Believe me I understand what you are saying but it's just not that cut and dried. Looking back through these years I see that we like the LBS also have a pretty similar script that we follow in our reactions. That's why we're able to get such good advice on here, we've all been there done that.
In the beginning everyone of my real life friends said, "you need to get mad", but I couldn't. It took 3 1/2 years until the reality of what was finally kicked in and made me stand up to a very screwed-up ex, but the truth is neither scenario really changed a thing. The only difference in my being "nice" was that it let him off the hook and lessened his guilt. I see that very clearly in the way this has panned out for fib as well as most others here.
Kevin...thank you for stopping by my thread and I appreciate your concern. There is no more anger on my part Kevin. I am the brunt of it. It is difficult for you to understand what is going on here without going back to the beginning and reading the entire history.
Over the last week Kevin:
a friend of mine passed away and my STBXW never told me
she stole the wake card I brought home
while putting my son to sleep after not seeing him for over a day and talking to him about his day, she walked into the room and insisted that I get out, making a scene in front of him even this late in our D
she keeps the children away from me as late as possible to minimize my time with them
she recently threw out a plant that a friend bought me as a gift
if the garbage is full while I am at work, she dumps the bag on the garage floor instead of putting in the can
Kevin...I shouldn't even be listing this.
No Kevin....I have no anger towards my STBXW nor do I show her anger. However, it is dished out to me constantly. Whether I am kind to her...text her to keep her informed..or try and offer her time with the kids instead of having my sister watch them....I am penalized, punished, motioned against, etc.
You are only a year into this Kevin, so, it probably behooves you to keep going and try. I am not sure if there has been infidelity involved in your sitch, but, since you are separated, I HIGHLY recommend that you read the the link I left on the other site. Women who are separated USUALLY do so to be with another man. Just be aware
Thanks for your concern and your input. FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
dncrm...what you described is 'enabling'. It is the classic error we make here in this forum. We ALLOW the behavior out of fear. We become afraid of our spouses. We become afraid of being alone. We are AFRAID of divorce.
We then avoid confrontation, anger, arguments and worst..we stop defining boundaries. Michelle does NOT ascribe to any of this.
Actually, I would venture to say that much of the advice given out here actually pushes our S's further away by making us appear as weak, vulnerable and unable to fight for THEM by making TOUGH DECISIONS or enforcing TOUGH LOVE.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
Looking back now I can see very clearly that this was enabling. Would I do it again? Probably. I wasn't (or didn't think I was) the strong person that I have found myself to be. I would bet that you would say much the same though fib. We somehow are of the mindset that if only we change, WE can fix them and make this all go away. How can you fix someone by changing when this was never really about us? We have to face the fact that although we may not have been the perfect at times (who is?),there is so much more going on here than we can possibly deal with. When push comes to shove or we finally have to come to grips with what we're dealing with, somehow we find a strength to do what we need to protect ourselves and our children. It doesn't mean we don't care about our spouses but there comes a time when we have got to love ourselves more AND to save ourselves.
fib the way I see it is that you are dealing with a very destructive and toxic personality. You've tried and tried and you are an honorable man. There is no one here that would dispute that. What you do know for sure is that you tried everything in the hopes of saving your marriage. Hopefully that in itself will bring you the peace we all long for at the end of this road.
dncrm...what you described is 'enabling'. It is the classic error we make here in this forum. We ALLOW the behavior out of fear. We become afraid of our spouses. We become afraid of being alone. We are AFRAID of divorce.
We then avoid confrontation, anger, arguments and worst..we stop defining boundaries. Michelle does NOT ascribe to any of this.
Actually, I would venture to say that much of the advice given out here actually pushes our S's further away by making us appear as weak, vulnerable and unable to fight for THEM by making TOUGH DECISIONS or enforcing TOUGH LOVE.
You've fought the good fight for your kids sake and the love of your wife. Know in your heart you've given your best and if she keeps digging the hole after you've filled it in then what can be done? Walking away to a smoothe path is sometimes the only option.
EX's can eventually become nicer. Will it happen, eventually I suppose. I just recently had a friend request from an ex that left me after 5 yrs. together. We hadn't spoken for about 6 yrs. and she had stated hatred also. Then there's the XW with the RO and 2 yrs. no contact, then apolopy?! Go figure... just waiting for the craziness from the latest.
Garbage dumped in garage?? Are you kidding me? Now that would chap my a$$!!
Time for a vacation eh? Maybe the pacific northwest.
laugh off crazy!!
cire
Me 48 X's vary S 27 S 18 Back with high school sweety after 30 years..
OMG, cire, one of my all time favorite sayings...had to respond to that!
fib, as you well know, there ain't much your STBXW has done over the years that hasn't chapped my ass, but nonetheless, Sugar, my concern is you...
I read an article not too long ago about getting back into the dating scene at middle age (um, yeah, that's what we are) and it said all the usual, ya just gotta do it, just jump right back in, get back on the horse, yada, yada, yada...
