So at this chat, my ex said.. there was NO reason for leaving, he doesnt know why he left.. HE THINKS HE HAD A MLC !!! He actually said that, yes, G said. I asked if he was through it now? And G said, oh yes, but he still gets low and has been again lately.. thats his own separate mental problems though, depression.
I asked if he had any doubts about coming back to the R, had he ever said anything that he didnt like about me? G said, no, not at all, I've never once heard him say a bad word against you, in fact, he has nothing but good things to say and talks about you alot!
One thing I didnt get clarity on (G wasnt sure and said, I cant remember what he said when I asked him that question).. was, why he wont speak up to me and admit he wants me back, or phone me. He seemed to think, generally that its all the hurt he's caused and the guitl and also, he has been in a "dark, low place" G said, particularly before Christmas and again recently, so theres an element of not being able to maybe?
He said she doesnt get him, that he will make a joke or a flippant remark as he does and it will soon descend into a serious conversation as she wants to know what he meant by that and he said.. but Al wouldnt do that and never did, Al gets me, Al knows me better than anyone, that he loves talking to me, that we get on like a house on fire, that he feels we were "together" for 13 years and that noone is as close to him as me... ARRGHHHH !!! Ok, just feel mad about all this! Its so frustrating.. why wont he just talk to me!?? Ridiculous...
He's noticed I've changed, he said that since we have split up I have turned back into the girl he always wanted me to be again and he has definetly noticed. He absolutely said he misses me..
I said, but whatever he says about her, that doesnt mean its about me, or wanting me back but G was adamant.. its totally about you! Absolutely ! He misses you and what you had and realises he has made a mistake.
He said he feels like he has got himself into something that he cant get out of, that she is a nice girl and doesnt want to hurt her but it isnt going anywhere.. ARRGHHH again !!! Why cant he hurt her after 5 months!?? He walked out on me after 9 years !!!!
So G's advice was unequivical (sp!) and he said it at least 20 times.. just phone him. Pick up the phone and tell him all you've told me, sit him down and be honest, what have you got to lose? So.. shall I? Or email him? Or wait?? I dont know.
Also, he said that he wanted to invite me last night to bandnight, but was worried Helen might be there and didnt want to upset me.. but when he told my ex they'd uninvited me, my ex said, ahh, she could have come, you should've got Al here too... so I couldve gone last night! Grr.
I think we do need to be in the same room as one another and have a chat and some laughs.. maybe I need to ask Cher and G to make that possible by inviting us both, this Thursday? Of course, this is still going to take months to shake out, as he needs to build up to ending it with her and then let that go.. so I understand this isnt going to be an overnight thing.
Lastly, I 3 times said, but how does he even know I am still here? How does he know I am single even, or still love him? G was a bit cagey, but when I firmly asked him that the third time, he admitted "ok.. cos I told him".. this was at that talk 2 weeks ago, only then.. I said "DID YOU !??" he said.. yes I did, because he asked me, so I told him.. WOW! So thats interesting, that he wanted to know!
I understand people will think this possibly a bad thing, but its the nature of the beast.. my ex is avoidant, cowardly, reticent, slow to act, lacks confidence...and I have been afraid to speak up, so we seem to have needed people to intervene! And Cher and G have been wonderfully kind.
Theres more.. but this is a long post, basically, he has made a mistake and finally realised it and .. now what? He does have some attachment to her though, he did say they had a good time when they went skiing, which upset me, but that was a while ago and he realises its not right with her.
G reckons this is down to me now, I have to act, I have to see him, show him what he says he misses, reach out, phone him, contact him more, it isnt going to come from him.. not sure why not and not sure what to do with all this info ! Devise a plan I guess of how to approach him!?
..This is all so ridiculous.. I said it felt like a "life interrupted"...I've been through hell for a year and a half and we've still not had an honest conversation, and we need to! But I feel like I have been on the right path...you've got to believe in your dreams and never give up...
My gut says that he has one last chance to figure it out or you're moving on. I'm thinking you'll need to take the lead here, but I'm not sure if it is right for you to do or not.
