[2stepboogie]

LITB

I am sorry to hear of this. I have read up but haven’t had a chance to post. Work.

Hang in there man it does get better.

I will be back tonight

Keep being there for the kids. At the end of the day it is all about them.

[♪CS♪]

LITB, those are some hard hitting words.

BUT!

I do believe those words did not come from anger.

Those words came to protect your kids.

I can't always offer good advice.

But I am reading your sitch.

I do think about it, and it does give me good insight for mine.

So, just want to let you know. You have support here, and at the same time your posts are helping others.

Thinking of you man.

[25yearsmlc]

I'd like to think that there is a possibility of a R in the future and I appreciate the encouragement. However if she is unable to forgive me for being absent emotionally from her, I don't see how she will forgive for what is in the docs that she will be served. I still haven't heard anything back from my L yet.

Here is what is in the injunction that was filed yesterday:

On March 25, 2011 W moved to NM from SM County with her mother. She left the children with me here in SM county. I had hoped that we would not be getting a divorce when she left. However, it has become obvious that a divorce is what is going to happen. Since the children have been living with me and my mother, since March 25, 2011, I have come to realize that it is in their best interest to remain in my custody as their primary parent.

W had told me, on more than one occasion, that she was going to “pack up and move and leave D8” with me. However, she ended up moving and leaving both children with me.

The children are doing so well and are very happy living here with me and my mother, who does not work at all.

During our marriage, W had an “emotional affair” with douchebag #1 of NM. She had been planning on moving with him with our children over this last Christmas break, although he is married and lives with his W and children. They had planned on expanding their R to a PA relationship.

W’s mother had been living with us since August, 2010. I had moved her here from Las Vegas so that she could be near us and work here. However, she never looked for work, just watched television all day, eat and never contribute towards the running of the household. W was not working at the time either. I was the sole support of the family.

At the end of January, 2011, W went to Las Vegas on the pretext of telling her family that we were getting a divorce. She said she was going to be staying with her sister. She lied about that and I only learned about it afterwards. She may have been meeting someone there for an affair.

In February of this year, W had another “emotional affair” with douchebag #2, a high school sweetheart. She had told me that she made contact with him in September, 2010, however.

My mother is willing to stay on living here with us and helping me with the children. My work schedule is very flexible and I am able to be on my way home from work by 2:00 p.m. This allows me to pick up D8 and S5 from school. W’s job requires her to travel and attend social events in the evening hours. She does not get off of work, on her regular schedule, until 5:00. Also, her mother is her primary source of help with the children. However, she has been hospitalized twice in less than a year with meningitis. In fact, she is currently hospitalized and does not have health insurance. She will have to go back to work. My mother does not work.

The children, my mother and I attend church on a regular basis and we have been doing so for over a year. I volunteer in the children’s church learning program called AWANA when I take the children there. They really enjoy going to church and participating in AWANA.

W has claimed in the past that I was an absent father. But, she forgets the times that I took the children to the doctor appointments, practices, games, events, picked them up from day care and school. She also forgets that I took care of the children when she went to Florida without us to spend time with her friends or when she went to NM without us for her 20 year reunion.

W’s parents divorced when she was 8 years old. After that, her own mother physically abused her. As a result, W has had her own issues and even expressed to me several times that she was afraid to become a parent because she was afraid she would be like her mother. She told me that right before we met, she had been going to counseling to deal with her childhood trauma and issues as a result of that trauma.

I feel that perhaps it is that childhood trauma that has caused W to not stay put, so to speak, as the mother of the children, taking off to spend time with friends in Florida and to go to a reunion in NM and now to move in March of this year to NM, leaving the children behind with me, as their sole parent and care giver and provider.

I am the one that has been a consistent parent and I think I have been a very good dad for the children. It is W that has left them and moved on with her life. I tried to work things out with W and consistently made my feelings known to her ever since she announced that she wanted a divorce in November, 2010. That wasn’t enough for her and, as I said, she has moved on, leaving the children with me, thinking that I can just ship them to her like a piece of furniture, when they are well settled her in California with me and my mother. They have friends here now and are of such a young ages that I feel that bouncing them around will simply not be good for them. Otherwise, they will end up with their own set of issues as they grow up, as a result. They don’t deserved that. They deserve and need stability and consistency in a parent and that is what they are getting from me here in California, as their full time parent.