But it gave a couple of interesting tips. First, it said, listen to your gut. Never will your gut be more in tune, than during the first couple of dates. Unfortunately, after that, emotion (and some other compelling forces) take over, and you lose perspective. So whatever legitimate flags or buzzers or bells that go off for you initially, do not ignore them.
Conversely, it said, don't measure the other person against your EXPECTATIONS. If you have always told yourself that you have to have certain things, if you measure this new person against those things, you will be disappointed. More importantly, you will likely miss out on the gifts that they bring to the table, things that really might be more important that what you have always considered must-haves.
I thought this was good and interesting advice, but not only for looking forward, but for looking back and going "aha".
So many opportunities to learn, along this path we are on....don't squander it.
But yeah, I agree with cire, garbage dumped on the floor, I'm thinking there needs to be a tit for that tat...
FIB- I know many times you thought of your wife as having a mental illness.....and i just wanted to suggest to you that we all know that at the very least if we have a true MLC there is depression at work.
With that said there may be other disorders of the brain your wife has and you have become the blame the place she can put all that is wrong...now you may ask ok she can act normal around others...thats the part I never bought...and would alwasy have me quesiton...
Well last night i started attending a class sponsered by NAMI - national alliance for the mentally ill -- I do have a mentally ill son, anyway....so many things we covered last night about behaviors and changes I was thinking in my head...wow I cam here for my son...and that was my focus..but as they laid out the behaviors and symptoms of someone with a brain disorder my XH came to mind...then I thought oh no, hes funtioning with others at from what i can tell is bareable, etc...but then others in the class started talking about how their mentally ill child can pull off an act with some others and in front of doctors...etc.
anyway i just wanted to mention the acts of meaness that leave you going who is this women....they are signs and behabors of a person mentally ill...i mean when i think of some of the things my h has done too..i think would i even do that to anyone....NO. NO NO.....
i dont know if getting back to that perspective helps..but after attending that class last night....i am back on board with mlc being a mental illness...we are going to be learning about dual diagnosis too...so anyway....as my C used to tell me ok its MLC what does that change for you...ok the hurt is still there true...but knowing they are sick....and really beliveing it....there is some compassion in that....
To frank_d..thanks for stopping back in. Amen indeed.
To cire....I have Chapstick for A$$'s in my medicine cabinet. I need it everyday (see below).
To BBMF....when are we getting a beer?
To grace...like most people here, I have stayed with my IC to help me through the loss of my marriage and the impending loss of time with my children. Throughout, I have been open and honest about MY issues...MY perceptions of XXX..and tried to present the daily occurrences as fairly as possible. My IC feels she is either "Bipolar II" or borderline personality disorder.
Case in point. Yesterday's text exchange. In the AM, XXX asked me if I would be home in time to relieve her Aunt "Mary". I told her I had one case and then I would be home. I got home early (I keep Wednesday's light). For your perusal, a brief text exchange:
Me:XXX...are the kids at home?
XXX: No. They are at my mom's. (Translation: lie, Aunt Mary never got them, she intended for her mom to have them that day as Wednesday's are my day with the kids)
Me: Could you please have them ready?
XXX: I am working. You apparently are not. You can call yourself and arrange to pick them up. You know the number. ( translation: you're a worthless physician and not making enough money)
Me: There was no answer.
XXX: Then there wont be for me either. You will have to try again in a bit. Surely a smart man like yourself can figure that out. I am working. (translation: I'm an idiot and POS)
So, all....I will let you formulate your own opinions.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
yep brain disorder...being mean like that is one of the behaviors....there is a whole list they gave us of a bunch of behaviors you will see....
you know when someone is stressed or think of during your marriage maybe when things seemed normal an if you had a high stress time and thinks got out of wack you might see actions that you thought wow that was over the top...but then things calmed down and u realized it was the extreme stress and even thought their reaction may have seemed like ..hello....where did that come from...you could at least tie it to ....the issue..
now with this...it does not end....i mean in a reasonable time....and it just keeps coming and you only see glimples of who they used to be....if at all...
it is a brain disorder..yep...that BPD thing...that I want to learn more about...isnt that if u say white they say black...u can even do a test on something u could care less about....I dont know...its interesting.....
I think the hardest part is the hostility and blame..as you see my son is now mentally ill...it is heartbreaking ...but the difference is..he doesnt blame me...however he does have odd behaviors that are so different from who he was for 18 years....but you know....you still love them with all your heart..its the blame and hostility towards u that is harder than hard....
anyway...when she texts those things to u are talks to u...dont take on the task of interptation....pray for her and surrender her to God...she is sick and you are healing...and for what ever reason for now this is the deal.....You be the man you know you are....and she is sick and isnt in reality....remember also dont poke the bear....ask her for as little as possible --- she really cant do much anyway..so you need to...dont engage and dont....try and figure out the sick mind......heal you and the kids....thats what this doc should do...:) let the rest go through surrender to God....
