Ongoing affair, D papers filed, advice wanted

[SirPrizeMe]

I'm hanging in there, thanks for all the support you all. LWB, Ann, Nutfarmer, NH - thanks. People like you are really helpful at this time. Oh, thank you.

Self applied 2x4 : I gotta stop with the roller coaster stuff. Xmas morning was GREAT! Really great. I opened presents with my kids, and W watched me! how great is that! She kissed me! Seriously, if I step back, it was a GREAT DAY for my marriage. Three weeks ago, if I had written down my realistic goals for the day, the actual day exceeded all of them. Wooohooooo!!

Then I talk to the OM's wife and I learn they are still in contact and I torture myself over it. WTF!??! Why should I? Why should anything that is happening out of my control, bother me? Why should I let this information detract from a GREAT GREAT Day?

I am going to go my last idea, send a short email - "It was a great gift for me, to spend time all together with you and the kids on Christmas, it meant a lot to me. thanks for making that happen!"

In fact, I should be ecstatic that OM is "cheating" on my W. True colors. This is super. I hope it helps her to see him for what he is, and see me for what I am.

I gotta keep myself calm. ...Remain focused on the goal!

ok, I'm off to have a GREAT DAY!

[Ohio_Mark]

SPM -

Don't forget that most of us dated (and were engaged to) our current spouses for years before we finally pulled the trigger. And then this other person comes along and, within weeks or months, our spouses decide that this is the one!! The point I am trying to make is that, in a time period as short as this, there is waaaay too much baggage that is yet to be uncovered. There is a lot working against an extramarital relationship.

In my own situation, my wife discovered that her "soulmate" was a habitual flirt, who recycles tired pick-up lines. She dumped him.

It won't be long until your wife discovers what a worm her boyfriend is. Keep doing what you are doing, and put her in a position where she is going to have to work to get you back.

[ann25]

Sir - Awesome realization. If it's out of your control, don't let it effect you.

The worse he is the better you will look to her. Letting her find out for herself will be much more effective. You sound GREAT today!! keep up the PMA!

[JoieDeVivre]

Sir --
Ann has a marvelous point, the worse he is the better you will look to her. Keep up the PMA and she will notice. OM will not have such a marvelous PMA with 2 DUIs under his belt! Let his true colors come forward. That's what happened in my sitch... OW got nasty and the A is over and H and I are piecing. Be patient, though.

Joie

[SirPrizeMe]

I am still feeling good today.
I spoke with Dottie, a DB coach, yesterday.
I gotta tell you, talking to the DB coach is sort of pricey, but when I look at the cost of my attorney? And the full cost of divorce? Let alone the more important non-financial costs of splitting. . .It's worth the cost. She keeps me on track.

Dottie said a couple of key things:

• I should expect a downswing on the positive interactions. We had a really really nice christmas morning. I should expect W to pull back now. Sure enough, she seems to be doing just that. I normally call the kids every night. Since they are out of town with her I need to call her mobile phone to speak to them. She won't answer. Finally her mobile phone called me back, but it wasn't W. It was my son, 11 yrs old. She was there, but didn't want to speak with me.
• I shouldn't feel like I need to force "reality" on W. It will come eventually. The financial pressure, the reality of single motherhood, needing to move out of the house, needing to get a job, and so on. I don't need to play the role of bad guy. It will come naturally. I should focus on just being the best me I can be. I think this is also happening.

I feel strong and grounded today.

JDV - I am so happy for you that you and your H are piecing - that is terrific!

You are exactly right: I understand from other contacts that OM is hating his life - friends deserting him, people shunning him. No PMA, so he's drinking. A lot. Ignoring his friends.

Why in heck would she want *him* ? (theory: she is co-dependent. Her mom is an alcoholic, needy, and has been since W was 13 yrs old. W took care of her mom for many years. Then she took care of our babies. As they grew and needed less care, she needed someone else to care for. OM fills that hole.)

