Eye of the storm?

[cyclone]

Tough day today. The MC session was about what I expected. I don't think it will be very helpful. Most of the focus was on my problems and what I've done to create this mess. I found it very difficult to DB well.

W is still confused. Mc came to the conclusion that I want to
work on the M and W doesn't know what she wants. And I had to
write a check for that?

There was so much rewritten history that I bit a hole through my tongue. MC wants us to work on commnication about our R. How am I supposed to
DB and not come across as unwilling to work on things? the best I can do
right now is to let W know that this is where I am now but I don't know how long I will be in that place. She still thinks we can D and be best of friends and do
everything together as a family. Wants the best of both worlds.

I will still follow her lead.

She is pulling out of the campng trip. Think she was surprised to
hear that I will still be taking the kids camping later in the week. That was the original
plan. Should have stuck with it bu I moved things up to the weekend to
accomodate her schedule. Can't do that anymore.

[HeartsBlessing]

Tough day today. The MC session was about what I expected. I don't think it will be very helpful. Most of the focus was on my problems and what I've done to create this mess. I found it very difficult to DB well.
W is still confused. Mc came to the conclusion that I want to
work on the M and W doesn't know what she wants. And I had to
write a check for that?

All this confirmed was something you already knew.

In other words, the blame is being put on YOU...with none on her, at least for this go around.

Something wrong with that picture. Each person has their half of the blame for the breakdown of the marriage; no ONE person can take ALL the blame...it takes two to make a marriage work, ONE to break it all to pieces.

The blame, to be sure is not totally yours....sure, you made your mistakes, but SHE was the one who stepped outside and committed adultery instead of making sure you understood she was having issues with you so you'd have a chance to fix those within your half of the marriage.
She either hid them behind a bunch of confused talk you didn't understand; or didn't open her mouth and just talk about it.

Typical MLC behavior.

You're understandably frustrated, and a little angry about how it went.

How am I supposed to DB and not come across as unwilling to work on things?

I'd been thinking about your question since I saw it this morning. It's not easy to DB; but, really, you already know you have to detach, work on yourself as the changes are for YOU, not her, although they DO affect her in how she relates to you as a person/husband/father of her children.

Some people never accept the changes in their spouse, and so, they walk away...but that is NOT the fault of the LBS...the flaw, such as it is, resides within the MLC'er/WAS..whichever case it may be.
The changes were also never designed to "get" her back; they are tools to be utilized to help you grow and become better than you were before your marriage broke down.

If she follows you, that's great, if she doesn't...that's HER choice. Either way, you'll have to let her go to make her mistakes, bump her head, whatever she ends up doing..but the end result, if it results in a final break, will not be your fault...it would be HERS.

You can't force her to choose you; she has to do this on her own; you're right that you cannot stay in one place too long.

I was remembering having let go of my husband; and though I treated him well, he was pretty busy trying to get me to go back to what he could relate to before and that wasn't happening.

I also saw that it was possible that he could walk away, choosing NOT to stay married to me, and I HAD TO ACCEPT that possibility, while doing my best to bring the marriage back together almost single handedly.

In the end, it was BOTH of us that brought the marriage back together, but I stayed and did my part; all the while half-watching him when he never knew I was doing it.

Even then, sometimes I'd thought I'd gone TOO far, and at others, not far enough. It wasn't easy for either one of us...and what I was seeing on the outside didn't smell right, taste right or feel right..but later on he actually thanked me for doing some of the things I did; as my love was tough at the right times.

I've dealt with deep confusion on his part, not knowing what he wanted. I remember letting him know I loved him, but wouldn't be "waiting" on him...I'd be going on with my life.

On the outside, he was trying to argue with me; but emotionally, I'd already detached and was moving away from him...through the confusion he was experiencing, he DID see that move pretty clearly.

As a result, he attempted to terrorize me emotionally, into backing down, but I knew I couldn't. Win or lose, this was it, I wasn't going to do this again..the appeasing him was finished for good.
I would do what I knew I had to do for MYSELF, and he could either follow me, or walk away, his choice, not mine.