I am asking the Court issue orders pending the hearing that the children remain in California. Otherwise, I am fearful that they will never be returned to me in California. I really don’t know how W will react based on her past of having come from a family of divorce and having been physically abused and with her own set of issues that have required her to be in counseling (which I think is good for her, she needs to work on her issues, for herself and for her children).

I only want what is best for the children and I believe that that is being in m primary custody and care.

This should give you a clearer picture of my feelings of acceptance that my M is over.

I do think my chances of being the primary parent are better than she thinks.

Did you already send this? I hope not. SO MUCH of this is not legally needed. There's no way that MIL can cope with it except to hate you.

All you had to say was "MIL relocated to our area and joined our home temporarily, while she was to find work. However as of, 'x' 2010, I continued to be the sole supporter of..." See that makes the point without describing in detail her laziness PLUS any work she did at all, will undermine your credibility in the eyes of her or your w or the kids, etc. It's embarrassing and humiliating even if it's all true...

*(I think your mil was depressed, fwiw. And on that note, I just read that 'Depression is often just feeling purposeless"....and I think there's validity to that.)

If this is a done deal, then dang...ohhhh.....(OUCH) but, so be it, if it's done...

(next time, can you post it first and get feedback before you send it??)


But to re-cap what we KNOW-

She did leave, she did not take the kids, and those are facts she cannot argue.

Whatever else happened in the R, upheaval is lousy for kids. So is a parent leaving.

The kids miss her & fear she has abandoned them. So you should expect them to resist this.

So make sure they know what is NOT going to change in their lives.

My MC told me that, btw. Here's what else he said re the kids....

-- emphasize what will remain the same in their lives, such as their school, their friends, church, home, etc. No moving is a good thing.

Emphasize when and how they will see the other parent.

They'll want some details so you have to be ready for that. For now, the L's will have to deal with that but you can theorize examples.
E.g., "children, there are direct flights there" and show them a map, and or,
"I will accompany you there & back", and or

"every 4 weeks your mom will come here PLUS, x'"

OR "you will go see her for x weeks in the summer, so you get two places to explore"

While you can emphasize the "upsides" of having two locations (maybe Disneyworld is near you, or they'll have a movie theater in one place and a pool in the other, etc.) be honest about what they are losing/fearing too.

Validate their fears (reassure them of the solution to the fears. And for the things not "fixable", like missing mommy, just comfort them.

If they fear that mom will never come back to see them, you state how that's not true, and or how you will make sure they DO see her, etc. Brag about how much Mommy already misses them and if they knew how much, they'd be amazed, but MIL had problems and she's the only one to help MIl whereas YOU can care for the kids....while she's helping her mother....

(I say this ^^^ assuming there's some truth to it, but don't say it if it's a lie).


If they fear things like they'll never have a dog, or something like that, explain in detail how they WILL...if it's true. (Make no promise you aren't going to keep.)

Validate their sense of loss but remind them that lots of families have a parent somewhere else and they still love each other, like the soldiers in Afghanistan, including some moms, who are FAR far away and not able to drive or fly to see each other. They still love each other. But the children have to do things for the absent parent, like write or call.

Plan holidays in detail when you can. Meaning, you don't have to decide now, but inform them that they WILL see their mom on holidays and SOME of the traditions will remain, and some will be invented...

(After h left the first Christmas he returned for 3 days and left again. So I took the kids to a skiing place on the 27th for 4 days & rented a cabin w/DVDs and a hot tub in the snow. Getting there I got lost and in a blizzard and was scared I had made a huge mistake. Missed h like crazy then!!

