DB VETS - HELP!!

[dburt]

When my wife was wanting a divorce I found her reading a book on how to tell the children about divorce. I told her that she will not have me there justifying her actions. She could not believe that I would actually not be there to be on the same page as this would be best for the children, so says the book. I said, "best for the children, the irony of all of this is killing me" I will be there but I will stop you if you do not tell the truth about me to them.

Luckily the children will never know how close the conversation came to fruition.

Burt

[Puppy Dog Tails]

You mean, the Greek that saved her marriage, THAT Greek?

Puppy

[CABBR]

You mean, the Greek that saved her marriage, THAT Greek?

Puppy

Yes sir.

[Heartbroken20]

Thanks for the feedback. My approch all along has been that since this is her idea, she has to fend for herself. She is hoping I will cooperate so it doesn't get messy for the kids, etc., and we can still be friends and actively coparent without tension.

So many of our divorced friends/neighbors can not speak or act with civility toward each other and it's that much harder on all involved. So I'm hoping no matter what happens, we can at least be cordial and hopefully cooperative when it comes to kid stuff.

I don't want the divorce but also don't want her doing anything stupid with filing, etc., as the precludes any chance of using Collaborative Law, which I personally feel is "least harmful" way to divorce, if it comes to that.

Her biggest obstacle is the retainer for her lawyer. It's over $3K and she knows she has to come up with the money herself. That will take a while for her to come up with but I'm not promising anything even if/when she does come up with it.

I don't want to "help" us divorce but also don't want to be "led" down that path by her actions and have to then react last minute to whatever she's done.

So meanwhile, I've gone pretty dim and have been GALing as best I can. Big talk with kids happens a week from today....dreading it. But it will be HER show with me there to offer my support and love to my girls and correct her if she tries to make it a "mutual" decision.

Any other thoughts?

[Heartbroken20]

HB20,

I am going through the exact same scenario. Couldn't agree more with your overall comments.

Greek explained to me how Coach handled it and I intend to follow that approach.

My W and I are meeting with a child psychologist this morning to discuss. I will make my W own it. She will try to argue that it's in the best interest of the children to hear that it was a mutual decision so as not to turn them away from her. My W also wants to provide handwritten books to the kids to explain what the new living arrangements will look like. Whatever.

I'm half exepecting my W to say I'm being selfish about it and in a way maybe I am, but I think the kids are entitled to an age appropriate truth and knowing whose decision it was seems appropriate.

CABBR

CABBR - So how did the discussion with the child psych go? Any suggestions?

Have you told your kids and if so, were you able to follow the "Coach Approach"? Must've broken your heart regardless.

When we told our kids we were seeing a C to help us "improve our communication skills" I felt horrible and my D16 didn't react well, started crying and ran out the door to "take a walk". Killed me to see it. My D13 just stayed and said okay but not sure she would show reaction outright. She is mostly very easy-going and much less dramatic but also tends to sit on things a little too long until she blows up. Trying to make this as easy as possible on both of them.

Anyway, please let me know how it went, mine is coming up this weekend.

[CABBR]

HB20,

I am going through the exact same scenario. Couldn't agree more with your overall comments.

Greek explained to me how Coach handled it and I intend to follow that approach.

My W and I are meeting with a child psychologist this morning to discuss. I will make my W own it. She will try to argue that it's in the best interest of the children to hear that it was a mutual decision so as not to turn them away from her. My W also wants to provide handwritten books to the kids to explain what the new living arrangements will look like. Whatever.

I'm half exepecting my W to say I'm being selfish about it and in a way maybe I am, but I think the kids are entitled to an age appropriate truth and knowing whose decision it was seems appropriate.

CABBR

CABBR - So how did the discussion with the child psych go? Any suggestions?

Have you told your kids and if so, were you able to follow the "Coach Approach"? Must've broken your heart regardless.

