can I do?

Stop mind reading. Really, just focus on YOUR WORK ON YOU b/c it's the only thing you can control and from your description, you have some work to do.



Today sun (9/30): another good day, nothing really extraordinary other than consistent 180s. It was FILs bday so we took him out to eat lunch. We had a good time, s3 pretty much kept me busy, this is actually the first time in a long time my W had a peaceful lunch since s3 was just all over me. Sometimes I feel bad that my w might feel left out because s3 kept looking for me. I think I have to watch this because I don't want my w to feel left out with the kids. Is there such a thing of overdoing my 180s wih the kids?

NO there's not an overdoing being with your kids, in this^^^ context. Your wife got a break so she could have a nice lunch. That's a good thing, period.

Her feeling left out is NOT YOUR problem - AND it's your mind reading so it's likely not even true AND even if it were, so what?

You are doing way too much mind reading. Just stop it.

Focus on your work on you...I cannot stress that enough. YOU WASTE time and energy by not looking in the mirror for what to work on...


But this is really what I feel, especially knowing that my future my mean I'll only see them 50% of the time...this 180 is sincere.


Stop letting your fears and projections about tomorrow, decide your life's happiness TODAY.

You are creating a lot of the chaos in your life right now.

Your wife said she wants to make it work.

Your wife apologized for an EA/possible PA and has ended it.

Your wife has made several loving gestures to you.

YOU keep obesssing about OM and "what if?" and letting your wounded ego make YOU feel bad...and then staring at your w and mind reading, almost ALL of which is negative...

so, who is damaging the family NOW?

You are...

I think you telling her sibling about the EA was a huge mistake and it got you nowhere. In fact you're surprised they did not tell the rest of the family but to me

they're smart. They were able to see that the more people who know, the harder it is for your w to believe YOU can get past this. If you want to keep the road home, paved and smooth...then STHU.

Your inlaws may resent you for trying make her look bad and you must realize that making her look bad, OR TRYING TO,

does not make you look good. Don't forget, your d, and your inlaws witnessed the marriage and in some eyes, you don't look so great.

So keep the marital issues IN the marriage. Don't be the obstacle to reconciliation. Back off and show her loving detachment.

And you might even apologize for what your flaws are instead of harping on what SHE did and what SHE MIGHT do...

b/c if she doesn't think you can get past this, what's the point of her trying?


I'm trying to break that wall to get to my W's emotion back (one of my goals) I think I have the recipe to slowly chip that away (by keeping the light talks with W, her work, kids). Please point it out to me if this is some kind of pursuing.

It's both pursuit and manipulation. Why not focus on how to be a better h and dad? Let her learn to relax around you and NOT with expectations on your end.

Build on the times where no conflict arises, then keep things warm and light. Then build on relaxing around each other. Rent comedies, or go to one. Who said you can't take her out to something as long as it's not overtly romantic?

Laugh together. It is a bonding experience and as long as you don't stare at her to take the R temperature, she can learn to have FUN with you around

and not think she has to be intimate later on.

Can you just give her love, and not feel (or show) disappointment when you don't get sex in return? Can you Focus on giving, without getting?


I want to get some of her emotions back before OM tries to contact her. As far as i know, Its almost a month since the last contact with OM. if it is I suspect OM is getting desperate and will try to lure my w again. It is really up to her how she would handle this. I honestly feel that she would be a fool to choose OM. And I'm hoping some of our positives will be enough to deflect OMs advances.

^^^this is all about you manipulating to control the outcome. ALL this energy could be spent on YOU building bonding experiences but instead you worry about the outcome...ie what you will get and when.

Do you understand what I mean here?

Ironically, you need to work on controlling how controlling you are.


Anyway,I feel better, I feel good, my kids reciprocate my love. In some ways I feel complete and of course the pain of the sitch is still there but neverthe less i feel better.

Why wouldn't you feel "Complete"? If you think you "need" your w to feel complete, you ought to discuss that with an IC.

There's no shame in that. But clearly your self esteem is far too attached to what you think she thinks...and that's giving someone else too much power AND it's also an abdication of your own responsibilities.

You control your happiness and you ought to be in charge of how you socially interact instead of hoping your w can lead you.

This is sexist but IMO, the truth is, few women want to parent their h's.

MOSTLY, We don't want to lead. We want to partner with our h's or be lead by them, although always lovingly.


I hope these feelings doesn't dip down, the good thing is that I have control to handle these feelings.

Yes you can control these feelings so you don't have to "hope" they don't dip down, etc. Take charge of your life and that will begin with emotional control of your own behavior.

Oh one more thing, for the first time since the bomb, my w actually hit me on my shoulders while we attended back to school night at s13's school last week. I was kidding around with her didn't even remember what it was but out of her laughter she hit me...that remind me back in the days when we were dating. I think I can claim this as an action base on emotion. I'll take it as a small response from my work in a month lol.

Geez one month, and a hit on the shoulders...there's a LOT of work to do. But it's ok as long as I see little improvements it's worth it.

Newman

How long do you think she felt alone in the m? How long were her needs unmet? I think you know It was more than one month.

And let me ask you this question...it's a tough one but really try to be honest...

are you sure you want to reconcile, or are you just not wanting to lose to OM?

I mean, let's be brutally honest for one minute.

You admit that your w DID tell you she was not happy many times. You did not change.


So, why did it take OM to get you to wake up and take it seriously

(AND play the victim??) Even now, I'm not sure what positive behaviors you are doing as a h to counter her negative images. I know you are now paying attention to the children more, but as a man, as a partner , how are you showing her that marriage to you can be better and different?

IOW

Do you want HER back or do you just want to "win"?