But we got there with the help of son19, and chains on the tires...got there and then, We really had a blast. Best time in months since no h around to cause tension AND I was DBing and being present for the kids. In the moment, etc. So The next year we went again, this time with H, and now d13 says "I'm glad we ALWAYS go skiing after Christmas"....(wth? )
In some ways, creating "new traditions" is very easy with kids.

Get Skype! Have daily contact with each parent, even if it's about the cute boy next to her, or the baseball game, etc. Discuss mundane details.

Be prepared for some grief comments & sad questions.

When my youngest would ask if we were divorcing or words like that

I'd say "I sure hope not, b/c I've loved your dad for a long time",

or "Your dad's the love of my life so we are trying hard to work things out" and finally, sometimes to THEM, I'd say

"your happiness is the most important thing to me, so I'm going to do what I believe will ultimately make you happiest"....and they seemed comforted by that. Esp the youngest one. She literally watched me tell her this, then smiled, rolled over and went to sleep.

At a basketball game yesterday with d13, I sat next to the father of d's best friend's. He is newly divorced. All I know is that the family is split, with d's friend & her dad living together, while 2 siblings are with the mom. Friend lives with her dad "b/c none of the other kids would, and she felt sorry for her dad"....


So the dad is there with the younger sister, age 6, watching the game.
I noticed the new teams' name is "FAMILY"...

I learn that is indeed their name &I say "that's unusual".

The 6 y/o girl said "You know what's sad? It's sad that our "FAMILY" is broken now...we have to live in two places b/c our family is broken...""

(Ouch)

I said, "oh but you are still a family, and your parents and brother/sister still love you, even if you live in 2 places"...

and she said "Yeah but I'm still real sad". I saw out of the corner of my eye, the dad looking at the wall. God...


If I'd seen it in a movie I would not have believed how openly wounded she is. Why haven't the parents reassured her?

Worse, the poor oblivious dad brought a 6 y/o girl to a basketball game without a book, something to color on, or anything to do at all. She was supposed to watch a game she doesn't understand and just sit there...so of course she fidgets and the dad gets upset and it's all so raw.

Sorry L, I digress. That's a picture of a future you can avoid by being the man I think you are.

Good luck, keep the conversations shorter with your w. Repeat yourself often.
Seriously.

You might want to Say "I'm doing what I think is best for the kids" rather than "I'm not afraid anymore".

Make it your new mantra.
And
I know why you are doing this and in the long run, it'll pay off.

But it's going to be a rough damn ride for the next 6 months.

I think come January you might get a breather (depending on what stage the divorce is in legally).

If things settle down by then, I'd aim for that time for the kids to begin to adapt to their new lives.

Set a timeline goal for yourself.

We're all rooting for you and your kids and yes, your wife too. May you find some peace and

may this terrible experience bring you all closer to your best selves,

and to Him above.

((( )))

[LITB]

Thanks 2step, CS and 25 for dropping in.

25, I have to admit that I cried for the first time in a long time as I was reading your post. I don't want to hurt my W or my MIL. This is definitely the most hurtful thing that I have ever done knowing that it is going to devastate someone. Especially someone that I love.

The injunctive order was filed with the court yesterday and we are awaiting the ruling from the judge. I suspect that once a decision is made, then the paperwork will be sent to NM to be served to my W. Your post has me contemplating if I should warn her about it. Or do I let things play out and let the chips fall where they may? I can use some input with this for sure.

I don’t know if my W has even retained an attorney or if she thinks that I am bluffing. I am genuinely concerned for both of them.

What you said about the MIL being depressed is probably true. She has been through a lot in her life and she is a bitter woman. At the beginning of my sitch, we were sitting at the dinner table (W, MIL and I) and I said that you can’t move forward if you are unable to forgive. The MIL said point blank without skipping a beat, “sometimes you just can’t forgive”. I was speechless. I even brought this up to my W in a separate convo. The W told me to take anything the MIL says with a grain of salt, because she has a negative energy about her.