When we told our kids we were seeing a C to help us "improve our communication skills" I felt horrible and my D16 didn't react well, started crying and ran out the door to "take a walk". Killed me to see it. My D13 just stayed and said okay but not sure she would show reaction outright. She is mostly very easy-going and much less dramatic but also tends to sit on things a little too long until she blows up. Trying to make this as easy as possible on both of them.

Anyway, please let me know how it went, mine is coming up this weekend.

HB20,

The child psychologist was still firmly in the camp of don't tell them anything until you know what's going to happen and when. During the meeting I mentioned how my youngest, s6 is routinely saying things like "Mommy doesn't love us" and "Mommy doesn't want to be with us." (My W is currently working a number of part time jobs and taking a course at a local college and doesn't have a lot of time for the kids at night and on the weekend and also makes herself scarce when I am around.)My W professed surprise at this even though I had communicated this type of thing to her previously. (I stopped telling her when these incidents happened because of her blase reaction.)

Bottom line, we didn't drop the bomb on them yet. I may give it another week, but I'm thinking they need to be told. I think they deserve to know the truth (despite their ages, s6, s9) and my W seems to be stonewalling the situation in much the same way she avoided telling me anything for years. There is also a significant risk that my kids will learn of the divorce from someone other than their parents because my W has told a number of people who have kids friendly with ours.

Since the meeting my W has been very doting to my s6.

In so far as my approach, I still intend to make my W own it. However, my L came out strongly about not telling the kids whose decision it was to divorce. My L was saying that the LBS should take the high road and be vague about the reasons why as it would harm the kids' relationship with their Mother and could potentially backfire, etc.

It's hard to put aside or separate the legitmate feelings the LBS may have in wanting the WAS to own the consequences of their decision to leave the marriage with the kids' need to have a good relationship with each parent. At the same time which is more painful to the children: a slow gradual change in the family dynamic with all the attendant morally relativistic plattidudes about how families don't end by relationships do or just ripping the bandaid off and being honest about it. I don't have a good answer, but the way Coach handled it resonates with me.

All kids will ask why and my kids' BS meters are as good as anyone's. Even if I say NOTHING, they already know the score. My boys don't question whether I love them. And they see their Mother is not home a lot and question it.

CABBR

[Heartbroken20]

HB20,

The child psychologist was still firmly in the camp of don't tell them anything until you know what's going to happen and when.

Incidently, this has been my approach all along. Why put them on the same nightmare rollercoaster I'm on?

Bottom line, we didn't drop the bomb on them yet. I may give it another week, but I'm thinking they need to be told. I think they deserve to know the truth (despite their ages, s6, s9)

I think mine need to know the truth as well. Your kids are so much younger, it's really a tough call. I don't think they will REALLY understand what it means and my thought is you may want to consider having them go through the reaction/healing process only once rather than once now and perhaps again once everything's final. In my sitch, I think my girls would get upset with me if they thought I was "hiding" something this serious from them but they are teenagers and have more life experience under their belts. Your kids are younger and probably wouldn't think that way.

There is also a significant risk that my kids will learn of the divorce from someone other than their parents because my W has told a number of people who have kids friendly with ours.

THAT is one of my biggest fears, I don't want them hearing from someone/friend at school. Although my wife and I BOTH agreed to not tell anyone where we live, I know for a fact that she discusses it regularly with several of her local friends who are ALSO divorcing their husbands. She gets all sorts of "helpful" advice about which lawyer is best, what to make sure she should ask for, how not to look like the "bad guy" to our kids (IOW "how to make it look like Daddy was a jerk to her all along and she is finally standing up for herself and setting a "strong woman" example for them"). They say they are "supporting" each other in their time of need, but I think they are just comparing notes.

Since the meeting my W has been very doting to my s6.

Trying to ease her guilt...

In so far as my approach, I still intend to make my W own it. However, my L came out strongly about not telling the kids whose decision it was to divorce. My L was saying that the LBS should take the high road and be vague about the reasons why as it would harm the kids' relationship with their Mother and could potentially backfire, etc.

