Please don't feel that way, b/c a lot of women would just love for their H's to go shopping with them and to tell them what looks good on them, etc. You were trying to do the right thing in helping to build her self esteem and I think that is very considerate of you. The only reason I brought that up was b/c of what she had said about the brotherly friendship. This may not have had anything to do with that whatsoever, but we want to get away from anything the remotely resembles looking like "just a friend" to her or causing her to have only feelings of a friend toward you.
I'm pretty sure she does appreciate me telling her what looks good on her. I have not listened to the LL cd's yet, but I am sure " words of affirmation" is one of her main LL. Earlier this year (when we were already in this situation, but she was still at home), she would actually "model" the outfits for me when we got home. This was really hard for me, to tell her how good and HOT she looked and still keep my hands off of her!!! But I would just keep that urge inside. I might have slipped up once or twice and given her a hug, but that was it. Besides, the last time she has "modeled" for me was months ago. She lives in another house now since late June, so now when she comes over to pick up the boys and I think she looks good, I tell her. She usually just brushes it aside with a comment like: "I just have my dirty shirt or jeans on.", but then she usually gives me a tight hug. I know that inside she appreciates the comment though. I just know.
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...Like I said before, unfortunately when a woman loses that sexual attraction, it seems to be hard to regain it.
I think that even she herself is confused about her feelings not coming back. I get the feeling that she does want them to come back, but doesn't know how. Of course, she has never admitted that, it's just a feeling I get from her. We were always kind of "in sync" thoughtwise, almost like telepathy. Sometimes stuff happens that gives me chills. Like we're driving down the road in the car and we would be talking about where we are going and then I get a thought like wouldn't it be cool to go camping (or whatever, I am making something up here, but it would be TOTALLY unrelated to what we had been talking about) Then, out of the blue, she would make the comment out loud! Just really odd. I am a scientist, so I don't really believe in that kind of stuff, but that kind of stuff happening makes the hair on my arms stand up! I know all of this sounds really mushy right now, but it does happen!
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Glad you cleared that up and since you have told her that, then you don't need to repeat it since she has the feelings that she does. You may be tempted to, but try not to say it again or tell her that you love her, etc. I know it sounds the opposite of what you think you should be doing, but that is what is so crazy about all of it.
She started R talk that evening and then halfway through it I told her that. I literally have not told her that I love her in months (trying to remember when the last time was but can't) that was actually the main reason I said it. I did not want her to leave with the impression that I am slowly " losing" my feelings too.
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BTW, are you the "take charge" kind of man?
I don't see myself as one, but I do do pretty much all of the household finances (bills, checking accounts, taxes) and I am always the one organizing our vacations, booking the flights, making hotel reservations, etc... She just disusses the destination with me. She lets me do all the organizing because I am "good at it" she says. So I guess yes, I do take charge, just not in the classical sense, the "romance" dept I guess.
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You see there are two basic ways of going about this. become the "friend" and be there for the wife, "drop the rope" before they get their W's attention.
I guess I have been doing both. Would that be bad? I do drop the rope by turning her completely loose (esp since she moved out) and I do not contact her unless I need to (regarding the kids school arrangements or something). I do ask her how the shop is going when I see her or when she contacts me, like a "best friend" would, but otherwise I just stay out of it. She did mention to me the other day that I have not been to shop in 4 months and am I really interested in it? I don't know if it has been that long, but it has been a while, I know that. But that was one of her complaints about me during the ILYBNILWY talk, so now I am not sure of that is working against me or for me? Do you have an idea?
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If she asked, then I suppose that would be up to you and how you felt about it. You could always be too busy and too unavailable to her and it would cause her to see that she can't take you for granted. You take "brothers" for granted. Until she gets out of that frame of mind that you are like a brother to her.....then you may have to take drastic measures.
Since last year, she has not asked me to do anything at the shop. I get the feeling that she's trying to prove to herself (and to me) that she can take care of things and doesn't need me.