I won't dwell on why she is so attached to him. Honestly I think he does need help, I just wish it wasn't my W going out of her way to help him.

[SirPrizeMe]

Despite the advice of DBers everywhere, I committed three non-DB actions in one day.

First, I pointed out to W that OM was dating. She had brought up OM, and it came from that Surprise on me! She knew. She knew all about OM's new girlfriend. She also avows that while she and OM are still in contact, they are "just friends". (What a weird relationship!) I tend to believe this. Why would OM want W now? He is three states away. So the "soulmate for life" is no longer a soulmate I guess. That's good.

Second, I took the opportunity to also say that I knew she and OM had spent time together. She was again outraged that i was "checking up on her". But I explained that I was only learned of her activity inadvertently, having called the W of the OM because she and I both had a tough year, and I wanted to wish her the best. but really I was checking up on her. So that was booboo #2.

The third non-DB thing I did was to say, "if you spent half the effort on your family, that you do on OM, then we wouldn't be in this situation." To which she said nothing substantive. She repeated a list of my crimes in the marriage (It was a "toxic relationship", etc etc). I said, Ok, but what can I do today to make things better? She had nothing.

But later she gave me a list of counselors to go see. All of them were "counselors for perpetrators of domestic violence" which is not a group I am anxious to sign myself up for. But, I am willing to inquire, to look into it.

She suggested this action to me, in response to my specific request for something I can do TODAY. The alternative was to say "nothing. It's over. Face it. Talk to my lawyer." Instead she engaged. Maybe there is some hope.

I still think she needs to accept more responsibility, but ... for now I will gladly be the first to change, the first to stand for marriage.

[runningoutoftime]

From what you've described it seems like you are trying to coerce or control her, and shame her into "wanting" to be married (which would actually push her away).

Also, what type of responsibility does she need to accept? I'm not quite sure what you mean by that. Does she want to stop the divorce and work on the marriage?

If you are both in divorce she can spend time with anyone she likes. I don't mean to sound rude here, but what are you doing to make any woman want to spend time with you?

When I wanted to change my husband's mind, and somehow convince him that divorcing me was a mistake, I had to change me.

[theotherhalf]

When I wanted to change my husband's mind, and somehow convince him that divorcing me was a mistake, I had to change me

But what do we change about ourselves? We are all doing what we should be doing. Taking care of "our" kids, holding down the bills, the house, all the responsibilities that the WAS left behind. I have looked badk over the years and seen things that I do need to change and have and will continue. Bottom line though is I didn't do ANYTHING that gave my H grounds to leave the M. My H is having a MLC period. The affair and wanting the D is all apart of that. I truly believe that none of this is about me. Am I wrong thinking this????

[NoCodeBlues]

While I very much agree with the philosophy of GAL, I tend to also agree with what TOH is saying -- one can GAL and change one's self only so far before it becomes reckless and an endangerment to what we are hoping to accomplish, especially when there are children involved. Otherwise, our children get to witness both of their parents acting like self-centered fools.

In my own case, my W has been so persistent at painting any action of mine as negative, that much of my GAL appear to have actually back-fired. My W acts as if my taking the focus of of her drama or the kids is just evidence that I am being purely selfish, thinking only of myself. She makes comments about my GAL activities as me continuing to be cold and selfish. (Yeah, sure, while she, on the other hand, is so giving that she gives herself to the OM. Nah, she couldn't possibly be selfish, right?)

[runningoutoftime]

No matter how much a person works towards improving themselves (i.e. becoming a "better" person, improving relationship skills, attractiveness, etc...), it doesn't mean a spouse will notice, or appreciate, or change their mind about leaving. It's merely one's best chance of changing the dynamics and possibly getting a spouse to see the other person, and the marriage from a more positive perspective. But in the end, self-improvement has to be something you do for yourself.

It's only a chance. And individual circumstances will differ.

But when the divorce clock is ticking sometimes it's about all you can do. Trying to change things, fix things, beg, reason, guilt..... have usually already been tried.