W is angrier after my 180's - time + consistency

[2thepoint]

Ugh! What a disaster! So says my SIL in a text yesterday when she asked how I was doing. "Getting things in order as I prepare to tell the kids and then move out."

I've arranged for a temporary place to stay till the apt is ready.

We will probably tell the kids tonight or tomorrow just in time for W's 49th b-day. Surprise! As a gift to herself, Mom has decided to walk away from her 21 year relationship with your father. Now let's blow out the candles and eat some cake, shall we?

Confirmed more of the EA/A today. Quite by accident but now with some pics/vid evidence, there is NO DOUBT!

I truely believe W is conflicted and probaby extremely guilt ridden as she should be but does she think I won't forgive her? Can she forgive herself?

As suggested I will be seeking the counsel of a L next week. Not because I intend to beat W to the punch and file, but because I need to understand rights and responsibilities.

I intend to continue my DB efforts but also want to make the path home paved and smooth. As I tell people about our separation (theres no getting around this) I will be careful to not share intimate details so as to keep the path clear.

But how do I signal top my W that she can come back, that it is not too late, that there is hope for us?

God, what a mess!

[25yearsmlc]

Ugh! What a disaster! So says my SIL in a text yesterday when she asked how I was doing. "Getting things in order as I prepare to tell the kids and then move out."

I've arranged for a temporary place to stay till the apt is ready.

We will probably tell the kids tonight or tomorrow just in time for W's 49th b-day. Surprise! As a gift to herself, Mom has decided to walk away from her 21 year relationship with your father. Now let's blow out the candles and eat some cake, shall we?

Confirmed more of the EA/A today. Quite by accident but now with some pics/vid evidence, there is NO DOUBT!

I truely believe W is conflicted and probaby extremely guilt ridden as she should be but does she think I won't forgive her? Can she forgive herself?


you are mind reading & Projecting big time here. No need for that. seriously. Stop it.

As suggested I will be seeking the counsel of a L next week. Not because I intend to beat W to the punch and file, but because I need to understand rights and responsibilities.

obviously you do not have to "DO" anything. Just get information. Knowledge is power.


I intend to continue my DB efforts but also want to make the path home paved and smooth.

they ^^^are the same thing in this case.


As I tell people about our separation (theres no getting around this) I will be careful to not share intimate details so as to keep the path clear.

good. Thank GOD. It also protects you in ways you don't know yet, and it helps your kids for now. They WILL learn later on what really happened, but don't let it come from your lips.


But how do I signal top my W that she can come back, that it is not too late, that there is hope for us?

You say nothing.

YOU become a man only a fool would leave. You remain upbeat and positive about YOUR NEW LIFE b/c you know right around the corner are good things waiting for you...and you trust that.

You know your changes are real and that you are a better man for all this. Therefore of course good things are coming your way and you are creating them.

And you keep working on the changes you are making for you AND so if she looks your way

she will know the changes are real AND LASTING...

b/c at this point, the WAW tells herself that:

1) your changes are not real

2) if they seem real, then they are merely tactics that will cease and revert the minute you feel secure in the r again

3) if you keep the changes going and they seem real and lasting, then she DOES have a conflict. So she tells herself that it's "too late for you two"...

and the only thing that fights that logic is TIME with the new you being the new you.

DO not confuse this w/needing to be around her soon or a lot.

At first I'd have as little direct contact w/her as possible. It makes your changes easier to make b/c you are not constantly monitoring her to see if she notices your changes, which reeks of control and manipulation.

So to avoid that mistake, stay away for awhile. Not from the kids, but her.

Let others tell her what a mistake she is making, not you.

SHOWS those others you are a new man and that you now see, "that if you could do it all over again, you would do a lot of things differently."

God, what a mess!

relax, get information, expect no decision to change soon.

In time if she wants back in, she'll send out signals and we can address those then.

Trust me on this. She thinks you are there wanting a reconciliatoin b/c you make it obvious. She knows you are waiting around.

