She's gone...I'm devastated, but hopeful

[minkerman]

I had my first Doctor's appointment in 20 years tonight. Basically I have developed a fear of doctors over the years, since I have lost a disproportionate number of people close to me to cancer. Anyway - another 180 for me - get a full physical, blood work and the dreaded prostate exam.

Passed everything with flying colors. He told me I was in better shape than 95% of guys my age. Whew! What a load off!

The bad news, he wants me to try Prozac for a month, to improve what he thinks is mild depression. Thanks W. Doc also gave me an "Antidepressant Skills Workbook" to help me make a plan and change my thinking.

She made me promise to call her, so I did about 20 minutes ago. Good phone call. She tried to bring up R in casual conversation, I told her, no R talk tonight, this call is all positive! (It was regarding an article she read online about how people get stuck in ruts and are afraid to move on because they would have to leave behind what they've always known and are comfortable with. I said well maybe that's you, but it's not why I don't want to move on...but I don't want to get into it now! She said, no I don't mean that's us, just that it reminded me of us.) Whatever.

So far my plan of going dim (vs dark) is on track. We are not going to see each other this weekend.

I'll let you know how the Prozac goes...I'm a little concerned about that one.

[LoginName]

Hi MM,
There is a power issue in these things, isn't there. Anger too.

Anger can be good. It gives you the strength to change and do. It's not good to hold onto anger too long though. Like guilt, it serves it's purpose, and then you have to let it go.

Power. If you read my last post, I'm thinking about that too. I received the good advice that I have just as much power. I chose to do this, to stay, to be in this R, and I can change my mind. You can too. You do have power.

Maybe power is tricky because so many look at it as a zero sum game; if you have the power than I don't. Maybe both can have power, and control. Control over your own life.

I think during the crisis, we are willing to give up the power and control, we're willing to do anything. It's like death/grief stages; anger, bargaining, acceptance, etc. We are grieving a loss. So when we are in the bargaining stage, we're ready to do and try anything. then anger pops up.

Yes, reassert your power. But not power over her, as I think you realize, but over yourself. Take back control of your life.

Keeping quiet about your changes is powerful. It takes time to work it's magic on you and on her, but it works, It's hard to do at times. Who more than our mate, best friend, would you want to share your insights and revelations with? And yet you feel you have to keep it to yourself.

You've got us on the board, you can share those feeling, changes with us.

I'm glad you've decided to quite calling her as often.

It may be too early - you need to feel and process the anger and get control back - but when that's done, then what? Time to face the problems?

Thanks for retelling your story. Mine is similar. I had an A too. I think for your W and mine, the real issue is not our A's, but their need to find themselves and test their wings. But our A's are important. Are you ready to talk to your W about it?

There is a lot of opinion about what you should be willing to tell and to say. My feeling is that you should be willing to answer any questions, with the caveat that she shouldn't ask a question unless she is ready to hear the answer. And when you answer, don't give details or embellish. You know, say we had sex, not get into what positions you used, etc. And be honest. Like, "yes I enjoyed it but I felt empty afterwards", telling the truth that it was enjoyable, and what you really felt.

Can you tell I'm talking to myself here? My W says my A isn't important and doesn't really matter. In a way I know she's right. But I also think that it may have been a big part of our problem. She, like your W, may have thought about it over the years and it may have built up in her. The last DB coach session I had, the C said that the A would have to be addressed sometime, but not at that time. At that time, it wasn't important.

I'm rambling, but my point to you, MM, is are you ready to talk about your A to your W? Are you willing to answer her questions, if she still has them?

There are some good books on this subject. Shirley Glass is a good therapist/author on this subject.

OK, and getting back on track even more, remember that you aren't asserting yourself to 'get even' with her for leaving, or to punish her, or to show her how strong you are, or to threaten her with the possibility that you might not want to get back together. You're asserting yourself because you want to, because it's healthy, because your going to face reality. If you decide you don't want to get back together with her, so be it. If she decideds the same, so be it. You're taking control of your life, and letting go of control of her life. It's big, profound, and hard. Don't even suggest that you may leave her, unless you are really ready to follow through. Don't play games.

Enough caveats and warnings. Welcome back to the confident, powerful, in control MM. The man who can let go of things he can't control, and takes responsibility for what he can. The man who can cry and feel bad because he knows he can feel those powerful emotions and they can't stop him. The man who can honestly be sorry for his past mistakes, and then forgive himself and move on, becoming better.

