He says that he hasn't divorced me because he is scared. Then he asked me if I could forgive him. And I said I would do my best to do so. Then he is telling me that he loves me. Then I find proof of contact with OW.
The "kool aid" he is giving me is some really good stuff.
He's bluffing you Zen. He's not leaving, but he knows you are afraid so he pushes your limits.
There are so many posters on this forum who are afraid of losing their spouse. Waywards can SMELL FEAR and when you are afraid of losing them they will take ADVANTAGE of your fear. They realize that they can push your limits into accepting an open marriage and that you won't stop them or do anything about it.
He knows you won't interfere and that you are nervous, so he takes advantage. It will take you a while to build up the confidence to call his bluff.
He can tell you that he loves you my dear, but he's LYING to you. He probably DOES have loving feeleings for you, but right now he's not loving you in ACTION.. he's HURTING YOU.
Just picture someone eating a pile of junk food and saying to you "I want to lose weight"...
It's the same arrangement here... he's FEELING love for you, but he's DOING something that accomplishes the opposite... don't let him confuse you... he has to ACT LOVING.. not just TALK a good TALK about how he FEELS.
So many people confuse love as an action with love as a feeling and they get away with a lot of exploitation on account of it.
Start packing your things, get tons of moving boxes and fill the house with the boxes... then start packing stuff into the boxes... Don't argue with him or even talk to him... just keep packing and watch him panic. If he tries to bait you into talking or arguing, IGNORE HIM and keep packing.
Take your time packing, drag it out as long as needs be until he realizes you will leave when you are done packing.
Call a few friends on the phone with him in earshot, tell them that you need a place to stay until you get an apartment. Tell them OUTRIGHT on the PHONE that your husband is lying and cheating... expose him right over the phone to whomever is on the other line (there doesn't need to be anyone on the other end... its just for show...)
I did it, it gave my WS a panic attack each time I went near a box. I hated doing it, but she needed to see I was serious... And them watching you PACK your THINGS SHOWS them you won't TOLERATE being USED any longer.
Zen, I am sorry for my mixed up posts last night-and I realized I missed your first post where you already said some things that I had asked.
Now before you think I am a hippocrate (lol!) remember that my WH has brought up D to me several times so it makes me think he will do it if I push. I am not in the same place you are.
You hold the cards- you moved out once before; why did you return? How did your H act when you moved out? Please explain a little about that.
me,34 exH,34 S,16 months S:3/31/09-left for OW started DBing 10/09 d final: sometime 10/10 current: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2022856&page=1 met in 2004
I have looked into moving...contacted an attorney (to find out what my rights are). I have discussed what the attorney said. H wasn't very happy. H has not claimed to have contacted an attorney.
I really don't want to move into an apartment with teenage boys. It's bad enough in a house. I can't afford the house on my own.
I have exposed to kids, relatives, friends and complete strangers. I haven't exposed to his clients, but I have threatened this. H says he is scared I will ruin him. But apparently not enough to end the EA.
Do you think that over time (this last year) H has become a better liar?
Is the progression common - EA, then EA & PA and then just EA?
H tells me he will never leave me. Well duh, why would you leave if you can have a wife and the OW.
On some levels it seems our R is getting better. H is buying me a new motorcycle and one for him. That is an activity we do together. Like I said before when we are doing something together, we are really good.
H tells me that he can't keep living like this. It is hurtful to me, the boys and the OW. He swears he is not having physical contact with her.
So what you are saying is that the EA won't just go away. It won't just fizzle. It's an addiction. And that he is lying to me all the time. No wonder why I feel crazy.
The seriousness of my situation is occurring to me.
After a complete personality change, acting lessons and a courage transplant. It seems like I have to leave him, go dark and let him know what he will lose.
I feel so stuck in the pain. The only way out is more pain.
If I don't do anything, then this is how my life will be. Pain. If I do something, then my life will be in more pain (or maybe different kind of pain).
Got to get my mind around the pain party in my future.
Do you think that over time (this last year) H has become a better liar?
Is the progression common - EA, then EA & PA and then just EA?
Yes they get good at lying. As far as I have read, once the EA turns to PA it never goes back to EA.