Unless you blow it by losing your temper, she will count on you as her back up plan.

((If you lose your temper she'll tell herself that you'll throw things in her face the rest of her life, and there's no point in her trying again and it will likely be over. So be calm and leave the house if your temper is going to control you.))


As you GAL and she sees that you are indeed a new man, a good dad, and that some OW is possibly going to benefit by that....and her new life isn't so great...

THEN she'll rethink things...

[bustorama]

25 speaks the truth.

You don't want to send signals that the path is clear. Anything you do in that regard is pursuit and only further devalues you in W's eyes ("Oh God, I don't want to be with him, doesn't he get it."). And, most importantly, it's not what she wants right now. Give her what she says she wants -- space, space, space, a world without H. It will speed up her seeing whether it's REALLY what she wants, especially as you better yourself in comparison. Set some goals for yourself and your time with the boys for the next month.

It seems counter-intuitive, but the more you ACCEPT her choice to pull away from you and that YOU distance and emotionally detach YOURSELF from her, and get your own life and mojo back in order (amicably/self-assuredly/confidently/swaggeringly), the better off you will be.

[bustorama]

BTW, re: the new EA/A evidence, has it changed your view in any way re: exposing or saying to W that you are not OK with it? Sometimes recognizing the depth/intensity of the EA/A attachment motivates the LBS to take steps to disrupt it.

[25yearsmlc]

BTW, re: the new EA/A evidence, has it changed your view in any way re: exposing or saying to W that you are not OK with it? Sometimes recognizing the depth/intensity of the EA/A attachment motivates the LBS to take steps to disrupt it.

you think his wife believes he's okay with it? She knows he knows.

Or you just think his telling others about it, will somehow make her feel all better and return to him, OR all bad and return to him hanging her head in shame? Guilt won't get her to stay.

Please Read up on how exposure like that (to 3rd parties) has consistently failed, miserably. To my knowledge, telling others has never worked on this site. It backfires and makes the LBSer look punitive and vindictive.

She has NOT had time to process this decision or its' impact...So please, do a course of action for enough time before discarding it, and risking everything.


Buster, How did it work for you?

[25yearsmlc]

25 speaks the truth.

You don't want to send signals that the path is clear. Anything you do in that regard is pursuit and only further devalues you in W's eyes ("Oh God, I don't want to be with him, doesn't he get it."). And, most importantly, it's not what she wants right now. Give her what she says she wants -- space, space, space, a world without H. It will speed up her seeing whether it's REALLY what she wants, especially as you better yourself in comparison. Set some goals for yourself and your time with the boys for the next month.

It seems counter-intuitive, but the more you ACCEPT her choice to pull away from you and that YOU distance and emotionally detach YOURSELF from her, and get your own life and mojo back in order (amicably/self-assuredly/confidently/swaggeringly), the better off you will be.

this I agree with. But the exposure does NOT help and is one of those things we veterans say, "Beware" of...

imo, we don't know what will MAKE his wife come back OR IF there's a way.

But we tend to know things that won't work or make things worse.

To me, your idea, IF I understand it, is to tell others.

And that my friend, will NOT HELP HIM...it will hurt his cause, and I say that with utter certainty.

[2thepoint]

Trust me on this. She thinks you are there wanting a reconciliatoin b/c you make it obvious. She knows you are waiting around.

I don't think I make it too obvious. I've made a concerted effort to avoid pursuit but she does know that I want a reconciliation or at least I don't want a D.

Unless you blow it by losing your temper, she will count on you as her back up plan.

((If you lose your temper she'll tell herself that you'll throw things in her face the rest of her life, and there's no point in her trying again and it will likely be over. So be calm and leave the house if your temper is going to control you.))

Good advice! Fortunately, I have a pretty long fuse and it hasn't blown yet. I'm wounded to my core but I have not gotten visibly angry. Hurt, yes. Angry no.

BTW, re: the new EA/A evidence, has it changed your view in any way re: exposing or saying to W that you are not OK with it?

