Sorry to hear of recent events. I'm not at all surprised to hear that your S9 is aware of what's going on. You don't have to tell your kids about their mom and OM; they will figure it out when they're old & mature enough.
I'm not sure that night you were talking about when S5 changed his mind was "your" night or not, but if the kids are scheduled to spend the night with you then I don't think you should let your sons pick which parent to stay with, and they should be staying with you. I think that isn't good anyway, consistency is better, and made worse by the fact it's apparent your XW is bribing the kids to ensure they spend the night with her. I think it gives the kids more power than they should have. Your S' are old enough to stick to a schedule, and I should think the parenting coordinator would back you up on that too.
I know it's irritating b/c of the crappy parenting our X's do and the over-focus on their OPs, but you have to let it go. It's not good for you; she is not being a good mom, accept it and just work on being the best dad you can be!!! Re: the boy scouts; make sure to take them every time you have them, and on her nights let it go. You just have to focus on you and your boys, and not focus so much on your X and OM. I know that's easier said than done!!! ((((((((((((nc)))))))))))
It's not good for you; she is not being a good mom, accept it and just work on being the best dad you can be!!! Re: the boy scouts; make sure to take them every time you have them, and on her nights let it go. You just have to focus on you and your boys, and not focus so much on your X and OM. I know that's easier said than done!!!
Good points. I just spent $145 to register my son for baseball, and he will probablt only get to play half the games and will miss a lot of practices, because X said "I do not agree with Baseball and will not support it." He won't take the kids to their activities if it is too far aor inconvenient for him.
"You can't stop the waves, but you can learn to surf." Jon Kabat-Zinn
Hello, all, thanks for all of your words. I can't tell you how much they help.
Kerry, that's a funny link. I've heard Misisipi Mike's work before.
Thanks for the good thoughts, Cat.
Karen, to explain: Every Monday I take S9 to his cub scout den meetings. On my weeks of custody, his little brother, S5, stays the evening with his mother, since I am busy with the den. At first, it was just until the den meeting was over, and S9 and I would stop by and pick up S5 on our way back to my place. But then S5 started announcing he really wanted to stay with his mother instead of coming home with me. I have been a fool, for fear of looking like a brute to my son were I to have denied him his mother, but now it's become a habit. xW is now thinking it needs to be permanent arrangement because S5 is still "so young and needs his mommy".
I think I need to stop that. I am coming to the mindset that I would rather I placed S5 with a sitter than put up with xW's presumption.
Thanks for the hugs.
BND, I put up a lot of expense for S9's scouting activities, for which xW does nothing to compensate. Now I am preparing to enroll S5 into the local soccer program that his older brother had once participated in -- I dare say that despite xW's nagging inquiries and prying about how I involve my S's in outside activities, she won't lift a finger to do any of the heavy lifting herself, but yet she will insist on taking all the glory for their accomplishments and insinuate herself into the special events.
Take this weekend's Scout Sunday as an example.
As it turns out, she did manage to get S9 to this evening's service as she had promised and signed up for. However she insisted on bringing the OM.
I got to the church early myself, but unfortunately I am on call for work this week. I got called away to resolve an issue. Before I left I was coming to the impression that xW would be a no-show. (I left to find a Wi-Fi hotspot that I could dial into my office and resolve an issue.)
I got back about fifteen minutes after the service had already started -- and I was surprised to see xW's minivan. But when I went inside I took a peek inside and saw that they were all seated in a row in the back of the sanctuary -- and OM was with them.
I don't know what to say. Something held me back and I could not enter the service at that point. I hovered outside in the hallway peeking through the windows and debating whether I wanted to go in and risk a scene -- especially with my S's there.
There they were in a row, their backs to me, xW, S9, OM and S5 -- and it sickened me.
I paced down the hall to gather my wits and breath some air - trying to marshal the seething anger and pain welling up within me. What hurt me most was seeing OM's arm around S5 -- and S5's head leaning his head upon OM.