And why would you move out with your boys? Maybe he needs to move out- that makes better sense. He would have to pay to help you stay in the house!
Quote:
H tells me that he can't keep living like this. It is hurtful to me, the boys and the OW. He swears he is not having physical contact with her.
I don't get this- why does your H say he can't keep living like this- what does he mean?
Why is he staying in contact with her?
And no, I am not saying that As will never end. Because 95% do. But look at the damage they cause.
So when was the very last time you talked to your H about ending the EA?
If you are out of town on work, there is ample opportunity for him to be physical with OW and not tell you right?
me,34 exH,34 S,16 months S:3/31/09-left for OW started DBing 10/09 d final: sometime 10/10 current: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2022856&page=1 met in 2004
Is the progression common - EA, then EA & PA and then just EA?
No, it's not. Not more than just temporarily, anyway (often an illicit couple will agree that "We need to cool it for awhile; my spouse is really watching me," or whatever, but the physical affair soon re-ignites).
I don't mean to be harsh, but men don't usually (ever??) stick around for more than a year without physical pay-off. I would HIGHLY doubt, if this woman is local (and a co-worker), that their affair is not physical at this point.
You mentioned you are still ML. Please be careful, and use protection!
So what you are saying is that the EA won't just go away. It won't just fizzle. It's an addiction. And that he is lying to me all the time. No wonder why I feel crazy.
The seriousness of my situation is occurring to me.
After a complete personality change, acting lessons and a courage transplant. It seems like I have to leave him, go dark and let him know what he will lose.
You don't necessarily have to leave him, Z.
You do, however, have to be WILLING to, if that's what it takes in order to protect your own emotional health.
To use a military analogy, it's not the use of force that keeps nations safe. It's the "credible threat" of a use of force that does. The other guy just has to believe you would, if you had to in order to protect yourself.
Until you lose the fear . . . until the fear of staying in this painful place becomes equal to or greater than the fear of risking losing him . . . you'll remain stuck.
I feel so stuck in the pain. The only way out is more pain.
If I don't do anything, then this is how my life will be. Pain. If I do something, then my life will be in more pain (or maybe different kind of pain).
Got to get my mind around the pain party in my future.
This is how it was explained to me, Z, when I found out my wife was having an affair:
PAIN HAS COME TO PAY YOU A VISIT. Think of it as a STORM. You can do nothing, and let it consume you and destroy you, or you can steel yourself and start to trudge INTO it, and eventually -- with God's help -- THRU it.
Either way, the storm isn't going away.
If you want, check out my old threads, when I used to post as "Chocolateeyes." For reference, my wife's affair was May - Aug 2007, and there are several threads about "The Storm."
Z - onlything i can say is i see a lack of boundries, or atleast no conciquences if a boundry in your mind is crossed - silent treatment, do not wait on him (food, washing clothes) are good baby step consquinces.
if he asks or prods - "i will not tolerate an open marriage, and will not continue taking care of you or your things if you continue to be in contact with OW"
puppy calls it a "storm" - somewhere on here i heard something that stuck with me "embrace the suck" - you are looking right at it, it will consume you and make you crazy - embrace it and you can beat it.
gman
Last edited by gman; 04/22/1003:37 PM.
M-37 W-36 S-11, S-9, D-4 PA exposed 3/13/10 10/19/10 moving on... most up to date sit
I would say there is a pattern of EA, PA, and EA to a degree.
Most affairs that I have seen die a slow ugly death, they don't head hard and fast after a bed-hopping.
My wife was in a PA over long distance and it ran as an EA for about six months before she finally ended contact with him... it fizzled out.
What you want to look for Z is a pattern of SLOWING contact.
If it was daily then weekly, then gradually shifted into a couple times a month then yes, it would appear to be dying out... as an EA... but this sort of analysis requires a LOT of DATA which is VERY HARD to get a HOLD of...
How much INTEL do you have on his activities? If you don't have that much, then you are basing conclusions on imperfect information.
I really think its best to just put him all in and start packing to show him you mean business... you don't have to walk out the same night... you can take three weeks to pack it all up.
I can't afford the house on my own. 