Love, what is it, is it real, does it matter?

[789]

I wish my wife would read or think like that.
She has told me the ILYBNILWY, she wants to wake up and see me and have her heart flutter every time, but it doesn't. She thinks it should be completely emotional without any work having to be done, her words. She does not understand that love is a commitment, not just a feeling that should live forever with butterflies and all that.

[Sara]

Yes, that's how it is in the movies. Of course, people jump from moving cars and get up and run in the movies, or hold onto the tail of an airplane while it flies in the movies, and run away from bullets in the movies. So maybe we shouldn't expect real life to imitate movies.

[saffie]

I think that there is an extra problem when our spouse take up again with someome who was a childhood sweetheart. Not only are they coping with all the emotins surrounding infatuation but they are also being taken back to a time when they were younger and had their whole life in front of them and where anything could still happen.

It makes them feel young and vibrant again and the old GF/BF sees them as they were rather than as they are now. Personally I think sites like friends reunited have a lot to answer for. Some people just seem to have a hard time growing up gracefully and embracing the next stages of life. They can only do this for so long and then they become a public laughing stock in addition to having thrown so much that was important away!!

[LoginName]

tyler,
Do I want her? Yes, I'm thinking about that part too. Often. I see her in the morning, and I look into her eyes, and I think yes, I want her, it's worth it. Other times, I see how large her belly is, or how she acts like her mother, and I think why the h@ll am I putting up with this? I could be alone and happier, and have a chance to find someone else.

If these kind people are correct, and love is a choice, then it can be a tough one. Why would I choose to love her if she hasn't chosen to love me? If it hurts so much, and feels better when I detach, why not keep detaching?

And then there is the advice the DB coach gave; back away, but don't turn away. In other words, keep giving her space, but respond and engage when she wants. But then I ask why, why put in the effort? Once I start backing away, it gets easier to keep going. Strange, terrible, balancing act - staying engaged while detaching. It can be done, I'm doing it, but it's not easy.

For me, tyler, I do want her. Maybe that will change. Maybe she'll decide she doesn't want me. I want her to love me, and I want to love her and to show my love.

What's your story tyler? Why are you asking these questions?

[LoginName]

I'm still a romantic - although I doubt if anyone who knows me would say I am. I still believe at a basic level that love must be something more than a choice. It's hard to fight and overcome that feeling.

I chose to love my W. I am showing it in the ways I can now; giving her space, avoiding R talks, supporting her. I hope she decides to chose to love me too.

Sara, what's Retrouvaille, and what's your story? Why wouldn't your husband respond well to you saying you loved the dog?

Thanks for your input. Love maybe a choice, but it still feels like a mystery to me.

[LoginName]

789, I think that's part of the way I pushed my W away. I wanted those feelings. I even looked outside of the M to find them. Remember kissing someone for the first time? Can we feel that way with our spouses, after decades of M? I hope so. But it's not important if I do feel that way when I kiss my W. Love is more than that, IMHO.

I'm sorry your W feels the way she does.

[LoginName]

saffie,
That's a big part of what happened in my sitch. My W's first love form H.S. found her via the internet. They started emailing, then calling, then she left and went to him. I think it is tougher when there is a childhood sweetheart in the picture.

Oddly enough, a college girlfriend just recently found me on the internet and we have started talking. I've adviced her to tell her husband, and I have told my W. I admit though, I could really be infatuated with her if I don't watch myself. She was my first love and heartbreak.

OK, writing this, I can see I need to NOT talk to this girl at all - at least until and if my problems with my W are better.

so saffie, how did the childhood sweetheart fit into your sitch?

My W has over the years said that she and I were destined for each other, and our 'past' lifes intertwined. I bet she felt her real 'soulmate' was this OM, and that she was mistaken about me. It must have hurt her badly to leave him and come back to me (although she is only partially back).

Love stinks. Wish I had some. ;-)

[tyler]

Because the balancing act of which you speak is so important.

How to prefer without wanting? Tough question. I'm working on it myself. I ask myself, if I just met her, saw her walking by, would I still be interested? Hard to say. (Obviously what is good for the goose is good for the gander, yet in most of our situations our WAS has made it clear they aren't interested).

