Glad I got to Retrouvaille. The religious focus was stronger than I expected, but Catholic and my own/Islamic values have enough in common that it wasn't uncomfortable at all. The only two negatives were the hotel room wasn't great, and there was a lot of repeating. The repetion probably was needed for me or others, but it was dry that way.
Otherwise - Wow.
Thanks to all those who've helped keep me going long enough to get this far, and to suggest it in the first place.
In no way are the problems we have done. In many of the activities, W had problems following the directions/understanding the questions and while she was offered help, she refused.
Small fights on the way home, but important ones, reminded me that I need to keep working. The RV weekend has 9 more sessions to go to. Babysitting is going to be an issue, but I'm hopeful we'll make them.
It wasn't an opposite approach that DB, but it works very well with my POV here on the blog. I believe that the emotional state of myself and my W was a critical component that needs mending.
Lots of the advice here is about GAL or to detatch. RV is not about that at all. In fact, it is against it in one way.
The idea of GAL/detatching is that you work on you, ignoring the other. RV tells us that we GAL to attach, not to detach emotionally to the spouse.
I'm now seeing the idea of GAL as written in DB, I think, more as the author intended it. When a S leaves, you need to not attach ONE sided to a spouse (cling, pursue), but rather find ways to attach together. In many situations here, the other spouse is out of the picture, so this might not be possible.
Detatchment might be to allow healing and growth from the experience.
At some point though, I think both spouses might get into piecing, and that is where RV has it's impact. It also might make some couples ready to patch up their marriage and deal with the hurt and trust issues.
Instead of saying, you hurt me and now you need to make ME trust you, RV seems to be (so far) saying that I need to find reasons to trust YOU by communicating together in safe, controlled emotional ways.
Since my W had problems with language barriers, and a couple cultural ones, we didn't get as much yet.
There are things we have to do at home, though, and with patience and prayer, I hope I can do it and more at home at a slower pace for her.
I'm still in a 'shell-shocked' mode, having a real emotional rollercoaster. I also felt a few moments of love, something I am now sure I have NEVER felt for my W until now.
So it was worth it. Anyone reading - consider going. It will hurt much, much more if a D happens. But it will be worth it because I really feel I have truly tried every approach.
DB: Work on me Book reading: Communication, understanding her POV and history RV: The emotional connection.
Instead of saying, you hurt me and now you need to make ME trust you, RV seems to be (so far) saying that I need to find reasons to trust YOU by communicating together in safe, controlled emotional ways.
CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP
I have a different opinion on GAL. GAL builds self esteem. GAL is choosing and creating healthy habits instead of destructive ones. GAL is finding you again. GAL is strength. GAL is the gift we give ourselves. GAL is I believe in me.
Flowers always make people better, happier, and more helpful; they are sunshine, food and medicine for the soul. unconditional love is awesome!
Thanks, CB - I like how you phrased that part about GAL. It does seem a bit different than how I have heard it on these boards. Usually, I have read posts that talk about GAL that is more like, 'forget your spouse, let them come to you ready to work'.
The way you put it makes a lot of sense in that it doesn't need to exclude a spouse that way.
OTMT, you deserve a lot of credit for going to RV. You've been very honest about your feelings for your W and your ambivalence about the M. It is truly remarkable that you discovered the first inklings of love for your W at RV. It's not going to be easy doing the followup stuff at home with the kids and the distractions. I hope that you can both make it a priority. Has your W given you feedback about the weekend?
me: 42 | STBXH: 41 | T: 18 | M: 10 | separation: Jan 3, 2010 | they deserve better: S7 & D4 current thread: http://tinyurl.com/3y8sxcp .: first breathe, then heal, then start LIVING :.
Her committment fluctuated a lot. She had felt rejected, so since I didn't love her for who she is, then there was no hope. Other days, she felt like any kind of D would be rediculous because we were meant for each other.
I think it is fair to say a lot of her feelings were reactions to my own or what had gone on that day.
Opening up brought her some more hope - partly because she felt I was more committed to the R and my heart was opening up more to her. I was telling her mostly negatives from the two charts, but she and I felt more connected by it.
So now, her committment is OK. Not good. Not bad. Keep in mind, TBL, that she doesn't understand all the vocab and questions. Also, she has a lot of pride so she doesn't ask much, either. I think, had she been able to get more from the RV weekend, she'd be more committed.
