PLEASE!!! Need help quick! Calling all vets!

[AntoniaB]

Tad, I don't even think that what you saw was her passing for normal. Think about it. Isn't "normal" a loving wife who doesn't want a divorce? What you saw was the same divorce-seeking woman who just had her temper under control for a bit. That's all.

I think you have a tendency to romanticize or idealize interactions with her, in that if she is simply cordial and makes basic small talk, that it is so different from the times that she's spewing, that you suddenly see her as showing some desire NOT to go through with the divorce and, by extension, this must mean she's leaning towards coming back. It's such a leap for you to make, but you make it every time--suddenly she looks good to you again, and suddenly you're wanting to talk about your relationship with her, and really, you don't have a relationship much at all right now.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I watched my XH go from mean to even kind, but he followed through with every bit of the divorce. Just because they learn to play nice sometimes doesn't mean they are ready to talk about the relationship or showing any sign of coming back. She has so much to go through and to learn before she can ever be an equal partner in a relationship with you.

[tadpole1025]

Thank you everyone. Sometimes I feel like such a fool for the way I feel and how I can get sucked in just because she seems to be her normal self every once in a while. Today has been kind of a downer too and I'm not sure why. Most of my friends had plans and I didn't do much of anything. I know that I have traveled a long way, but I just hate the setbacks that I have. I am almost 1 year post bomb and although it is easier, I still hurt like Hell.

just so I know I'm not confusing you with someone else, this is the same woman w/the crazy texting to you recently? Where she got mad about a gf from 6th grade? Don't forget that. I don't say that so you'll "hold onto your anger" but I do want you to hold onto reality and not get amnesia b/c she looks good and acted normal for 24 hours.

You're right 25. This is the same woman with the crazy texts. I need to remember that. However since then, she has also sent a text apologizing for hurting me. ???

Can we NOT discuss what you think she thinks about whether she notices your changes....???

Yeah.

You wanted her to delay the divorce stuff or you dreaded her doing it? I'm confused...

Delay the divorce. I asked her for a delay over a month ago and she told me that I wasn't "entitled" to ask for a delay. I haven't mentioned it since.

Tad, get a helmet on and screw it on straight. THINK THIS OUT...

are you telling us that if your wife --who was batchit crazy less than a month ago, --told you "ILY and Don't want a divorce"...that would be FINE with you??

All would be well??? Man you are not seeing the light here...you are choosing blindness.

It wouldn't be fine. It would be a step, but it would also be a very long road back.

I worry that your biggest problem of fear and conflict avoidance, REMAINS UNCHANGED---

It is better, but I suppose it is still there to a degree. I just am trying to be so careful not to p!ss her off in any way.

instead of pursuing her yet again-

read the text messages you two engaged in and remind yourself of why she's out of the house but your boys are with you...

and remind yourself of how much work you both have to do to have a healthy m again.

When she is ready you will know! She's no wall flower.

I know 25 and thank you. Even though they are harsh sometimes, I really do appreciate your words.

Many MLcers, and my xh did it in spades, do what I call 'Pass for normal' periodically. It is disorienting, because they seem a little like their old selves, and you suddenly think OMG perhaps it is me after all. The strain of being normal usually seems to provoke them to new heights of craziness shortly thereafter, so hold on to your seat on this one.

Exactly Beatrice! "Perhaps it is me afterall" is exactly what I think fairly often.

you seem like an awfully nice man, but could use a little more work.

Thank you.

Tad, really? Do you like getting hit with 2 X 4s? How many different ways can we keep saying the same thing to you? You've been at this long enough now that you know better than to even think about doing this, much less asking about it.

You're right Seeking. It was a weak moment when I saw the "old" or "normal" W for a little while. Like 25 said, I need to go back and read the crazy texts.

Can I ask if you have a boundary that if your W goes through with the D that that's it for you? That you will stop standing? That's OK if it is, your choice. There are MLCer's that have to have a D to complete their journey.

To be honest, I REALLY DON'T KNOW. I've got some thinking to do I guess. I've also been so afraid of moving on and then breaking her heart if she wants to start over someday. I DO NOT want to hurt her.

What's new with you? You've been at your job for a while now. How's that going? What have you been doing to GAL? How are your boys doing, aside from their R with their Mom? What kind of activities are they involved in?