I went back to the building's entrance and stood like a sentry (wearing my scout leader's uniform) and pondered this frak'ed-up world we live in. I prayed to God for calmness and strength, and I wrestled with what the right reaction should be.
So many thoughts and emotions were overwhelming me. The horror of it all. The injustice, the vile heartlessness. The sheer lack of conscience. The foolish recklessness. The offensiveness to everything that the service represented.
And I wondered at how dismally foolish xW could be in allowing someone like that get so close to these children -- without really knowing who he is. She has never even thought to run the background checks on OM that I have, or to even question the history of his frequent trysts with women with children of other M's. What drives a man to seek out, not once but three other times, married women with children? Is it not unreasonable to wonder if his target is not the mothers but their children?
I have no such evidence against OM, so I am not saying with any certainty that he is such a predator -- he may or may not be. But the point is that, at the same time, neither can she provide assurances that these easily drawn perceptions are not true. Something's just not right with this picture here, even when you put the A aside.
Okay, I know I need to stop focusing on xW and OM. And yes that's easier said than done. I am still responsible for my S's well being. But she's going to obviously marry this creep. I am dead certain that's where xW is heading or at least believes she's heading. It remains to be seen what his real intentions are. Still, knowing xW, I put my money on her ability to coerce the cretin into marrying her, eventually.
So there's nothing I can do to thwart that. Frankly, I don't really care about what she does anymore as long as my kids are not involved or harmed in any way. And there's the rub -- I don't believe for one second she has anything left in her soul that would put our S's ahead of her own desires. And as such she will delude herself into thinking OM is a good person, even if he were to turn out to be the worst of predators and a pedophile.
I wish there was some way to reason with xW, to get her to see the wisdom in discretion. But then if she were capable of that we'd likely never have had a reason to D in the first place.
I'd like to say to her that I don't want our S's to be around OM -- ever. At the very least, I don't want him ever to come in physical contact with my S's - it's just not natural and unseemly. He is not their parent and he has never been a parent -- he needs to stay away from my kids.
I would like to say to xW: For once, put the shoe on the other foot. If I had been the adulterer and if I had been the one to rip our family apart and had I been the one who was attempting to supplant her with my intended A-partner, she would react no less threatened and alarmed for our S's well being. She would be demanding that our S's never be exposed to an OW -- in fact she would be trying to sue me for full custody.
I also can't fathom how brazenly she brings her partner in sin into the church that I and my S's attend. She has no shame and no conscience. Were I to have done such a thing she would have openly asked the pastor to cast me out of the service.
I just don't get how someone can live with themselves when they have done such things, are continuing to do such things.
Right now I am too conflicted -- so I'm going to sleep on this. I will pray for guidance, for the wisdom to act or not act, for the peace and the patience to persevere, and the faith to be able to accept that God's will shall be done.
I can understand your aprehension about the OM with your kids. The same thoughts have gone through my head. In fact, those thoughts happened so early on in my situation that I called him up so as to find out what kind of guy he is.
I cannot argue against what has occured to your marriage and family. It happened. Sh!t happens. What your XW and OM did is absolutely disgusting, and even though I am not religious, I would still call it a sin. A violation of basic morality and honor.
What if they do get married? And your kids have a step father. They may even call him dad. That is my reality and I am accepting it and am not letting it eat away at me. I just do the best I can when the kids are with me and they know that I am their real dad. I teach them morality through my actions and consistency. I am letting them come to their own conclusions over time as what right and wrong is. I trust that they are smart and perceptive kids.
I know you hold a lot of resentment because he and your exW are both responsible for breaking apart your family. But I think your anger towards this situation is just going to make it harder for you to heal and move forward. Some people (well maybe a lot) just dont have very high morals. But instead of trying to figure out why someone can stoop so low, you need to learn to detach more. Become more of an easy come, easy go, happy go lucky sort of guy.
It is up to you whether you want to continue to fight this in your mind. As long as you do, you jeopradize your long term happiness and become a turn off for future ladies. I believe it is so very much easier to be friends than enemies. It just takes a leap of accepting that things are what they are.