[LoginName]

I am not a doctor, I haven't studied this at all, I have a brother in law who anti-depressants helped emmensly, but...

I think you should be depressed, given the circumstances (which I only know what I've read and then through my faulty filters and memory). Depression isn't always bad. Clinical depression may be, but Damn, this is sad stuff. If you don't feel sad, your crazy.

Maybe you should get a second opinion.

I've enjoyed my sadness. It's mine. It't taught me so much.

Give it some thought. Take the workshop, read the books, but maybe wait to take the pills until you're sure you need to.

I can't believe I'm giving medical advice, and I'd quickly advise someone to see a doctor and find out if the were clinically depressed, but maybe a second opinion? Just a thought. Take it from the source and for what it's worth.

[minkerman]

Thank you LN, for taking so much time to post on my thread.

Everything you say is correct about the anger. I am using it 100% to get myself under control, not to exert power over her...I am crazy about her, even after what she's done. And she knows that, so I don't need to tell her again. She sometimes can't believe that I love her as much as I do. I told her I will wait as long as I can, and I think that helps her. She knows that I can move on, and of course I know it too.

Regarding the affair...I have no problem talking to her about it. I am a new, different person. She told me a couple of weeks back "you might not like the new, assertive, confident person I intend to become". I told her, simply "Ditto. Be careful what you wish for". We both laughed, it was a good moment.

Thanks again, LN. Wish I could share a beer with you someday.

[LoginName]

sharing a few beers would be fun. I become more philosophical while imbibing ;-)

About depression...
Here is a quote from a book a friend gave me during my darkest times. Nietzsche "Whatever your fate is, whatever the hell happens, you say, "This is what I need.""

The book goes on to talk about how if you approach everything in a positive way, even the pain, you can't help but win.

The first month, win my W was gone, with the OM, the pain was horrendous. It felt evil. It felt like I would cease, I'd dissolve. Then slowly the strength came back. The pain stayed, but the evil was gone. The pain was the pain of healing. The wound became a clean wound. I could feel the pain, sometimes it was worse than ever, but I knew I would survive and not disappear.

I'm glad my C didn't give me any antidepressants. I'm glad I felt that. I'm glad I feel it now.

Depression is a very serious problem. I'm not a doctor. If your doctor thinks you need medical help with this, take an experts advice, not mine. If your doctor is prescribing pills to make it easier on you, or for some other reason, I'd suggest you skip them.

When I'm depressed, I don't self-medicate. For some reason, I hate to drink when I'm feeling down. Now that I'm feeling good again, I'm enjoying beer, wine, and whisky again. I'm a big fan of IPAs. How about you MM? Have a favorite brew?

[minkerman]

I love a crisp, hoppy IPA. I worked 10 years in Engineering, in a major world-class brewery, so I know my beer.

Funny you should mention self-medicating. Since this began, I have pretty much stopped enjoying my nightly glass of red. Partly due to my exercise program, partly because I simply don't feel like drinking.

Strange thing just happened.

If you go back through the posts, you will see that a couple weeks ago I invited W to join me at a wine-tasting event. She declined, but was intrigued to see me interacting with a large group of complete strangers. Total 180, and would blow one of her stereotypes of me right out of the water. The event is tonight. Well, 5 minutes ago, she emailed me. Copy/paste: "Thinking that I'd like to join you tonite, can you get me a ticket?"

I did, and she is coming. Baby steps. Spotlight is on me tonight, no pressure, my chance to show myself in a positive light. And none of it is fake...this really is how I am now.

Wish us luck!

[LoginName]

Oh man, I've brewed my own,tasted many styles, and I've settled on IPA as my favorite. Hoppier the better. My current,and all time favorite, is Avery IPA, from Boulder, Colorado. Have you tried it? What brewery did you work for and what did you do for them? Facinating.

Luckily for me, and something you can look forward to, wine tastes good to me again,and I enjoy a glass or 3. Funny how some people like to drink when they are depressed, and some don't.

MM, this wine tasting will be a good time for you to practice. Detach. Don't try to impress her, try to be there, in the moment, for you. She doesn't get to judge if you succeeded or not, or if you've changed, or if you're in anyway "good enough". You get to decide for yourself. Don't fall into the trap of trying to impress her.

How did you do it when you were dating (I know, I don't remember either)? Dress nice, shave, shined shoes to impress your date, Wife, but be detached. If she, your date, doesn't work out, oh well. You had a good time anyway.

Rooting for you.