No, I don't think so. I've been very deliberate about not saying anything about this, particularly to my brother-in-law when he was completely baffled by my W's behavior ("what could possibly be driving her to do this?" "I don't know. I guess she got tired of my controlling ways and couldn't take it anymore"). Both my IC and DB coach have commended me for restraining myself in this regard. It has been very hard though, don't get me wrong. There are times when this news would have come in quite handy when having to defend my actions with others and my W, but I've just bite my tongue.

So we didn't tell the boys today. Got caught up in sporting activities and actually just got home. BTW W joined us for S13's soccer game, (brought S9 and his friend). Then when the game was over and everyone on the team and their parents were going to enjoy BBQ , W bows out in favor of shopping and leaves me with S9 and his friend. This was pretty selfish behavior on her part if you ask me. But I just roll with the punches and we all have a good time.

I think tomorrow is going to be D-day on W's B-day, (oh what irony!). I suspect we'll wait till later in the day to break the news to the kids. W's sister already has stated that she doesn't think W will be able to do this, and I tend to agree. I think she'll fall apart and I'll be the one to have to break the news and then pick up the pieces.

Ugh!

[sandi2]

I truely believe W is conflicted and probaby extremely guilt ridden as she should be but does she think I won't forgive her? Can she forgive herself?

I may repeat myself here, b/c I have read this same statement from other LBH's many times. Yes, I'm sure your WAW is feeling all sorts of conflicted emotions. But here's the truth about her thoughts on anyone forgiving her: It does not stop her from proceeding with her goal of pushing her H & M out, and continuing with her A/OM and how it is for the best. (Mostly, her "best") These feelings push out any rational thinking on her part. The LBH needs to stop expecting or wondering about that.

Does she think you won't forgive her. Can she forgive herself. Again, this is a question only the LBH seems to be concerned with during the time she's gunho in pushing him out. She's not thinking about forgiveness from you or herself......not now. Can you realize that? I think, based on my own experience, it is part of the messed up chemical induced fog that effects anything rational. You forgiving her.....is not her concern. I didn't care if my H forgave me or not, when I was in an EA. And she's not thinking about forgiving herself b/c she thinks this her last chance at true happiness and she would not forgive herself if she didn't pursue it. Why would she forgive herself when she believes she's doing the right thing?

[bustorama]

BTW, re: the new EA/A evidence, has it changed your view in any way re: exposing or saying to W that you are not OK with it? Sometimes recognizing the depth/intensity of the EA/A attachment motivates the LBS to take steps to disrupt it.

you think his wife believes he's okay with it? She knows he knows.

What is the evidence that she knows he knows?

Or you just think his telling others about it, will somehow make her feel all better and return to him

I think we have a misunderstanding. I didn't say anything about exposing to (uninvolved) 3rd parties. I was referring to exposing TO W that H knew what was up. Sometimes, if the OM is married, exposing to W of OM also can have an effect.

I also didn't ask 2point to do do anything. I asked him if seeing the new evidence had changed his view on things, because seeing firsthand, confirmatory evidence of an EA/A can be a powerful emotional experience.

Re: arguments of authority ('we veterans'), I think there are honest differences of opinion by experienced people on how to handle EA/A's. Sometimes, intervention immediately disrupts the EA/A, sometimes it drives the EA/A underground or intensifies/justifies the EA/A.

She has NOT had time to process this decision or its' impact...

I think I differ with you here. The question as I see it is whether 2point is ok or not ok with telling his W he knows she is having an EA. Her recognizing the impact/consequences of her choices does not happen in a vacuum. Her H's reactions to her choices is one of the potential consequences. Based on his message, he is still OK with not telling her.

Buster, How did it work for you?

When my W exposed to me that she knew I was having an EA and confronted the OM of W with same information, the EA stopped.

I have seen cases where the opposite happened as well.

[gunny]

Hello 2,
Just checking in, hope things are okay in your neck of the woods.