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That is good that you did that. I hope that they will not continue to talk to her b/c it will just make things worse for you in the long run.
Should I call them and ask them not to talk to her anymore about this? I was afraid that if I did that, that they would tell her that too Trying to interfere in her relationship with her parents. I do need to fill you in on that relationship though, but I am too tired now, will try to do that tomorrow.
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It is my belief that if a woman's emotional needs are being met that she can even deal with having the physical needs unmet--if she has to.
What do you mean with "if she has to"? Do you mean she could just live a platonic relationship?
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You do have the right concept of the detaching and "reeling them in" b/c they want what they can't have.
The only thing I am unclear of is when do you stop moving away from them when they come closer? When they are "all the way back" and in love or before that? In other words, when do you stop detaching? I was reading below and saw that you should actually never completely stop. I will have to give that some thought!
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As I said before, for some reason after we marry, we get too comfortable and we start letting down too much and begin to take each other for granted. That is when a lot of the romantic feelings wear off very quickly.
That is exactly my feeling about what has happened to us!
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I have told so many men to always come home and shower and put on some good smelling cologne b/c that has a senual affect on women.
I have tried that last weekend for the first time after I read your advice on another thread. Not to say that I never take showers! LOL I mean take one just before she comes and shave and put on some aftershave. She did not say anything about it, but who knows, maybe she did notice?
I want to thank you and express my deepest appreciation for what you are doing! I know it must take a lot of time to write these long posts to everybody here, but I am sure it saved many M's already!!
Just a quick note about tonight. My W and I went to a concert (planned long ago) and we had a great time! She was running late and came straight from work and did not have time to change. I had put my suit on that she always said looked good on me (before we got where we are now...) On the way to town, we had a good conversation about all kinds of things, work, her shop, the kids, all kinds of stuff. We had dinner before the show and had some more good conversation. Even though she did not change her clothes, she looked very good to me, so I had to work hard on resisting the urge to put my hands on her. I did good all evening, only put my hands on her shoulder when she said she felt underdressed and I told her she looks great to me! On the way back home, she slept most of the way. The whole evening I had told myself I was not going to kiss her if she did not make the move first. When she left the house, she gave me a long hug and thanked me for the evening and I thanked her for coming. She headed for the door and then sort of went like: almost forgot, and gave me a kiss. I feel good about how things went.
I was looking at her sleeping in the car, completely exhausted, passed out... I just get the feeling that she probably can't sleep in her house, constantly thinking about stuff, why she's feeling this way, how come she doesn't feel anything for me when we have such a good time together... I don't know, just a feeling, a vibe I get from her.
Just had some more points I remembered about our night out. I am trying to concentrate on the positive, but it's so easy to slip back and really get down thinking about all the stuff that's not right... Having a little down day. ANyways, so here it goes:
- On the way to the concert, she said that she would really like to go to this local music festival next summer, and then she said: "maybe we can go together with our friend couple X and Y!" I took that as a positive, that she still sees us be together next summer.
- At the concert, she tells me that she's been wearing this perfume for few weeks now that my mom gave to her years ago, because it reminds her of this city overseas I took her to when we were still dating. Also took this as a positive, as it seems she's trying to remind herself of all the good times we have had over the past 10 years.
Just wanted to see what you guys think about these! Trying to keep my PMA!! Hoping for someone to read my couple of posts above!!
I think these are positive signs. Just be wary of any cycling. IOW, don't get too excited yet; but it definitely is a plus. Any forward-thinking talk that includes the two of you as a couple is good.
Well, the thing is that she's not contacting me as much as a couple of weeks ago... I guess it's hurting my ability to maintain a PMA a little, seems a step back, whe other stuff indicates a step forward... I guess it evens it out?
She's still in pretty bad shape financially, and she told me on the way to the concert that she will have to move into an apartment because it is cheaper. I was just asking questions as to is it nice, where is it, where will the boys sleep and such. Just normal interested friend stuff. Of course, in my head I'm thinking, why the HE!! don't you just move back in!?!? My feeling is that being separated makes it harder for us to reconnect, assuming I can keep the pressure of of her even when living in the same house. On the other hand, us living apart does allow me to freely browse this forum and to be down every once in a a while without her knowing about it... Anyways, it's just been a long LONG time and I hope it's going to get better soon....
