Are regrets when you end a separation normal?

[Onthemountaintop]

My IC Wed night told me that from what I had told her (+she was our MC last year), my W would likely not be changing very quickly, if at all. That would mean I would need to keep making concessions, not compromises as in many areas of disagreement between W & I, W feels that movement from her POV is giving up (so she doesn't).

I didn't tell my W when she asked how the IC went when she asked so I didn't eat feet. The next day, I did have a big talk with W because I was at home to watch the kids as she had surgery later that day.

I began with positive, the fact that I might be starting to feel some love. Then I said that it might be fear of the consequences, too.

I ended my recounting of where I was at be telling her that I'm really trying to make our M work, but I needed to get the fear out of the way. I explained that my fear of trying to live off 50% of my income as a teacher and losing my kids was making it impossible for me to know if I am feeling love, or fear of being alone.

I needed to see that I had two directions to go where the kids come first, we come EQUALLY second. Where the kids don't feel like they have a home with her, and a closet with me. Where my own love for my kids wouldn't be sacrificed so I or she could live apart.

She has had a real problem with my main suggestion which I've been holding on to since October. That IF we D, we get a house with 2 entrances and lock off any connection between. Then, divide up land, responsibilities.

I can't imaging how she'd feel knowing that I might be looking at marriage in the basement. Still, by having a shared house, we save about 20% of my monthly salary, the kids get a full sized yard. Most of all, they get to know that while life would certainly change and that the family they knew was going end, but that we are both 'there' for them for a few years before moving our separate ways.

After the surgery, we were driving home and she started to talk about it, but I said there was no rush to tell me what she wanted. This morning, she told me that she agreed. It would be hard, but for the sake of our 5 kids, she'd do it.

Weirdest part, I felt a bit warmer in my chest because she was willing to do something she's had problems with - compromise. I told her it made me feel better to be with her for making that decision. Usually, if I hit a nerve, she backs off and sticks to the lowest option. I really, really hope this wasn't the affect of being put to sleep for surgery!

2 more weeks to Retrouvialle...

I'm certain now that if come the end of the Retro weekend I still want to leave, that I will plan to continue D mediation which we stopped 2 months ago, and then plan to live separately in a one month only basement suite lease.

What I really need is this: DOES ANYONE HAVE A LOVE METER? Something like a blood pressure monitor, but for love. I could wear it on my arm, she'll see it go up and down and I'll see hers, and then we'll self adjust to 100% loving~

[flowmom]

OTMT, I have trouble understanding you.

You don't need a love meter. You need to be a man of action when it comes to loving. You've read this before in this thread, but love is a choice.

You love her more because she gives into your divorce plan? I'm getting really mixed messages from you. On one hand you despise her for her submissiveness, but on the other hand, you love her when she submits? Are you working on control issues in IC? That's what I'm picking up as a big issue for you.

I apologize if I'm being hard on you. I've noticed that I tend to have harder reactions with the guys in the forum because I have more trouble relating.

I know I've recommended a lot of books to you, but given your choice to become a father of 5 children with this woman, I think this would be worth reading:

http://www.amazon.com/Imperfect-Harmony-Married-Children-Still/dp/031228974X

My H ordered it the day that he told me how hopeless he was feeling about our M. I wonder if he read it...

[Onthemountaintop]

Thanks flowmom. I've gotten some rough comments, but I'm still here because I've found things that have worked so far.

Thanks for the book idea - I just finished it last Sun. The author talked about grieving...I'm trying to...not yet there.

Love meter - just a joke. Another poster said that love is a choice AFTER infatuation. I never got the infatuation - just jumped into caring for her. We tried a couple dates, I did a '2nd wedding' to try to get something going...

I don't want her submitting to something she doesn't like. If she had other options, that would be a turn-on! Usually, if she cares, it needs to be 100% her way. If she doesn't (most things) she doesn't give much for feedback, planning, invovlement. For example, I suggested we buy a house last year (we're in a duplex). She agreed, but didn't want to look at new houses with me. She would make absoulte statements, but not look for common ground. Finally, I found new area she accepted, got plans and everything done (it was like pulling teeth to get any feedback from her), and then a week after the deposit, she said she never wants to live in that area.