Job is going well. I walk an average of 12-15 miles per day. Needless to say, I'm losing my "gut." I've been working a lot. I've gone on a few road trips, but nothing major. I'm still trying to get on my feet financially and find a different place to live. My boys seem to be doing well, but S18 (the one that wants nothing to do with her) told me last night that "I wish she would tell you that she wants to work on things. That would be an amazing Christmas present." Can't disagree with him on that.

Tad, I don't even think that what you saw was her passing for normal. Think about it. Isn't "normal" a loving wife who doesn't want a divorce? What you saw was the same divorce-seeking woman who just had her temper under control for a bit. That's all.

Thank you Antonia. I guess she wasn't "normal" just calm and cool.

I think you have a tendency to romanticize or idealize interactions with her, in that if she is simply cordial and makes basic small talk, that it is so different from the times that she's spewing, that you suddenly see her as showing some desire NOT to go through with the divorce and, by extension, this must mean she's leaning towards coming back. It's such a leap for you to make, but you make it every time--suddenly she looks good to you again, and suddenly you're wanting to talk about your relationship with her, and really, you don't have a relationship much at all right now.

You're right about this too. I guess that I am just looking for some "sign" from her. I guess, like everyone says, I will know when she wants to work on things. Everyone also says that the D will likely happen, but I am dreading it. We are down to 20 days...

She has so much to go through and to learn before she can ever be an equal partner in a relationship with you.

Yes she does....as do I.

Just something funny to share:

S16 told me that last weekend W said that she doesn't "cuss" at all anymore. 10 minutes later, she was throwing the F-word around like a sailor.

Take care.

Tad

[seeking answers]

I worry that your biggest problem of fear and conflict avoidance, REMAINS UNCHANGED---

It is better, but I suppose it is still there to a degree. I just am trying to be so careful not to p!ss her off in any way.

Tad, I have to tell you that just the LBS breathing is enough to p!ss the MLCer off at times. Remember their anger is directed at the LBS. It doesn't matter what happens, it's the LBS's fault. She could get a hangnail and somehow it will be your fault.

Can I ask why you fear making her angry? You're facing the worst that she can do. Remember that she will portray herself as the victim throughout. What she perceives is her reality.

I know you don't want a D. The best you can do if it gets to that point is to go in there and face it with honor and dignity. Hard stuff, prepare for it ahead of time by going over in your mind how you want to handle yourself.

The D is the legal stamp on what in reality was a dead marriage when your W walked out the door. That said, if you find it your heart to continue standing while moving forward in your life, and you and your wife find your way back to each other, through the trials you've endured and the lessons you've learned you now have the tools in which to build a brand new R with her built on a solid foundation.

Never forget what this has taught you whether it's with her or someone new.

None of this is easy, but I think that what comes easy is not taken as seriously or valued as much. We now know better so we can do better.

Hang in there Tad, better days are coming.

[job]

Tad,
The posters have given you excellent advice. SA is absolutely correct when she says that anything can piss the mlcer off. I can attest to that one very easily. It doesn't necessarily have to be you or what you say or do, it could be someone else will piss her off over something that doesn't mean squat.

You need to live your life and please try not to walk on eggshells. I do not want to sound cruel or harsh, but the day she walked out, your marriage had ended. A divorce decree doesn't necessarily mean it is the end of the world for you and your wife. She needs that piece of paper to feel "free" once again. I know you do not want a divorce, but if it happens, please understand there is always, always the possibility of reconciling down the road, but it will take a very long time for that to happen, if it happens. No one knows what the future holds, i.e., you may meet someone new or you may move away. The same would apply for her as well. Life is a gamble and sometimes God has a way of cleaning house and putting all of us on a different path for what he wants us to accomplish.

Tad, keep the focus on you and what you need to accomplish before the court date.

[AJM]

Conflict avoidance? I don't know that I see that in Tad's posts. I do see fear, but I think that he is in a tough spot in the sense that if he files, he takes control but he does something he doesn't want. If he doesn't, he lives at the end of the rope....

Fear is the thing you need to overcome in my opinion. Your fear seems to be causing you more pain than anything else you or anyone could ever do.