My W is by most accounts beautiful. Co-workers, friends and associates always comment on that. Yet, I see her naked.
Not that it is horrific, but 4 kids do a lot of damage to a womans body. She also gained almost 80 pounds during her last pregnancy, it was a tough one. I'm being honest here. It's necessary. I thought about it yesterday, she was laying out on our deck tanning. At that moment, not the most flattering angle, I thought, if I met her right now, I probably wouldn't be interested, just from a physical POV.

It was enlightening to say the least. I did feel a twinge of guilt for thinking that way. I realized, there is a delicate balance to be walked in detaching, leaving behind the need for someone and instead prefering.

My story is long and complicated, just do a search on my name, it's a wild ride.

[LoginName]

Thanks TL. I always appreciate your comments. To be honest, I keep hoping you'll bring out the 2x4 and knock some sense into me, on my other threads. On this thread, I really am interested in what Love is, and what it means to others. I have a 2x4 of my own, and use it on myself occasionally. Not as easy, but I guess it still works. Anyway.... love...

Marriage has always been about the children, really. Yes, even for those who for one reason or another can't have them...

Yes, I believe this too. No matter what our modern society and economy and science do or say, kids need parents - and 2 are better then 1.

It's simply another opportunity for to lose ourselves in order to find ourselves

Ah HA!!! Maybe this is it! We are all looking for someone to help us feel whole, help us feel complete, lose ourselves and remember/feel that we are one, and one with God. Losing ourselves, to find ourselves. And apparently this is a hard thing to do. I wonder why it's so hard so much of the time (and yet, when it works, it can feel so easy and natural).

TL, I hope things are happening to you that you wouldn't have been able to believe a few months ago. Are you losing yourself?

I think that if we live by the premise that it's all about being the right person, then we can be guaranteed growth and happiness (not the party fun kind, but the real kind), but we can't be guaranteed the return of our spouse, or love, or anything else that involves the reaction and actions of another. But living by being the right person is the only, and the best, path we can follow (and the best chance at finding love too.)

[toughlover]

Dude, things are both completely different than I ever expected yet, in some ways, very much what I expected and hoped for.

Love IS a decision.

This is a dark journey. It's walking through the woods at night with a spouse who is there somewhere, but not there for you at first...which is why you have to be there for you, and realize that it is an opportunity to lose yourself in obedience to God.

You're right...many of these sitch's arise because one or both spouses try to lose themselves in the other...instead of losing themselves in service to the other, or in love for the other. There is a big difference.

We need to love our spouses because of who God is.

Remember, we're kind of at the bottom line here. Lives and futures and families hinge on the choices both spouses make at this point.

And we make those choices feeling like we're in darkness, and in a way we are.

Truthfully, the hardest part of my journey was getting back together, trusting again...getting most of what I wanted. I have that now, but I have to choose every day whether I'm going to get sucked back into the nastiness of the past and let that overwhelm me, or if I'm going to fight through it for my sake, and the sake of my family.

I can tell you that it's a whole lot easier now. That's not because of her, though, that's because of what I chose, and continue to choose, and what God has done.

However, the current success of our marriage, our relationship, and the joy that we've been able to experience IS because we have both chosen that, and God has blessed it.

I read on the Separated board a few weeks ago how they thought the Piecing forum was the "most depressing place" or something. Perhaps they're right, or perhaps they're not happy with the way reality works out: there's no thunderclap, flash of light, instant happiness. The road back is tough and people come here to vent about that.

But those that vent ARE on the road back.

My wife's done right by me. I'm doing right by her. We have a real marriage. We love each other, have fun with each other. Have the same kinds of problems that most married people do. The difference now is in how we handle them with each other.

We're at the one-year mark from when she dropped the bomb. At this time last year I couldn't visualize what our marriage has now become. She'll tell you she couldn't imagine ever being attracted to me again, feeling anything for me at all. I didn't really see it either...but we both did what we knew was right, and it's all come back.

In our case it came back because I made the decision, independent of her, to be the best husband and father I could be regardless of her choice; and I refused to quit on the marriage, but I accepted that she could choose to quit.