In his bid for control of the situation, I got threatened with everything but domestic violence...total withdrawal and total rejection at his hands..but so what? I'd ALREADY experienced all that, so it was nothing new to me.

I cared, but I didn't care...and it had to come to that for me and him; the door had to be closing before he scurried inside, and he HAD to see it closing through my actions.

I honestly got to the point, I didn't care if he left or stayed, but he WAS going to respect me, if he didn't do anything else.

It was ALL or nothing, as I'd already seen this was STILL about him, didn't have anything to do with me, and I knew that all I really had was TIME and not much else.

Emotionally, he was still GONE from me, even after all the talking of how he felt.

I had to leave him alone, let him go, and get on with my life.

The calmer I was, the more he raged at me, trying to get me to respond in ways that would continue to feed his justification for what he was doing...but the calm way I responded to him made him realize that the game was over with..but I didn't see this realization in him at that time..it was MUCH later before he told me this.

At the time I thought he wanted to leave, but I didn't ask him to. I knew him well enough to know if I threw him out, he might not come back.....MY CHOICE, MY LIFE, MY TIME that was being utilized or, in other people's eyes, wasted.

I never saw my time in this as "wasted", it was a learning experience, that, however it came out, was and would be beneficial to ME.

So, I never really stood still, except to wait on God at times.

When he was ready, he followed MY lead, I was the stronger one, the lighthouse, the staunchion(pillar of strength)..but I had to let it ALL go, and hope that he'd come along to me.

He did, but it was HIS choice to do this, not really anything I did to make it happen. I made and effected changes for ME..the rest was up to HIM. This is KEY to the whole scenario; THEIR choice and free will must be taken into consideration during this whole ride on the roller coaster/merry go round/ferris wheel.

This is the MAIN thing people FORGET; the CHOICES of the MLC/WAS spouse. Each person has the power to stay and work on the marriage/relationship or walk away...if a person doesn't want to learn to relate to the changes they see and perceive within another, they CAN walk away; again their choice to do so.

Even if it looks like you don't care.....the letting go and detaching completely can be what it takes to bring them forward, or cause them to arrive at a decision either for or against you.

You do what's best for you, being kind enough to let them know this..then put the words into action, more or less, leaving THEM behind you to decide for themselves what they want.

This is not an unwillingness to work things out, this is taking care of YOU, because you're not staying in the SAME place for them to attempt to manipulate and suck you into their drama.

You're also not giving them a chance to create a cycle of back and forth that would have to be broken. They will play as long as you will allow them to.

When you make a conscious decision to move forward then what comes begins to be totally out of your hands, putting the ball into the court of the other.

Once you've made your stand, the outcome is then let go of.

The point is you may do everything "right" and STILL have a spouse walk away completely. Things can change so quickly from one day to the next. One day they hate you, the next day, they are following you everywhere. Still, the next day, they are creating stupid drama to try and upset your balance...and they hate it when you've unbalanced them, acting in ways they are unfamilar with.

The decision to go on or not, is THEIRS to make, it always was. You can only decide what's best for YOU, and move on with that in mind.

On the other hand, you CAN choose to follow her lead to see where it goes, but the aforementioned was in answer to your question about how to DB without it looking like you are unwilling to work things out.

I think you've demonstrated again and again this willingness to work things out, and she keeps dragging you down alternate ways and routes designed to keep you right where she wants you.

You know that until OM is gone, there's NO chance of working on the marriage at all, so you can really do nothing but get on with it until she decides her course.

Only YOU know how long you can wait for her to stop spinning her wheels, Cyclone. But, your waiting must be proactive, not reactive. Be kind to yourself, take care of yourself and the children; continue to work on YOU; all the while, understanding that you can do nothing for her, only for yourself.

My only concern is possibly getting stuck in some kind of a cycle; where she keeps giving you glimmers of hope; and you keep trying; only to find that things are much the same as they were.

She's so very confused, and really doesn't know what she wants. Yet, she seems to think you're going to just keep going along with whatever she cooks up for you....I think she's in for some more surprises, and it's not just the camping trip changes.