You gave me so much to chew on in regards to protecting the kids and helping them with their fears, etc. So far, I feel that they have been shielded from the craziness really well. We haven’t told them that mommy and daddy are no longer together or that we are getting a D. We told them that mommy is moving to NM and that they will have two homes. That they will be going to school in NM and staying with daddy during all of their breaks. This was in Feb/March. They were excited about it. That was their initial reaction. Oh, our S5 did cry because he was going to miss his best friend.

They are under the impression that they will be moving to NM in 3 weeks. As my W calls to talk to them every day, she was telling them how many more days/weeks before they move. All the while I was deciding to fight to keep them here with me.

Now, we are now getting into the nastiness of a D and things will get much more challenging. I am going to read your post over and over again to help me be the best dad possible. I am sure that I will have questions as things clear up. There is plenty of great advice in there that I will use.

Thanks again for chiming in.

[LITB]

LITB

I am sorry to hear of this. I have read up but haven’t had a chance to post. Work.

Hang in there man it does get better.

I will be back tonight

Keep being there for the kids. At the end of the day it is all about them.

No worries 2step. I appreciate that you have taken the time to stop by to offer advice or words of encouragement throughout my sitch.

Sometimes we get so deep into our own mess that it is difficult to keep up with others and offer any advice. That’s where I am right now. I have been keeping up with your sitch, “final chapter” thread and many others, but I haven’t had much to add. The first post in that thread is a helluva post 2step. You will flourish my friend.

[LITB]

LITB, those are some hard hitting words.

BUT!

I do believe those words did not come from anger.

Those words came to protect your kids.

I can't always offer good advice.

But I am reading your sitch.

I do think about it, and it does give me good insight for mine.

So, just want to let you know. You have support here, and at the same time your posts are helping others.

Thinking of you man.

Those are some hard hitting words. They hurt me when I first opened the attachment. My heart hit the floor and I had to take some time to myself. I wish that I would have posted them before we filed them with the court as 25 suggested. TBH, it was overwhelming.

You are right, they certainly did not come from a place of anger. I gave my L notes that I thought would help my case. I was oblivious to how they would be used. I did let my L know that they were brutal, but she felt like they had to be in there. Who am I to argue with someone that this is their profession?

Thanks for your support CS. Likewise, you have my support and if my sitch helps anyone, I am more than happy to share.

[25yearsmlc]

before I really reply, let me get clear


has your letter with that description included, already been sent or not?


In short, is it too late to change anything now?

If it's Not too late, let's get cracking at re writing it.

Your L is reviewing it?

If so, he or she ought to be editing it so the least harm possible is done.

I'm not trying to bang you over the head but the letter was unecessarily critical in the characterizations and historic details and It's so inflammatory.


Get ready LB,

IF I were you, I'd expect an amazingly different version of your marriage to be

hurled back at you in the Legal response. It's tough to see it in writing, as you know.

If you try to take a mother's child from her,

MOST mothers will do what they need to do to get their kids...


they'll waive child support, they'll live in squalor, they'll protect the dirtbag IF it means she gets her kids...

and they'll lie to get their kids too. And she has MIL, her "witness" to back her up.

But then again, w was willing to leave the kids and not tell them what was going on, which was risky.

(SIGH)...

When I went to file for div, my L suggested only filing for a sep, b/c she felt there was hope in our sitch (she was a real blessing)

and she also suggested I call h to ask where he preferred being served; work or "home". But I asked her to do that and so she did. He waived service so no one had to present the papers to him; all he did was sign a certified letter that says "I get it. She filed" and that way no one has to embarrass them in their home with the kids around OR at their jobs.


I'd be disappointed if your L lets that letter fly as is. But anyhow...

let us know if it's a done deal or not.

[fade]

I think that letter will backfire on you pretty badly when a judge reads it. I cant believe a lawyer wrote this. Tons of character assasination and no documentation of facts.

So she went on a trip to NV for some unstated duration. So what. What does this have to do with your children. Have you never been out of town? Do you thing the judge has never been out of town?

And your MIL abused your wife? How? When? Where is the evidence. MIL and W will tell the judge you are lying and the judge will believe them, not you. This will make you look terrible.