What is jumping out at me is he wants back, but doesn't know how to return. So, I see it as you need to tell him you'd love to try again, but if he doesn't want that, you are gone b/c you need to continue to live your life. You'd like to live it w/him and work on the things you two need to work on together, but if he can't do it, you need to go and grow for you.
I'm not sure how to phrase it, but that is what my gut is saying to do.
What do you others out there think? I say he needs to join Ali or watch her leave for good. If he wants her, he needs to make up his mind so she can move forward.
I could be way off. It's happened before, but that is what strikes me when I read Ali's posts.
Wow, this is crazy!!! When you said he actually said he thought maybe he had an MLC I laughed out loud. REALLY loud.
I do not think that confrontation is the way to go, personally, I disagree with RTL. For two reasons--it seems like he is still working through stuff. Don't you want to be with someone who's worked out most of his stuff BEFORE he's with you, instead of working out that stuff all up in your face, coming back before he's totally ready and running you through the bloody wringer? I know he is moving SOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHH slow, but I think he still has a bit to go. The other reason is, I recently had an epiphany about the meaning of pursuit. It's about the other person (the one pursuing you) having the GUTS to choose you. don't you want to be with someone who has the GUTS to choose you, and take that risk?
If he's not sure how to come back... make sure the road is paved and smooth. Be welcoming and friendly and kind and approachable, as you have been!
It's sort of like... if you try to "help" a butterfly out of a crysalis, it will never be strong enough to fly by itself. (right? like that "lost" episode?)
OF COURSE you guys need to have a conversation, probably many, about WTF happened. But since you've had very little contact, especially compared with the pre-H-era, it seems to make more sense to encourage or initiate lighter contact with him to begin, instead of saying, OK we've been not in much contact, now let's have a big nervous-making confrontational R talk while you're still not even able to wrest yourself from the maniacal clutches of psycho girlfriend! how about... eating some peanuts together to start? you see what I'm saying?
that's my 2 cents big mega transatlantic hugs to ye love, T
Look how he reacted when you tried to have a 'talk' in the car on the way up to your parents. As you said he is avoident - he will hate a 'talk'. I would go down the line of having fun with him and it will naturally happen rather than forcing it.
JMO but if it were my best friend who was divulging all this personal info to my ex gf, even if it was in my 'best interests', I would be really pissed off. I would feel like people are conspiring against me. I'm just saying, can't you form your own GAL interests and include him in that rather than pump his friends for info?
I think this is a very interesting development, and my opinion sort of falls between those of T and RTL. In some ways I would almost venture that it doesn't really matter in terms of the long-term outcome how you approach this, as long as you do it respectfully, but that there is probably a right way to do it in terms of causing the least short-term discomfort to both of you. I don't think that sounded as clear as it does in my head :). What I mean by that is that I've come to believe in probabilities and likelihoods with these situations. In your case it never seemed as though your Ex didn't still love and care about you. It always seemed to me as though there was still a strong connection, and the biggest danger to the R, in my opinion, was going to be you giving up (understandably) because of his snail's pace. It was so obvious that his connection with Helen wasn't the soul-connection he has with you, and that he would eventually come to realize this. So it seems he has now.
If you're still willing to give him a shot, which it seems like you are, I would not go so far as to back him into a corner and force him into a decision as you never want this to happen again, and if he feels the slightest bit pressured, you may always wonder whether he is going to snap again. You have waited this long, so I think a few more months, likely months with progress, would be bearable. However I don't think you have to completely start from scratch and just be buddies again. It sounds like he knows a lot about where you are at in your emotional state, i.e. still loving him, from your friends. So you know he knows, and he is likely to know you know he knows (sounds like a movie), so there is already an innate understanding there. I'd suggest maybe being more forward in terms of contact, but not necessarily bringing out the big guns just yet. Can you call him up, email him etc. and just ask him to go do something with you? Alternatively could you show up at one of these band nights and just spend time talking to him in a non-emotional way? I think there are ways to draw him closer again without talking about the biggest issues right away. Like T said, at some point those things will need to be addressed, but if they are now, he is likely to feel guilty etc. You can't just tell him you forgive him and won't hold this over his head. He needs to see this in your behavior for awhile, and IMO the best way to do this is to spend time with him, let it progress naturally, and let him address the issues. You do deserve more from him if he wants to get back together, and you do deserve reassurance etc., but I think the reality for most of us in this situation is that we need to be willing to accept less at the beginning if we want to make this work, and keep faith that over the longer-run we will get what we need. People may disagree with me on this last point, but it is what I have found to be true. This may not be right for everyone, but I do think it offers the best chance of success, defining success here as another chance at the R. I know there are other successful outcomes too.