I am just trying to let her do what she thinks will work for her. I mean, from the start of this, she has always maintained that she does want to work it out, but just doesn't know how. The separation (moving out) was her idea and she said that she thought that that would work.
My W has never lived on her own. She always had someone to take care of her. That was one of her reasons as to why she wanted to separate, though she never really has.
Yeah, she divorced my stepson's dad when he was 1, 11 years ago. He cheated on her and kept staying out and coming home drunk. She moved 700 miles away to be closer to her parents, to an apartment and went back to school. SHe had very little money then also. I met her almost a year after she moved, she had taken her son with her, so I have been his dad pretty much. 2 years ago, he (stepson) moved to live with his dad and try the schools around there.
The thing is that my W wanted it to be "fair" financially when she moved out. So we agreed that I would just pay all the bils pertaining to our house (where I live) and she would pay everything for the house she lives in. I guess she did not want to have to argue about money. But we still share the costs of gas, car insurance and the boys' daycare. She's still trying to get her business started, but it has not generated any money yet. I really do feel sorry for her in that regard, because this business is her true dream, and she got the opportunity, but it's just not working the way she envisioned. I had mentioned some of my concerns about this about a year and a half ago, but she just told me I was pessimistic about it for selfish reasons. However, I do really want her to succeed, but I think she needs another approach. She asked me 2 weeks ago what she should do and I gave her a suggestion, which she followed! Thought that was positive too!
We do seem to have alot of things in common although I think your sitch is a hell of alot better then mine! Thanks for the advice on me not talking to my w about our r. For this reason, I think it is why I am in the pits tank. I know I have to get back on my DBing track of mind. Ive read your sitch and even though your w is living somewhere else, she seems to have a sense of mind that is way better then my w's! My w's attitude just plain stinks. Theres no other way to say it. She is being selfish and thinking only of her self and somewhat of our girls. I think that is why I am in the mood I have been in since Thanksgiving. So I know I have to just let her be. Huge PMA work on my part!
Im fighting a few battles in my head and it involves advice from my C, advice from DBing and advice from my church. I am thinking of changing C's as he is encouraging me to keep talking and expressing my feelings to my w which is what I have been doing hence some r talk. Yet at the same time he isnt giving me any advice on how to save my m. DBing obviously says dont talk about r so I have stopped. My church group just encourages me not to give up, so I am fighting the demons back because I dont want to give up, yet am exhausted from how Ive been feeling. My c just says that if she dumps me, Ill be ok, well how the hell do I prevent her from dumping me then?
Does that make any sense?? LOL!
I am going away tonight on a mens retreat with my church. Im not sure if you are a Christian or not Sam but for myself, turning to God and the support I have been getting from the pastors at my church have been very helpful to me. So I am going to see if I can find my old, confident, take-charge and be a leader inner self again. As Sandi, or S2 as I fondly call her says above, Look and smell good, be good and lead good as well. I know I said that kind of weird, but I think you get the message. Hopefully I will find something this weekend. If not, I know that I have to step it up some more.
So if I can say anything about your sitch is that to listen to S2's advice but keep doing what your doing. Be the best man you can be for your self as well as your kids. That is what I need to do, it already sounds like your miles ahead of me.
Drop me a line and vent when ever you want to. Follow Ready2Change, Coaches, SadMilitaryWife, Smartcookies, and Edges threads as well as S2's. They all heve wicked advice to give and seem to be the leaders that everyone turns to for support, I have and theyve helped me out a great deal.
Talk to you soon.
Joe
M: 37 WAW: 35 D's: 9 & 7 M: 13 Bomb: 01/28/08 Status: Limboland Total bomb drops: Lost count! Support: Here, God above, and now the Love Dare
