Ok here is what has gone down. I told him that I was very willing to enter counseling with him while we remained separated, but that I didn't believe it was fair to me if he continued to see the OW while we were in counseling, that if he agreed to say 2 counseling sessions (or whatever) that he needed to cease contact with her during that time. Otherwise what's the point? So he said he could not do promise that. I said if she really had feelings she could wait for you and he said he felt some sort of obligation to her because she broke up her long term relationship to take a chance on HIM. I know that's awful. So at that point I said ok, then if you are going to continue your affair, no matter what level it is at, I think it is only fair to me that you file for divorce, because I will not allow you to stay "married" to me in your mind or keep me as a second chance prize if something with her fails. So then 2 days later he said he didn't "want" to but he was going to file for divorce because he could not promise me he'd cut her off.
So anyway, at this point I told his parents. I told a few of our mutual friends. My sisters and some of my friends have broken connections to him on facebook. I have told him not to contact me unless there was some serious emergency. I have not contacted him.
I am trying my best to deal with this through meds, friends and family, and therapy, guided imagery cds, etc.
Aside from all of that, I do feel like I forced the divorce issue to come to the top sooner rather than later, but I felt the only other option I had was to be a doormat. I know that in my heart I still wish he would come to his senses, but I wouldn't take him back without extensive counseling and regret and atonement from him that I would have to KNOW is genuine. I feel like he lost his mind and he is crazy and he just found one other crazy person to validate him because no one else will.
I guess I want to know if I did the right thing in forcing the divorce issue, by saying if he kept up with her AND refused counseling, he needed to man up. I felt that his indecision was making me more ill than I am.
M45 Bomb 6/09; EA 6/10; Divorced 1/11 Proud single mom of 7 little feline girls and one little feline boy "Fall down 53 times. Get up 54." -- Zen saying
I know what you mean about not being able tto shut the love off. I can't, either. No matter how much he keeps hurting me, I still want to keep trying. But I am the only one who does. I found out he took our tax refund money, lied about it and hid it away in his "secret" account I am not supossed to know about. I had the proof in my hand, and still he sat there and said, no I didn't. Then he finally admitted it and I asked why he lied and he said it was for his "divorce fund" I know it was really to spend with the 20 year old kid. I asked how he could live with himself, doesnt he feel guilty at all? He said I just don't care anymore. I don't care about you. I don't care if I hurt you.
I can't give up on him..but how do you know when to give up? When there really is not hope? I keep thinking to myself, but in the books, it says that there have been a lot of people in tihs position that have come back to have happy marragies. How do you know? Deep down, I think I know there is no chance. But there is always that little bit of hope. He said he hasnt left only becuase he can't afford to, but if a man was really and truly done, woudlnt' he just leave anyway?
I just keep thiking why can't he SEE..
He has a lot of resentment about things that happened in our marraige in the past. I know that is the problem. He will not let go. He is like a immature 2 year old, sitting in the corner, covering his ears and saying, I dont care, I wont listen. We did both say and do things that hurt each other. Difference is, I forgave him and moved on from it. He is stil holding a grudge. And this involved another - kid - not as young as this one, and not an affair, just a totally inappropriate relationship. Pretty much an EA, but not intense. Back then, I made him sleep on the couch until it stopped and I could trust him again. It was a couple years. And he cant get over it, never mind he is the one that caused it in the first place.
Alan - I have been trying to take your advice, as much as I can. I already exposed to both our families back in January. People he works with knew before I did. But, I went on Facebook and called him - adn her - out by name. I do have a picture of them together, that she was stupid enough to post on FB, that I think I will repost. I am tying to emabarass him - shame him into stopping. but, if he really doesn't care what people think..
I do think this is in part a mid life crisis. I know he is an addict - so accurate. To HER and to LYING.
I don't get it - I was a stay at home mom, which we decided befoer we even got married, but I was working very PT to keep my foot in the door, until this all came out,he complained that I wasn't working FT, so now I am and he is complaining that I am working, so he can't work his PT job, becuase he has to watch the kids. (he has a FT job, and then a PT one - the PT one he likes)
And, he refuses to go to counseling, becuase there is nothing wrong with him and he isn't having someone tell him how to live his life. When his mother tried to say something to him about what he is doing, he told her to mind her own business.
I don't know how to give up and move on. I think, what if I do give up..maybe he would have snapped out of it and we didn't have to ruin our childrens life's as they know it.
Sorry..I am still so confused.
Good luck, Antonia. You seem like a very strong woman.
Me:36 H:38 Together: 20 years Married: 16 years Kids: 13 & 10 yr. old Discovered affair: 1/10 H denies affair. Refuses to save marraige. Divorce filed: December 2010
That's his choices... NO NEGOTIATING... you cannot negotiate with an addict... Have you even found a GOOD FAMILY THERAPIST yet? Not a shrink or psychotherapist.. a family therapist?
You do NOT try to negotiate an addict into going to family therapy with you, YOU GO to set a good example and STAY NO CONTACT with him so he isnt' cake eating
Then you continue exposure with friends and family about what he's doing to the family... Encourage them to pressure him to end his affair...
If all of his friends and family reject him and tell him outright OW will NEVER be welcome in their home he will be pressed to think long and hard about what he's doing...
You really do need to setup a signature so everyone can keep in the loop... you will get more responses that way
Will you expand a little on what you mean when you say you don't recommend supporting divorce at all?
If I'm the BS and am using LRT and in the protection stage, and if the WS shows no sign of ending the affair, don't you have to pursue divorce at some point, otherwise the WS thinks they can just string you along, right? If you don't, won't they see the BS as being weak and tolerating an open marriage?
Will you expand a little on what you mean when you say you don't recommend supporting divorce at all?