I hear what you're saying, Kerry. It makes sense to a degree, but then only to a degree.
It's become a no-win situation, especially if one has morals, scruples, call-it-what-you-like. The thing I struggle with is that I know that by my faith that I must ask God to help me to forgive those who harm me and my S's, and to seek peace for my S's sake if not my own. Christ asks that we cast out the root of bitterness -- and that is a constant struggle for me now, with every day a new offense being added to her lengthy rap sheet.
But at the same time I am confronted with the insanity that it is I alone who is expected to compromise -- and that leaves a foul taste in my mouth. Conversely, I am also charged with leading my family away from wrongful teachings and worldly values -- such that "not a hoof is to be left behind". Thus finding the right balance is difficult to discern, even if there is one.
I am still musing over these new developments and the conflict I am feeling. If I had to err one way or the other I must err on the side of truth, honor and integrity. That means that even if I wanted to just give up the fight, I am bound not to. I cannot compromise my values, at least not to the extent that peace with xW would demand. And as I have yet to find a middle ground that does not still cause me grief, I must hold the line. I will continue to pray and seek a way, but I will not cross the bounds to which I have committed to God. You see, the very sins that make up my own contribution to the demise of my M and the resulting break-up of my family, stems entirely from my weak-willed yielding to compromise, especially in the latter years of our M. I sacrificed much of my personal values to accommodate a W who only wanted her own way regardless, and I was too blind to see it. It is thus that I slowly became so materialistic and strayed from Godly ways.
So I will now only bend so much but not abrogate my convictions, even if it that will ultimately cost me. I have already paid a dire cost for not sticking by my convictions -- I think it might make more sense if I try the opposite tact from now on.
Will that mean I will end up sacrificing my chance for "happiness"? Well, I guess by most people's standards, perhaps so. I'm not in this for transient, worldly concepts of "happiness". That's not what life is about. If pursuit of such ideals is what is now paramount in everyone's eyes, to exclusion of other ideals, is it any wonder that the world is in such a sad state?
Honestly, yes, like everyone ever born, I too want to realize some happiness in my life, but never at the expense of others. Even so, I would rather learn to know the comfort of peace and joy even in the face of adversity. I am still learning -- I am stumbling and fumbling around as I attempt to learn to find joy, true joy, in life.
Will that be a turn-off to others? I don't doubt it. But then I guess those women who want to believe life is only worth living if you are happy all the time would not really interest me anyway. I spent 18 years with just such a person, who thought my sole reason for existing and for being her H was to make sure she was always happy and satisfied, 24x7. That's too large a burden for any mortal person to take on.
My struggle now is trying to prevent her selfish ways from infecting our S's. She seems to be doing everything she can, within the law, to inculcate our boys into accepting a world of compromised values. That is the pain to which I feel most -- not the A, not the OM, those I can put behind me (comparatively) easily -- it's the attempts to indoctrinate my S's and alienate them from me, their father.
In writing this it just struck me: At the risk of sounding like another geek, it suddenly reminded me of Star Wars, where the Emperor and Darth Vader are trying to turn Luke Skywalker to the Dark Side of the Force. Return of the Jedi. Their objective is to anger Luke by threatening his loved one, his sister Leia, such that his anger turns him to the Dark Side.
Perhaps the Enemy is using xW to threaten my S's moral character, with the ulterior motive of driving me to anger and bitterness, thus neutralizing my ability to carry out my convictions anyway.
Nerdy, yes, but something to ponder. (Hey, I'm the father of two small boys who are unrestrainable, implacable SW fans -- what d'ya expect?)
My struggle now is trying to prevent her selfish ways from infecting our S's.
NC, that's not your job though. You know I believe God takes care of His children, and you shouldn't be worrying about that. My X is similar to your X, but my kids have not been at all infected or whatever you want to call it; and I know yours will be ok too! Kids are perceptive and sometimes smarter than their parents; you should trust in your sons too.