You allege that your W had EAs. How does this affect your children again? You are in a no fault state, the judge doesnt want to be bothered with this.

You need to state only what you can prove, and it needs to be only about the well-being of your children. Any other allegations you make will come back to bite you. Making this personal and ugly will ultimately only benefit the lawyers and your wife.

Take a look at the dadsdivorce website where there are a lot of guys who know how to go about trying to secure their custody rights and I think you will see what a collosal mistake you are about to make. Focus on your kids. Focus on their stability and well being. Prove that you are the best parent, not the bitter husband.

[LITB]

before I really reply, let me get clear


has your letter with that description included, already been sent or not?
It has been filed with the court, but it has not been sent to my W.


In short, is it too late to change anything now?
I do not know if it can be changed since it has already been filed.

If it's Not too late, let's get cracking at re writing it.

Your L is reviewing it?
My L is the person who drafted the injunctive order with the notes that I provided to her. I read it, however we did not make any changes as she felt that it all needed to be said.

If so, he or she ought to be editing it so the least harm possible is done.[/b]
You know, my intuition told me it was too much, however I decided to go with my L's advice.

I'm not trying to bang you over the head but the letter was unecessarily critical in the characterizations and historic details and It's so inflammatory.
I agree with you wholeheartedly. I hate the letter. I hate everything about it. It will put the final nail in my M.


Get ready LB,

IF I were you, I'd expect an amazingly different version of your marriage to be

hurled back at you in the Legal response. It's tough to see it in writing, as you know.

If you try to take a mother's child from her,

MOST mothers will do what they need to do to get their kids...


they'll waive child support, they'll live in squalor, they'll protect the dirtbag IF it means she gets her kids...

and they'll lie to get their kids too. And she has MIL, her "witness" to back her up.

But then again, w was willing to leave the kids and not tell them what was going on, which was risky. Everyone seems to feel that this is the biggest mistake she made in regards to the kids despite that we had a tentative agreement that I did not sign in place. The agreement was that they were to move to NM on July 16.Will it be enough for me to keep the kids, who knows?

(SIGH)...

When I went to file for div, my L suggested only filing for a sep, b/c she felt there was hope in our sitch (she was a real blessing)

and she also suggested I call h to ask where he preferred being served; work or "home". But I asked her to do that and so she did. He waived service so no one had to present the papers to him; all he did was sign a certified letter that says "I get it. She filed" and that way no one has to embarrass them in their home with the kids around OR at their jobs.
I can at least save her some humiliation by going this route. I have sent my L a couple of emails about getting the W served and that I don’t want to have it done at her work. We haven't worked out those details. I gather that once the decision comes down from the judge on the order, then the W will get served.


I'd be disappointed if your L lets that letter fly as is. But anyhow...
Unfortunately it has already left the flight deck. Hopefully it can return before it lands at its final destination.

let us know if it's a done deal or not.
I will have to ask my L if it can be revised. Since it is filed and we are awaiting the ruling, I don’t know if it can be.

I do expect an amazingly different version of our M. She has already been rewriting the history to the many people she has told, including several of her family members that did not buy it. It was her aunt who told me where she was staying while she was in Vegas. That being said, I am of the mindset that her family will side with her despite what they do not believe to be true.

I wish that I would have been able to post the verbiage before it was filed. I received it Monday night, had some correspondence with my L on Tuesday, signed it Tuesday and then filed it on Wednesday. We may hear an answer back today. Perhaps you know if something that has already been filed be amended after it has been ruled on? I will ask my L.

There is a lot going on with this. I hope for the best, but definitely expect the worst.

NOTE: DbMod, I will start a new thread today. I don't want to start it in the middle of these exchanges. If it has to be closed, I understand. Thank you

[Redo]

I really have no reason to talk to my W with the exception about our kids. There will be no more small talk, no R talk and absolutely no pursuing

That is exactly where we are right now. Wife has no reason to call at all and she does not. Somehow i am still hanging to that proverbial 'rope'. Gotta let it go sometime.