Sorry, but I think that lawyer is giving you a BIG STEAMY PILE of B.S. For me, I need my kids to know this is not my idea of how to react when you are having relationship problems. You don't just run away. My W is and will be responsible for damaging her relationship with our kids. That's her problem and hers alone. I will not save her from the consequences of her actions. (hooray, does that mean I am actually starting to detach? Sure hope so...)

I don't have a good answer, but the way Coach handled it resonates with me.

With me as well.

All kids will ask why and my kids' BS meters are as good as anyone's. Even if I say NOTHING, they already know the score. My boys don't question whether I love them. And they see their Mother is not home a lot and question it.

Counting on this and am actually curious as to what she will give them as her "reasons". If she tries to put words in my mouth or make it look like I'm in agreement, I will stop her immediately and correct her right in front of them.

I won't say anything that will make her look worse than she already will. I will just let her hang herself with the web she's woven. I think once she sees how they react, perhaps right then but most likely later, it may just be the wake-up call she should hear.

Thanks CABBR.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

In my opinion, if there is any chance whatsoever that your children are going to find out about it by someone OTHER than you (and it sounds like there's a pretty GOOD chance of that) . . .

Then you need to tell them, in an age-appropriate way, of course.

Puppy

[CABBR]

In my opinion, if there is any chance whatsoever that your children are going to find out about it by someone OTHER than you (and it sounds like there's a pretty GOOD chance of that) . . .

Then you need to tell them, in an age-appropriate way, of course.

Puppy

Thanks HB20.

I agree with PDT on this. Since your kids are quite a bit older HB20, it seems even more unfair to not tell them.

I have a birhday coming up in a week or so and have to make an overseas business trip next week. Last night I mentioned to my W that we should tell the kids before Thanksgiving because she intends to take them to my SIL's house for a couple of days and I will take them for the back half of the week, including the actual turkey day. My s9 will blow a gasket when he finds out that I am not going with them to SIL's house.

CABBR

[Heartbroken20]

In my opinion, if there is any chance whatsoever that your children are going to find out about it by someone OTHER than you (and it sounds like there's a pretty GOOD chance of that) . . .

Then you need to tell them, in an age-appropriate way, of course.

Puppy

Thanks HB20.

I agree with PDT on this. Since your kids are quite a bit older HB20, it seems even more unfair to not tell them.

I have a birhday coming up in a week or so and have to make an overseas business trip next week. Last night I mentioned to my W that we should tell the kids before Thanksgiving because she intends to take them to my SIL's house for a couple of days and I will take them for the back half of the week, including the actual turkey day. My s9 will blow a gasket when he finds out that I am not going with them to SIL's house.

CABBR

I agree as well since your W has told people with kids who know yours and also after rereading that your W has already filed in your signature (had forgotten that). As you probably know, there are BIG ears around even when you think they are busy doing something else. Unless the kids are physically not in the house, car, etc., you can bet they will hear the discussions sooner or later.

With the local friends, since they are not directly involved, they think less about if their kids are around, and who hears what, as your sitch doesn't really "apply" to them. A casual comment or question to their own spouses on the phone or alone in the kitchen can be overheard by THEIR kids, who might then ask your kids what's going on or why you two are divorcing.

Agree you will need to have the conversation before Thanksgiving since you all won't be together during that timeframe. It is going to be very tough and I feel your pain.

The "age-appropriate" way is also a challenge as your wife will be doing the talking per the Coach Approach. Hopefully, the two of you can agree on what she will say and how she will say it. My only advice there is let her keep revising her "story" until you feel it is appropriate for their ages. If you try to edit her, she'll see it as control. If she takes it down to their level on her own, she will be more likely to stick with her "script" and not shoot from the hip.

Incidentally, my birthday is coming up in the next couple of weeks as well. It will be interesting to see how it's handled. Father's Day was a "minimal effort" event so I am not expecting much.