If I'm the BS and am using LRT and in the protection stage, and if the WS shows no sign of ending the affair, don't you have to pursue divorce at some point, otherwise the WS thinks they can just string you along, right? If you don't, won't they see the BS as being weak and tolerating an open marriage?
Can't wait to see THIS answer . . .
Now, where's that "smiley munching popcorn" emoticon when you need it???
Pup you must be gettin lazy, you could have answered this one...
I don't think divorce needs to be done no... You CAN live a life apart from your spouse that is fullfilling... You can go to school, the gym, eat drink, socialize, travel, etc.. you can do all of that without having a divorce paper signed
Why is there this need to have a divorce paper signed before life can be lived? MWD makes a very strong point in DR about pursuing a full life while the spouse is away cheating...
If you have a life, then why does one need the paper signed?
At some point you will discover your whole self again, but this takes months and months of time...
There are a lot of people who claim they are in protection phase/no contact/LRT but aren't...
Most people who want the D papers want them in order to help them let GO... Or to stick it to their partner... Or so they can start dating...
How long should someone AVOID romantic involvement after they have dropped the emotional rope and are fully resolved to pursue their own life?
Look at SeeingRed on this forum, she's been waiting THREE YEARS...
WOuld you say that's too long pup?
Myself, I really don't know.. I think the length of time is less important than HOW you SPEND the time...
If you spend three years travelling, pen your first novel, run with the bulls in spain or whatever that's great, you can be married and off doing all that while your spouse cheats away and burns his bridge...
If you are home sitting there crying, moping... wondering all your day away what HE is diong with HIS TIME.. then to my mind you arne't in LRT or protection phase.. you are still in the THICK of the drama...
For SOME affairs the spouse MAY find getting a lawyer and drafting up papers for a D may shake some sense into the WS... This IS a tactic, but I really don't have a lot of confidence in that one...
The problem with D is if you push that one yes, you are putting all yoru cards on the table and you can't back down from that one... you have to MEAN it..
That Divorce Filing card has to be played at the RIGHT TIME.. If you file and your WS doesnt' blink then you blew it...
I think there are OTHER less condemming routes to show your spouse you mean business and are not emotionally invested in the marriage... Taking a trip to Europe for three months, moving to a new city, etc...
Making BIG changes in your life that lead your WS to see a NEW PERSON there and that the OLD ONE is LEAVING.. the DOORMAT is not THERE anymore...
You really need to know when you have gotten to the point where you can say comfortably without anger that your marriage is over and you are ok with that...
Phil McGraw has a wonderful article on his website about knowing when its time to divorce...
Pup talked about emotional commitment to a point and sharing that commitment with the WS.. I am wracking my brain trying to remember what it was about... OH the TIMELINE...
Ya... This is a similar point I am making...
When you make a commitment to wait for x number of months and tehn you will file.. you do'nt SHARE that with the WS.. as pup points out and I agree fully on this one the WS will take that as a FREE PASS to cheat nonstop up to that day and then they will return and promise you the moon... only to cheat again a few days later...
WHen you make a commitment you stick to it, but you don't share that iwth your spouse...
This does NOT mean you tell your spouse you will wait forever either...
You make it clear you are preparing for a FULL LIFE without them... you put their crap into boxes and leave it on the curb, you put away all the wedding pictures, you remove the ring etc... You start DOING INTERESTING THINGS... travel, school, music lessons, whatever...
And again pup pointed this out, you can't tell them you "will wait for them".. they will just string you along
So, I don't advocate filing or threatening to D the WS... But I don't advocate sitting around waiting either... I think there's a healthy middleground
I further think that the D filing is a rush to DATE someone to fill the VOID for the LBS.. they are in pain and they want to run out and date to feel good again
This is NOT advisable or healthy... This is what your SPOUSE is doing... pursuing wrteckless sex and companionship in a HURRY rather than processing their grief over their failing marriage...
Look at QuickSilver's thread for that one.. His wife is a classic case.. she's miserable about her marriage and she thinks sex chats and secret rendezvous will help her process the pain of the divorce she's filed...
Seriously.. give me a break.. You are just asking to get used...
In Short LMW, I think there's better and healthier ways to communicate you aren't waiting for the WS anymore than filing for Divorce ahead of your WS...
Will you expand a little on what you mean when you say you don't recommend supporting divorce at all?
If I'm the BS and am using LRT and in the protection stage, and if the WS shows no sign of ending the affair, don't you have to pursue divorce at some point, otherwise the WS thinks they can just string you along, right? If you don't, won't they see the BS as being weak and tolerating an open marriage?
In my opinion (not that you asked), yes. There does come a point where remaining in the marriage does you so much emotional harm that it is better to leave it, if the cheating spouse won't repent and come back to the marriage.
I myself filed for divorce after three months of my wife's affair, after she absolutely refused to end it, and kept lying to me, our kids and even her own parents about it. Ultimately, we reconciled, but I was fully prepared to go thru with it. In the end, it was the jolt that she needed, although I DON'T think you should do it just to bluff.
I think your wife pup would be the rarity on this forum... I think most of the female and male wayward spouses in the cases on this forum wouldn't bat an eye at the three month point if there was a divorce filed on them by a LBS from this forum
There may be a few that would be affected by it, but I don't think very many, not at the three month mark
Thanks Allen and Puppy. In my case, which you've helped me with elsewhere in this forum, what's the best way to respond to a cheating spouse who won't end an affair and who keeps wanting to draw up a separation/divorce agreement? (In my state, a couple must be separated for a year before divorcing.) I'm doing my GAL (traveling, socializing, etc.) and LRT/NC, but when my cheating spouse texts me about meeting to discuss this stuff, how do I handle that without bringing us closer to divorce?