Yes, I control. I control because she leaves me no choice. If I didn't, she wouldn't have gone to see her father's grave overseas after he died, she never would've gone to English classes (people now compliment her on it), she never would have done her surgery, etc. I don't mean encourage, she wouldn't do them. Weird, is that not? So I have to choose between that, and contolling.

I brought it up to my IC last time, to which she said that I presented the need to compromise more, not so much control. The control thing for me is an issue most when I feel that she is controlling me, and won't budge or listen to reason. For example, she wouldn't take the kids to dentist appts that she made, because she felt that it was my job to do it. So even though I'm working and can't take time off under my work contract for this, the homemaker who is at home won't take them because she couldn't drive there.

I'm starting an anger-managment thing next month so I can work on not reacting to her, but responding. Hoping I'm not just playing victim, I think I've been emotionally battered by her over the years. She has from me, too. If I didn't control her into counselling, there is no way I could've lived with her emotional unstability, never mind love her.

Has it worked? Well, for once, I'm starting to feel something...but as TryTryAgain worried, I might be just feeling fine for today, but then be giving up later on. I have to be sure it isn't fear. 5 kids of child support for a non-working immigrant wife is very expensive. What's worse, is that my salary is low enough that we'd both be in pretty high stress. She also very badly wants our kids in my school (private, religious) and while I get a discount, it could never be afforded after a D.

If he did read it, it might explain why he's where he is. AFTER reading all the other books, that one helped me with accept that I could be happy in life, without being satisfied with my W. A great message for a man with many kids, or who is very attached to them. Also great for those who want money more than a warm, loving home for both spouses and family. If I were Catholic, I'd have to go fully into it because D isn't an option. To some degree, I partly match those ideals, so it was only partly helpful (and very interesting).

[flowmom]

I'm starting an anger-managment thing next month so I can work on not reacting to her, but responding. Hoping I'm not just playing victim, I think I've been emotionally battered by her over the years. She has from me, too. If I didn't control her into counselling, there is no way I could've lived with her emotional unstability, never mind love her.

I think that you've both suffered a lot from the pain of cultural misunderstandings and mismatches. I still think that you need professional help with dealing with this stuff. I would recommend a social worker who is very familiar with your W's culture who could bridge your communication gaps. This may even be a free service for your family. There are services out there for immigrants...there must be so many couples here who are dealing with the same issues.

[Onthemountaintop]

Thanks for following up Flowmom,

Social worker? Not MC?

Could you explain that further?

[flowmom]

Thanks for following up Flowmom,

Social worker? Not MC?

Could you explain that further?

I would guess that there are more social workers available to offer culture-specific support to intercultural families than MCs. Social workers deal with all of the "life stuff" that immigrants deal with so they have the big picture of everything that is contributing to your M issues. I'm no expert on this stuff, but I think it would be worth looking into. You and your W speak the same language, but you need a cultural translator, IMO.

[Onthemountaintop]

JUST VENTING...

So my wife wears a veil (like Mary). I brought my brother who I rarely see home after having coffee with him to get two books for him that I forgot on the ledge by the door. I forgot that she wouldn't be wearing her veil. I saw her, she saw him, and she went upstairs. I immediately apologized, twice. He saw my kids for a few minutes, then I brought him home. I came back and she was angry.

I apologized a 3rd time, reminding her it was a mistake. Biting at my words, she flooded. So I left and tried the conversation a couple hours later. I asked her if I have done that before. She mentioned two times where she had a big role in the problem. Then I asked her to tell me about the 3rd time. She got very angry and refused to tell me because I was "judging" her. She expects I should've called first to tell her - even though I just forgot~

So...another battle lost.

[MrBond]

"So...another battle lost."

Why do you fight a battle you know you cannot win. She will stay angry at you no matter what it is for because she CHOOSES to stay angry.

You should have just apologized once and that's it. Sincerely of course, but don't overdo it. She knows she can play with your emotions so she "gets angry" and you grovel all over her.

Get your self-respect back. That's Rule No. 1.

[Onthemountaintop]

Thanks MrB - I thought that one apology was enough, too. She didn't respond, so at first, I thought she didn't hear me (or want to hear me).

Repeating it probably only got me more frustrated...

[Onthemountaintop]

Noticing that W and I are arguing more. She's getting hyper defensive. Either way, Retrou is this weekend...