My suggestion? Identify the cause of the fear and deal with it. Rationalize what the fear is really made up of. Be honest about every bit of it. I think you'll find that you are better than fine regardless of the fears you had before coming true.

Overcome that fear. The rest doesn't seem terribly important right now Tad. Once you tame the fear, I think you'll see that.

As for fighting for or against the divorce? I think that will seem very different when you overcome your fears. Take action then.

In the meantime, you cannot stop her from what she is doing. I'm sorry she feels like she needs to do these things, but you are not in control of her feelings. She may not be either. But you are able to identify and address your own fears.

You have nothing to lose, right?


AJ

[tadpole1025]

Thank you Seeking, Snodderly and AJ. I feel really bad tonight. I will explain further below in my update.

Can I ask why you fear making her angry? You're facing the worst that she can do. Remember that she will portray herself as the victim throughout. What she perceives is her reality.

I guess that I just don't want to give her any more ammunition. I hate it when she spews, but you are right, everything is my fault.

A divorce decree doesn't necessarily mean it is the end of the world for you and your wife. She needs that piece of paper to feel "free" once again. I know you do not want a divorce, but if it happens, please understand there is always, always the possibility of reconciling down the road, but it will take a very long time for that to happen, if it happens.

Yes Snodderly, but it is always something that we told ourselves.....we would be together forever and a D just doesn't seem right. Especially that when just over a year ago we were planning on renewing our vows. The wedding dress was already purchased.

Fear is the thing you need to overcome in my opinion. Your fear seems to be causing you more pain than anything else you or anyone could ever do.

I suppose you are right. I fear the D, I fear her being happier with someone else, I fear not being in her life, I fear her not being in mine, I fear that my marriage will become another statistic, I fear that it will just become a memory......

Now the update.....

I was supposed to pick up S16 from her house today, but I had a dead battery in the car and couldn't get it fixed until later this evening. I sent a text:

M: Is there any way you can bring S16 to my house? I've got a dead battery and can't get it fixed until later this evening.

W: Sure. Call me please.

I called her and told her that I appreciated it. We talked for quite a while. She asked what I did this weekend and she told me what she did. She was her normal self again......ug!

So, when she got to my house with S16, S18 and his GF were pulling out of the driveway. They didn't even stop and say hello to her. W would have like to have said hello, but that didn't happen. She even said, "wow, they could have waited to leave. I would have liked to talk for a little bit." I agreed with her and told her that it would have been nice. I could tell that she was hurt by it. She got in her car and left.

About an hour later, I send another text:

M: I wanted to apologize for you missing S18 tonight.

W: It was hurtful and cold. I give up.

M: I know and I'm sorry.

She did not respond.

I feel terrible. I hurt for her even though I probably shouldn't because of the pain she has put me through. I love her dearly and hate to see her hurting. I know that this is a choice that she made, but damn it, I don't like to see her hurting. Maybe I'm just too sensitive? I still love this woman more than anything.

It also still bothers me that she has seemed "normal" the last few times that I have seen her. I know....she is FAR from normal right now.

Thanks for all of the help.

Tad

[25yearsmlc]

why did you apologize for your son's behavior?

And doesn't he have a right to how HE feels? You were not the only one she hurt.

((( )))

[tadpole1025]

You're right as usual 25. He does have a right to how he feels. I just felt soooooo bad for her. I felt like I needed to say something.

Tad

[seeking answers]

Tad,

Your W's R with your sons are between them and her. What your W is experiencing is consequences for her choices. She need to process them w/o interference from you. Let her feel it fully.

Stay out of the middle of it. It doesn't bode well for you if you don't. If you and W were to reconcile you certainly do not want to take on the position as referee between W and sons. You will have enough on your own plate.

I have dealt with the same thing between H and kids for 2 years now. I know it's hard to watch, but let her and sons figure it out.

[25yearsmlc]

and by inserting yourself, and apologizing you actually shouldered some of the responsibility...

to her, it just fuels the illusion that this is all your fault.

If you see our point I hope you can see that you didn't actually help the r she has with son, nor did you help her see a glimpse of reality.

you enabled her to blame others and remain blind to the damage SHE has caused. Was that your goal?

Of course not. You wanted her to feel comforted by you and then to love you back.

But that is not how to achieve that goal. IMO.