Quoting sgctxok: How do you think you can translate the skills you are learning right now to the time when you are together, in person?
Excellent point, sg!!
One thing that I've found is that a lot of people are VERY uncomfortable when there is any silence in a conversation. They seem to have to fill up the "dead-air" by saying something. Even just ANYTHING!
Although there may be absolutely nothing wrong with this, if this is what you would "typically" do, it might be an area for change.
Some people take longer to form thoughts in their heads than others, trying to get the words "just right". Others may be looking for you to "bail them out", to have you speak first, so they don't have to.
Either way, this is definitely one area where you could experiment with, to see if you can change the normal rythym of things a bit. To do something that's "unexpected", just to see what happens.
If communicating through email is a way that seems to work best for you, slowing the conversation down a bit might be an effective tool when it's time for "live" conversation.
JJ
Read about Divorce Busting® Telephone Coaching here!
H does not talk much about "us" or our R or the sitch right now. In fact he has only done so two or three times in 9 months! I still do not bring up our R because any time I do I get the same "speech" (if slightly modified) that I got when the bomb dropped.
Occassionally something will just "come out" in conversation and usually neither one of us knows what to say. Me - usually because if I persue that line of conversation I know I will hear things I don't want to hear (avoidance?) and H - because he seems to want to always say the right thing, or "make things look right" so as not to upset me. H still says he doesn't know what he wants, but will not stop seeing OW, spend more time with me and S1 or make any committment to working on our M. I think that is why when he does say anything I was not expecting I panick inside and just clam up. The only time in my life I have been stuck for words
At the same time H calls a lot, panicks when he cannot get hold of me, and hangs around for a long time seeming reluctant to leave when he does come round. It's like he is waiting for ME to say or do something. Anytime I have I get the speech. Round and round in circles at a dead standstill.
When something has come up and then neither one of us has carried it along I think a lot about what I shoudl have said afterwards. I'm never sure if I should bring it up again the next time we see each other or wait and see if he does. He usually does not. Having thought about what I would like to say - should I go ahead?
finally got my copy of dr and read thru to the first step - start with a beginner's mind
i must admit that i pulled a few gems out of this - but the number one point i drew from this step is the manipulation factor, which was something i was definitely dealing with
i hate head games, because i have always felt my h was playing them with me, and i never wanted to do the same to him, but michele helped me tremendously with that question and subsequent comment on what manipulation really is
also, patience is something i really need to work on, and she emphasized the point on that - i must be patient
Quote: How SURE are you about things that are going to happen?
Right when I think I'm sure that my H and are going to reconcile, he backs out! So I'm not sure anymore what is going to happen.
Quote: How much do you rely on the past, and the present, to predict the future? Especially about the "negative" things?
Before I db'd I relied quite heavily on the past, present to support my negativity. Now while db'ing I try to leave the past behind and get a new 'How things Could be attitude with my R.
Quote: How would you see the situation you're in from an outsider's point of view? What if you were a third-party looking at the events that are going on in your life? How might you see things differently?
Looking in on what is going on between my h and I, I would say that my H loves me but is really hurt and confused. That he's not trying to intentionally hurt me but doesn't know what to do. He wants to change things but doesn't know how and he sees me doing more of the same it makes him hopeless. I would say that he'll come around he just needs time.
Quote: If you were to read your story on the board like it was someone else's thread, what would you post to yourself? What advice would you give to you? How well would you take that advice?!
I would say to me LEAVE HIM ALONE! Don't be his doormat but be friendly, loving, act as if it doesn't bother me! Get a life outside of him and stop obsessing about him. Go to counseling. But I wouldn't listen, it's taken a couple of really hard knocks to get me to...which is what has happened! So now I listen .
Quote: If there was no past history to taint your views of the possibilities of things that could happen in the future, what might things look like?
You would see me happily having a life, my h having his, us together with our family. We could have fun together and separately without there being trust issues. Affection would be abounding and ILY would frequently be said.
Quote: If you were to put aside the "fact" that everything your partner is doing is meant to hurt you, what other possible explanations for some of their individual behaviors might you be able to come up with?
My h is just hurting and confused and lashing out in anger. he blames me because he doesn't want to see his wrong, he already feels bad enough.