Keep us posted.

[cyclone]

It's been a couple of days and I've taken the time to regroup. I though I had gotten to a place of detachement with no expectations but that clearly wasn't the case. I feel like I'm back on track with nonexpectations

W has been in and out the past few days. I dont think about what she is doing or where she is. When she is home things are pleasant enough. There have even been some good hugs. I take them In the moment they happen then move on. She isn't ready yet.

She came back last night for Easter with the kids. I did all of the work around the house hiding eggs and baskets while she sat on the couch. I know she just isn't capable of doin this stuff. Looking back it's been several years since she really participated. She spent the morning with the family but then left. Don't know if she will be back later for dinner and I don't really care. I'll have a great time with the boys.

[Celestial X 5]

You have gotten to a place of detachment, sometimes it slips away from us, but you can get yourself back on track here.

Keep things pleasant between you, but detach other ways. I used to tell myself that detaching was doing more good than I could physically see, and in reality, it was.

Do your own things with the kids, & don`t include her, let her feel left out, she comes and goes as she pleases because she is confused. Keep on track for all of you.

Celestial

[cyclone]

Another session with the MC. I felt this one went a bit better than last time. I said I felt the focus of the last session seemed to be about all of the things I did (or didn't) do in the R.

W started out being confused about what she wants. By the middle of the session she says she just decided that she wants a D. She said yesterday she didn't but today she does. If I weren't prepared for the confusion I wouldn't know how to take it.

She also did a bunch of projection and rewriting history. I did a great job validating but not agreeing with what she was saying. Believe none of what she says.

Someone mentioned the eyes a while ago. Stay clear of the small pupils. They were pinholes during the session.

MC isn't sure that W has made up her mind and wants to see us again in a couple of days. Well see ifthe confusion is still present or if her mind is still as clear as W seems to think it is.

I took a lot of siht from W. She is really trying hard to paint our M and by extension me in a bad light to justify what she is doing. I can feel the pain she is feeling and has felt the past several years of her depression. MC won't help with her depression.

[cyclone]

An update and journaling:

Another MC session last Thursday. The MC is getting pretty direct with W about making a decision but this is close to impossible for W right now. The approach she began to take was to ask my W what she wants. W can't express that but knows what she doesn't want. Nothig she said is somethn that can't be fixed. In fact moat of what she said is what we had before all of this.

MC finally starts to ge us onto talking about what a S or D mig look like. The big surprise for W is that I don't plan give her the house. She thought all along that she would get to stay in the house while I continue to make payments. I calmy explained that the only way we wouldn't have to sell the house is for me to stay there. I can get a loan by myself. She can't. The MC asked W if she were to get the house what would I get as part ofthe division of property. W had no response.

This was all too muh fo her to handle. We all wen to dinner after but W couldn't come home. He said she needed time to process everything. She broke her withdrawal silence yesterday evening. Things don't seem to be any different but I am still givng her space. I am back to detachment with no expectations.

I'm still not sure I like the approach of MC but maybe W needs a push from
a third party. At least she is clear on what the reality will be. Moving forward is a good thing.

[lalxx]

hey cyclone,
I have been there with my husband in MC and he made it all my fault - his eyes are dead too - not sure what you mean about small pupils but my husband's eyes look very tired.

Stay detached and process what she says slowly in my view - I did a timeline which helps me enromously keep everything in context.

lalxx

[Marked&Healed]

I Most women do not have a LL of touch IMHO.

However I am sure I could get hit with some 2x4's by some of the women here for saying that!

LOLOL - Mine is PT and H is Acts... so plbbbttt! raspberries to you

[Marked&Healed]

The eyes are the windows to the soul - dead eyes are a clear give away that they are dead inside... at least feeling that way. Small pupils may mean high light conditions, or that they are not liking what they are looking at - when you're in love, your pupils get large to take in as much of the other person as you can. Be careful not to mistake emotional changes in the eyes with responses to environmental conditions.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

Strangely I get the feeling that many of the women here have PT as one of their languages.