Anyway hope you are well this morning,
ITH
Me:34 H:36 M:5 years T: 8 years Bomb: 07/17/08 I want to be separated for 6 months--I don't know what I want the outcome to be S 07/28/08-11/08/08 Living together ~7 months D Possibly busted?!?!!!
OK my post crossed paths with Julia, but she has said very succinctly what I was trying to say too, avoid "the talk" until/unless he brings it up or until/unless you are perfectly happy to have the talk and realize that it may not result in the outcome you want.
ITH
Me:34 H:36 M:5 years T: 8 years Bomb: 07/17/08 I want to be separated for 6 months--I don't know what I want the outcome to be S 07/28/08-11/08/08 Living together ~7 months D Possibly busted?!?!!!
Me:34 H:36 M:5 years T: 8 years Bomb: 07/17/08 I want to be separated for 6 months--I don't know what I want the outcome to be S 07/28/08-11/08/08 Living together ~7 months D Possibly busted?!?!!!
Thanks for your help everyone! Its pretty amazing hey? But I'm still skeptical, its not a done deal yet.. BMF agreed with me, he said, he's the sort of guy who could easily drift on for 2+ years in a rubbish R, just because he cant face the confrontation of sorting it out..
BMF admitted he hadnt actually said he wsa going to end it, just that he said he knew "it wasnt right" with her now. He said he thinks 2-3 months more tops and it will have run its course. 2-3 months more!! Still, I am not surprised and I have my degree to finish (finish 26th May - the day Saturn turns forwards, which is significant to seeing movement in my 1:1 Rs'!).
Rob - your gut is right.. I cant take much more of this, so this is his last chance, there better be some movement in that timeframe or it could be too late. I agree with you that I may need to tell him I want to try again and let him know, or reassure him I think we can work it out.
But T.. thankyou and I also agree with you! Maybe he isnt ready for hte big R talk and it might be better to just see him and spend some quality time with him, to remind him of what he is missing. I thought the same as you.. it should come from him, he should end it and speak up to me when he's ready and WANT me back.. but I said this to BMF and he said, no, it doesnt work that way..you have to let him know what he's missing to help him end it, else he will drift on maybe.
This Friday, 13th, would have been our 10 year official anniversary. I think he knows that.
Hey Julia, I agree, he may not be ready for a big R talk. The GAL thing.. I am now best mates with Cher and band night was always 'her' night out with gf's, but then her fiance started tagging along with her and her female friends and then invites my ex with him! So we, or I, had more 'right' to be there than they did! This is the first time though I have taken the opportunity to grill BMF, cos I was at the end of my tether!
ITH.. Thanks for your email, sounds interesting!! I totally agree with you that there was always still a connection and the one he has with her is NOT a soul connection. What he was describing to BMF, sounded to me like he misses his soulmate (me!), absolutely. I also agree its realistic to start small, and NOT expect the R to jump back to where it was, but to build it up again. I think going along to band night next week is probably the best approach so far!
So.. BMF was telling me to call him and be honest and I said I couldnt and joked you do it for me ! So he said he would talk to him again next week, tell him that we've talked and tell him what I said..and then Cher interrupted us and that was that. But now I am worried now, I dont thikn that this is a good idea.. so I thikn tonight I will have to ask her to tell G, NOT to do that, as ex may feel cornered by it. Eek!
So tonight I am out again, with Cher and gf's ! I'm too old for all this socialising with younguns