Quote: What areas of your relationship might it be helpful to "take off your blinders", and see things from a different perspective?
If I took my blinders off I would see that my h has some legitimate concerns that I do not validate when I talk to him. I'm always so busy trying to defend myself that half the time I don't stop and just listen to him. Oh, and that I'm not a bad wife, there are things that need fixing but I'm not an awful person. And just because he's made the decision to leave, I'm still ok.
Quote: What would your answer be to the "miracle question"? Your answer to how things COULD be, instead of the way that they are?
Things could be: 1. we would talk more (no talking before), 2. would not assume things but state openly what we are thinking and feeling with a measure of tact of course, 3. ILY would be said freely and frequently, 4. affection would be common, 5. date nights would be a weekly occurance, 6. raising our kids would be a joint effort, 7. family goals, 8. values would be discussed and upheld, 9. our families would come 2nd to the needs our spouse.
Quote: If you were to start things over from scratch, with a clean slate, what would your relationship be like? What would YOU be doing to help lead it into the right direction?
My r would be one built on trust. My H and I would have weekly dates, friends outside our r, activities outside our r, ml more than once a week, talk about things that bother us right away, be affectionate, plan for the future, be vulnerable with one another, have fun together, laugh more, touch each other more, put each other first in our lives.
I see that you've got a pretty good grasp on things that you could improve in your relationship, and know where you want to go from here!!
"He wants to change things but doesn't know how and he sees me doing more of the same it makes him hopeless."
This is where you have the advantage. Just by being here, and learning some of the things that it takes to create a better relationship, you can help to lead him towards a path where there is some hope!!
You have listed so many wonderful thoughts to the other questions that you answered. It would be hard to believe that your husband wouldn't agree with the end results of what you're saying!
Keep working here with us, and I'm sure we'll find some ways to help you get to where you want to be!!
JJ
Read about Divorce Busting® Telephone Coaching here!
quote:
If there was no past history to taint your views of the possibilities of things that could happen in the future, what might things look like?
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This is the main question I seem to keep coming back to. The past is my problem i.e....I can't seem to get over the mistakes H made that broke my trust. I thought I had forgiven but can't seem to forget and he's right...I crucify him over it.
H came back to work on our M but I obviously keep returning to the past and how he was. He says I'll never change because I refuse to see that he's changed. Maybe he's right, but I think I can change with a C help.
In a nutshell...if there was no past history I wouldn't be here and my M would probably be flourishing because H is my best friend and before his "betrayal" of my trust, we had no major problems.
~~~Debi
The past is my problem i.e....I can't seem to get over the mistakes H made that broke my trust. I thought I had forgiven but can't seem to forget
This is such a tough place to be. It seems that even when things are going good, something happens to spark a memory, and brings back the pain. I don't think that any of us, at any stage of the game, are immune to this.
I'm sad to tell you that there is no "magic wand" that can be waved to take those memories away. Nothing that can be done to instantly relieve the suffering you feel. Yes, it can go away with time, but, more importantly, it goes away with a lot of work.
The work involved isn't so much in trying to forget the past, but in trying to embrace the present, and envisioning the future.
The one main thing that I've seen that works is to keep filling up your heart with things that help you to push out the "bad" things that have happened in the past. To concentrate on embracing the good things that are happening right now, and envisioning your hopes for the future.
This can be one of those "easier said than done" things, and will take a helluva a lot of effort. However, it does go back to the idea of "Forgiveness is a gift you give yourself".
What things might he be able to do to regain your trust? What could he do that would make you more confident that he really is trying to work on your relationship now?
quote: ____________________________________________________________What things might he be able to do to regain your trust? ____________________________________________________________ Actually he has regained some of my trust. H has tried and I didn't appreciate him enough. Therefore he thinks all he has done has been in vain. It is more an issue of my insecurity than him trying. quote: ____________________________________________________________ What could he do that would make you more confident that he really is trying to work on your relationship now? ____________________________________________________________ At this point he has walked away...again...and is back to the "I want to go my own way" speech. I am back at square one and very afraid I blew the chance he gave me to work on it. I am starting from scratch now. ~~~Debi
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