I worry about my kids as well. W, her mom and her two sisters are deeply troubled people. They aren't so depressed they can't function. They just operate slightly below happy, always blaming others for their unhappiness and searching for the magic ... something ... that will make them happy.
So far, D10 is starting to worry me. She's got a lot of me in her, but she also is starting to develop self-esteem issues like her mom.
D7 is all me all the way. A clown. Afraid of nothing. Unfortunately tempermental though.
W won't talk to them at all about the D so they ask me. I'm doing my best. W thinks all kids adapt. That's true, but all kids are damaged in D as well. She doesn't want to admit that.
Me: 47, Ds 17-13, D final 6-11 http://tinyurl.com/yk4e2tz http://tiny.cc/thread2 http://tinyurl.com/ydtphqu http://tinyurl.com/thread4 http://tinyurl.com/3sm78k6 http://tinyurl.com/thread6
I can only trust my children so far. Because of D, I am only able to parent them 50% of the time. The other part of the time xW is constantly feeding them with her twisted mindset.
Let's face it, her objective is all the more easy for her to attain than mine own. Given the sinful nature of Man. She can indulge my S's with toys, lavish vacation trips, desserts, fattening foods, and leniency. She can easily appeal to their baser instincts and fulfill their materialistic desires. While all I offer is discipline and and a life of duty, work and financial restraint. Out of necessity, I am as far from being a "Disneyland Dad" as I can be, even if I wanted to be.
And I am subsidizing through these CS payments to xW her ability to undermine everything I do. She still refuses to give me an itemized accounting for what she spends this money on.
I trust God's will be done. But I also know that He has given His children free will to determine their own choices in life. As such the Enemy assails us with every temptation and distraction to great advantage -- not for any lack in God but in ourselves.
I have personally seen too many children of good and faithful Christians, who did everything right, stray from the Faith, many yet to ever return. It worries me greatly that my failure in my M is proving to be a serious handicap to the moral and spiritual development of my children. I chose for my life's partner with utmost foolishness -- but that is my sin, and it should not be a cost my S's have to pay.
I almost wish my two were already teenagers before this D happened -- I would wish I had had a better chance to firm up the foundation of their moral character before all this had taken place. Right now, they are still much too young and impressionable.
And Karen, it is my job. It is my obligation as a parent so blessed by God to have children that I must raise them up in the way of the Lord, lest they depart from it. But if I take a laissez-faire attitude regarding xW's attempts to water down my efforts, then she will succeed in instructing them that Truth is relative and subject to self-righteous determination -- totally anathema to any true moral code of living. And rather than the liberation such views falsely promise it only becomes a damning millstone tied around one's soul.
I hear and see both positive and negative results in my S's words and deeds of late. Yes, S9 sees things as they are, but he is still too young to understand them fully and to know the dangers they represent. He has outstanding powers of observation, but his mother is unrelentless in her ability of persuasion. She has done yeoman's work to try to convince him what he sees is not what he thinks. I hear the lies she has fed him in his words to me. I hear her coaching both of my S's in their telephone conversations with me -- and I can tell instantly when an answer is one she has supplied and not something they would have normally said on their own.
Shall I trust her? I can indeed put my trust in God, but can I trust xW? I know that I am supposed to believe that God is in control of all things, and I do -- save that one thing: Free Will. So does anyone think that God will intercede on behalf of my S's when xW is exercising her very own Free Will -- with which God does not interfere? I cannot. That's not to say that God will not work directly with each of my S's -- but they are still much too young to make wise spiritual decisions for themselves. And that is why God commands us (in Deuteronomy, Proverbs, etc.) to lead our children until they can do so on their own.
I seem to keep repeating myself in this comment. I am struggling with this, trying to find the right balance, in accordance to myself and my S's and all these "outside" influences.
CTH, it sounds like you've been facing some of the same dilemmas.
