Quote: don't hold it over his head...I don't use it against him...I don't say..hey, you did this thing so therefore I can get even madder at all the little things you now do or don't do as a result of it.
Hmmmm....now I know you don't verbalize this to H so bluntly, is there not a bit of this seeping underneath? I'm thinking of Ellie's posts about your reaction to H staying out so late and missing his time with S.
Quote: my issue with forgiveness is not knowing clearly what I am forgiving him for...was there a physical thang going on??? haven't forgiven him for that one cause he hasn't admitted to it, infact denies it...so that bit is still looming...sure people tell me to forgive anyway..it doesn't matter...ah but it does...I don't want to forgive someone for something they didn't do. That's like saying to an honest person...it's ok I forgive you for lying
This makes a lot of sense. But how will you ever know for sure LL? Could you flat out ask HER?
What if she said there was a PA?
What if she says there wasn't?
I have a book called "Never be lied to again" (by David J. Lieberman) which gives some pretty well studied tips on not only how to tell when people are lying to you, but also how to trip them up and lead them into fessing up to stuff you in fact didn't know about.
Yeah, I was in one of THOSE moods when I bought it.
SO Shiny, how DO you tell when people are lying to you?? What's the main thing to look for? I have a real hard time trusting my H that he is not talking to the OW. I'm suppose to beleive she just stopped calling him after they have had a on/off relationship for 3 yrs. That's along time. Racahel
Hmmmm....now I know you don't verbalize this to H so bluntly, is there not a bit of this seeping underneath? I'm thinking of Ellie's posts about your reaction to H staying out so late and missing his time with S.
honestly, it is simply his neglect of son...seperate issue but in some way compounded by his neglect of me. Has nothing to do with ow.
This makes a lot of sense. But how will you ever know for sure LL? I suppose I never will, unless of course he changes his story Could you flat out ask HER? I aksed her plenty of times during and after...she denies..denies...denies..
What if she said there was a PA? well then I guess that would either mean there was a pa..or she just wants him back and figures I'd ditch him if it were a pa.
What if she says there wasn't? she already says there wasn't "I know you'll never believe us (don't you like the fact that she refers to herself and my h as us) but it just wasn't like that..anyone can have a physical r"
I have a book called "Never be lied to again" (by David J. Lieberman) which gives some pretty well studied tips on not only how to tell when people are lying to you, but also how to trip them up and lead them into fessing up to stuff you in fact didn't know about.
Yeah, I was in one of THOSE moods when I bought it.
Shiny most of my time spent with h is in one of those moods
Quote: SO Shiny, how DO you tell when people are lying to you?? What's the main thing to look for? I have a real hard time trusting my H that he is not talking to the OW. I'm suppose to beleive she just stopped calling him after they have had a on/off relationship for 3 yrs. That's along time. Racahel
point is rachael,
you either believe him or you don't and even if you do beleive him (say like if he were to do all the things you think you'd need to trust him) you'll never really know and that doubt will always be there to fight off. Heck look at sage..her h does everything but back flips and she still on occassion has tourmenting thoughts of ow.
I know! I'd love it if my H did everything hers did. Your right. We'll never know. We do know what they've done and that it's VERY HARD to trust them after that wondering if since they've lied to us before, are they doing it again? I don't have any answers and I think I'm probably bugging my H too much about it now. I'm needing reassurance, and I don't think it's too much to ask him for it. I think they should help us along in trusting them again, and be willing to listen to us. I emialed my H this morning telling him I was sorry I called him so late last night, but that I needed his reassurance and to please understand. He has not emailed me back and I know he's there. Hmm. what's up with that? Rachael
Hi, here is my 2 cents. My phsygolist always says, " beleive what they are saying, because they want you to believe it, even if it is not the truth". I guess that still makes it hard to interupt, but another saying, "Listen to the message, not the messenger," sheds a bit more light. I think what everyone is trying to say, is take what is said to heart, even if it is a lie, a known lie, the reason for the message is more important then the actual message. For instance it may be a simple as "I don't want to hurt you", that they themselves what to deperately believe thier own "lie" and by lying is some sort of twisted attempt to "fix" things within themselves.
Still confused??? Just believe what is said. THe other way to look at it, if is the actual truth, would you believe him anyway??
Still confused??? Just believe what is said. THe other way to look at it, if is the actual truth, would you believe him anyway?? if it is the actual truth and there were some way for me to know it..sure I'd believe him (heck after all he is aparently ld anyway)....I am not however a believer in lying to save the feelings of the other...lying does nothing for us in the end..with holding info is one form of deception but out right lying when asked a direct question is in my opinion detrimental..how can you have an intimate relationship with someone if you are not honest with them???
I agree with LL on this one. Lying is never good-even if its to sabe one's feelings. I'm not sure it's not to save their own hide. My H would not wnat his kids knowing he is being deceptive to their Mother again. If I find out he's lying again, I know I'll never believe him no matter what. I can't live with a constant liar. Rachael
And BTW, if I had the chance to actually KNOW fro sure H was not lying, you better believe I'd believe it! I want to believe him so bad, but I just can't. What he's saying does not make sense. That she has not called him at all and there has been no contact. Well, they've been having contact for 3 yrs. Last time we were together he siad the same thing and then he tells me that he did talk to her. How can you believe someone like that?? He'snot helping with hte way he's acting either.I'm about to back WAY off, and I'm not sure that's the thing to do either. We've been spending alot of time together, and he runs hot and cold. I mean he never does anything really bad, it's just a distance thing he does that makes me doubt everything. I hate this dance we do, but I guess it's like Treesa said in Newcomer's-expect it to take a Loooooong time. A truer thing was never said. Rachael
And BTW, if I had the chance to actually KNOW fro sure H was not lying, you better believe I'd believe it! I want to believe him so bad, but I just can't. What he's saying does not make sense. That she has not called him at all and there has been no contact. Well, they've been having contact for 3 yrs. Last time we were together he siad the same thing and then he tells me that he did talk to her. How can you believe someone like that?? He'snot helping with hte way he's acting either.I'm about to back WAY off, and I'm not sure that's the thing to do either. We've been spending alot of time together, and he runs hot and cold. I mean he never does anything really bad, it's just a distance thing he does that makes me doubt everything. I hate this dance we do, but I guess it's like Treesa said in Newcomer's-expect it to take a Loooooong time. A truer thing was never said. Rachael