Overall - she's still afraid things will not last, but she's more open to change. Time will tell. I figure if I keep changing/improving in response to the activities and other changes in my life, we can grow closer as long as I can get past the cultural/miscommunication barriers.
What about you TBL, how did last night go? Did she give it her all or did she do all but give?
Her committment fluctuated a lot. She had felt rejected, so since I didn't love her for who she is, then there was no hope. Other days, she felt like any kind of D would be rediculous because we were meant for each other.
I think it is fair to say a lot of her feelings were reactions to my own or what had gone on that day.
Opening up brought her some more hope - partly because she felt I was more committed to the R and my heart was opening up more to her. I was telling her mostly negatives from the two charts, but she and I felt more connected by it.
So now, her committment is OK. Not good. Not bad. Keep in mind, TBL, that she doesn't understand all the vocab and questions. Also, she has a lot of pride so she doesn't ask much, either. I think, had she been able to get more from the RV weekend, she'd be more committed.
Overall - she's still afraid things will not last, but she's more open to change. Time will tell. I figure if I keep changing/improving in response to the activities and other changes in my life, we can grow closer as long as I can get past the cultural/miscommunication barriers.
What about you TBL, how did last night go? Did she give it her all or did she do all but give?
But are you improving for her , you , or both of you?
This is where GAL again comes into play. Being selfish by creating healthy habits and healthy choices for yourself only does one thing. It improves yourself. Your worth. Your self esteem. Healthy habits and healthy choices. The effects are profound. And all those who interact with you on a daily basis will feed off this and eventually when the two important foundations of trust and friendship have been built you will have to ability to build a wall and then one day add a door to intimacy. Healthy habits and healthy choices , builds respect. Respect builds trust and friendship. Trust and friendship builds love.
Its a good path.
Flowers always make people better, happier, and more helpful; they are sunshine, food and medicine for the soul. unconditional love is awesome!
I got a call from one of the program presenters to see if I was having any problems with the nightly activites - awesome, eh?
I told her that it feels like a rollercoaster that is on a massive incline, but the fear is what lay ahead. It is fair to say we've all had enough problems to know that they are lurking out there. What is strange for me is that I've had a few major blowouts, but I am still feeling closer, not farther, from the woman I was ready to leave.
My W is from Yemen. I have no relation to the country beyond her except a fun vacation during university and having studied a second language there. Her English is much better, but she still can't quite "get" what I'm saying. Along with self-esteem issues, it was a recipe for marital disaster. But here I am, feeling love for the first time, her mentioning that when I hold her it feels different (better).
Our D date is in May. I'm seriously reconsidering now. A month ago, I was 20% staying. Now...60-90% depending on the minute...
I wonder what your wife is feeling? You probably wonder even more...is love developing or is she holding it back?
A breakthrough for me last night came when I told my W about some personal info that I thought would stay between me and God. While it wasn't shocking, she suspected that issue throughout our M. And then, repeately, she told me how she was proud of me and said saw it as courageous that I opened up at all. She added that it felt like a wall had fallen between us. Go figure!
I reminded her that we're not out of the woods, yet, but that I am in a dream-like state to think I could ever want to hold her and just sit with her. Infatuation? Maybe. I'm enjoying it though!
As cold as this sounds, I still am worried that we can't make it as H and W. I am not physically attracted to her, and we have many miscomm and other issues. I still have a lingering thought that "trading" her for another might feel good. I guess I'm telling you this TBL because your W might be having these kind of thoughts or others that are "destructive" or painful. She also might be holding back her love in fear, or many other things.
Remember the DB thing - don't pursue. Attract.
I'm the "WAH" in some ways, so I can get as close as I want fearlessly knowing she wants more. Watch your Ws for signs that she's flooded or burning out. Make sure to consider Lotus' advice to listen well. Keep doing 180s to prove you are trying.
RV brings love and emotion. It doesn't stop me and my W from arguing or make us understand each others' langauge. That takes patience and work.
If this makes sense, I'm doing 80% RV, but keeping 20% DB (working on myself, becoming a better spouse, dealing with my own issues). The W in one of our presenting couples told of her H's gambling issues. He works very hard now to control it, but there are issues still there. She accepts him fully now even with his issues, this is her "180". If he stopped the gambling though, wouldn't her love only deepen?
If I could ask you a couple things TBL: How'd the dial go last night/today? Is she fully doing it or just giving a bit?
Do you think it matters if she (or you)isn't answering it "right", but you are still doing the job?
Did you decide to leave her to talk about the EA (if there was one)?