What haunts me is that my ex is a poster child for D and what can go wrong in the lives of such children. Her own mother abandoned her and her sister (chasing after another man) when she was but an insecure early teenager. I think that has caused so much deep-seated damage to her that it has become manifest throughout her character. She is now following so closely in her mother's destructive footsteps that it gives me nightmares -- and I truly worry for the sake of my S's and pray constantly that this curse not be passed on to them.
Quote:
They just operate slightly below happy, always blaming others for their unhappiness and searching for the magic ... something ... that will make them happy.
Had an exchange of words via email with xW this morning.
I gave her a brief, fair warning about the infraction from Friday night and that I would be contacting the Parenting Coordinator (PC) to let him know. xW fired back that she was perfectly right in what she did and that she and OM were going to get married within a month, so I'd better start getting used to co-parenting with he as well as her. (This is the first admission by her directly to me about her plan. I found that interesting.)
...
I did call the PC this morning. He first began apologizing for not calling me back, as xW had contacted him weeks ago about the last infraction and he was supposed to have contacted me afterward to let me know. I then briefly appraised him of the latest situation.
He set me straight on a number of things, made valid arguments, but then I had my counter-arguments. He said it was natural for me to be upset and to not want to be marginalized from a firm role in my S's lives, but he tried to stress to me that if xW marries OM it is expected that he take a parental role in that household. It depends on the degree, of course.
He asked me (rhetorically) shouldn't OM take on a co-parent role with respect to my S's. I asked him why? He asked me to clarify and I said OM would be nothing more to my kids than the husband of their mother. No need for another father in their lives, despite what xW might want.
I could tell he was somewhat sympathetic to my stance but at the same time he was trying to rationalize the situation for me, to ameliorate my reaction to these events. In particular he asked me, hypothetically, that were I to get married again, would I not want my new wife to act as a parent to my children as well? I replied, "Why? And to what degree? Is it mandatory that I have my wife usurp the role of xW in the lives of my S's? No, My new wife would simply be the wife of my children's father, not their parent -- I see xW (for better or worse) as the mother of my S's. It would never be my desire to supplant xW in their minds and heart, or to confuse the issue for them at all. The person I marry would have to understand that."
That seemed to get the PC to think a bit.
Folks, as an aside, I knew in my heart for that to be so. Much as I would love my next wife, my first responsibility (after God) is to my S's, at least until they are grown. I would want my S's to treat my wife and even the OM with respect as adult figures in the household. But I do not want them to be co-equal with their natural parents. Ever.
(Except of course, in the unfortunate demise of one of us <heaven forbid>, the other parent of the surviving couple could legally adopt the natural parent's children, if that's how it legally pans out.)
Maybe I'm crazy and unreasonable. I don't know.
The PC then tried to explain that he hoped that xW was not, as I described, trying to play "house" with our children present. "That would be unfortunate." But if they do get M'ed, he added, I would be facing this situation with their actions legally sanctioned. I told him that's not my concern so much as xW continual encroachment on my ability to effectively parent my S's and supplanting me in their minds with OM. My fear is that this is yet another progression on this slippery slope she has placed us since before our separation. I described for him several incidents including the Scout Sunday service on Saturday night and said that it is apparent to me that xW means to marginalize me over time to non-status in S9 and S5's lives. This has been xW's dream since before I became aware of her betrayal -- I have never seen her vary from this goal, except to make minor, easily-reversible concessions along the way. This M is just another milestone in her plan.
The PC said again he hoped not. He then said he wanted to contact xW today and to discuss with her these new developments, get her side of the story. He wants to talk to her and he would then contact me later today. So we left it at that.
I am certain that xW is merely going to lie through her teeth again to the PC. She has tried to make it seem that whenever I contradict her in front of the kids (or over the phone) that that amounts to me being "verbally abusing" of my children -- not her, but the kids. This is evidence that she confuses her well-being and her very self with that of our S's, as if what's good or bad for her directly effects our S's, but my own welfare is totally irrelevant in her mind to anyone.
