Just discovered the forum. Read through most of the stickys and the newcomer advice. Combed through a lot of the posts. Had my first coaching session today and a copy of DR is on the way. I just wanted to share my story too. I definitely hit rock bottom and am starting the path to be better, and I know I need to do this for me, but I'm wondering if you all think there's any hope here. Or do I really need to let go.
W and I have been married for almost three years, together for almost seven. Last weekend, BD - after I asked "You want a divorce?", she responded with "I don't want to but I think it's inevitable." Up to that point, we had been fighting a lot, and normally we wouldn't fight, just not talk about issues. She is the one who is the communicator and I would either resist or not bring things up unless she did first.
Here's the lead-up. We have pretty different personalities - she is more structured and logical and I am more emotional and free-spirited. Met at work and bonded over that shared passion. I have changed and no longer share that passion. Sex during the honeymoon phase was great. Six months in, she went through a really traumatic event involving her family. Sex stopped. It was too painful for her. Instead of being supportive, I got angry. That was the beginning of our sexless relationship. We ignored it for a long time, somehow moved in together, got engaged, married and went through a several year period where we just didn't talk about it. She would be the one to bring it up, but I would I shut down and wasn't willing to communicate about it at all. Then we'd just move on and pretend nothing happened. All this time, we started to live our own lives. We are both very independent people and our relationship transformed into one of roommates. I ignored this. The sex issue for me was p**n-related, but I was ashamed to come clean to her. It was only recently that I admitted this, and she felt really betrayed - it was very much why didn't you tell me sooner, maybe we could have done something about it then. We've always been really good friends. The lovers part is what's been missing.
After the honeymoon, two years ago, she first drops the bomb that she's unhappy and something needs to change. We went to marriage counseling, but it was with someone who was not qualified to deal with our problems. She was much more "why" oriented than solution-oriented. She also ended up becoming my individual therapist. I had a lot of issues from my past and childhood that I needed to work through and she actually was very helpful in that regard. Therapist tried to work on the sex issue with us, but didn't have a lot of solutions for us. If anything, she just helped us understand why each of us is the way we are because of our childhoods and personalities.
Fast-forward to a few months ago. I tend to make changes when my back is against the wall. Things initially got better when we first started working with the first therapist (except for sex), but I got complacent. Also by this time we had had sex a few times but it was not great. The spark was missing and we were trying to do it to get pregnant, which didn't work. Her trust in me had been a big issue, and I did a few things to violate that. She is big into trust. There was the p**n issue. She caught me lying about little things. The big one (and I think the straw) was her thinking I was saving up for a down payment for our house most of last year, when I was using the money for something else for myself. When she found out I had not saved anything, that was when the talk turned to "we need to think about separation." - This was in February. I found us another therapist at my suggestion.
Then the quarantine started. Things were not great already, and here we were in the same space together all the time. Barely talked. And when we did, it was fighting about the same things. Finally, last weekend she said she had prayed about it and thought about it a lot and that she was 100% sure D is what she wants. She has said this a few times since also. We had had some individual sessions with the new therapist, who I wished we had found initially. W has told therapist she is absolutely sure this is what she wants and hopes therapist can guide us through the process. W also found an apartment already and signed a lease (a few days after the BD).
There is no affair. I know this for sure. This was a lead-up of a lot of little things. I emotionally neglected her and the marriage. I wanted to live like a single guy husband. It was my first serious relationship and I've been immature and wanted to have my cake and eat it too. She gave me a second chance and while things got better for a little bit, they reverted back to her being unhappy. Or she never got to that happiness.
Another thing is she has constantly looked for other jobs to better our situation. I was content with the job I have had since we first met - I make decent money but could make more. When I did apply for and get offered another job last summer, I turned it down because it would have interfered with the thing I was funneling down-payment money into (essentially, a side business that will hopefully be fruitful one day but not anytime soon - this is something she is resentful about because I decided to do it myself without planning with her). About a month after that, she gets a way better job. From her perspective, she's done all the sacrifice for us. She has also said that she feels like the parent in the relationship, and she doesn't trust that I want to have kids (something that means a lot to her) even though I do (my actions have demonstrated a lot of hesitation).
I also spend a lot of my time at my job doing the side-business thing. To her, it's unethical (she used to do the same job and knows what goes into it). She has said she doesn't think I have a good work ethic and that it's hard for her to be attracted to me because of that. Because of all of these issues put together.
In the last few days, there has been warmth from her. She is normally very stoic, but she has cried a lot in my presence and around me the last few days (I'm chalking this up to guilt). I do think there is a tiny bit of hesitation on her part but she is someone who does not make decisions lightly. She is very deliberate and does not change her mind, especially about big things. I think she is too proud to ever change her mind on something like this. I initially avoided her then did some crying around her, but within the past few days I have been more poised and adopted a strong, accepting attitude towards her. Not cold but not too warm either. Just trying to be friendly and supportive to a limited extent.
I do still want to be married to her and save it if possible, but I also realize it may be too far gone and that I've done a lot of damage - broken her trust, wasted her prime baby-making years, and been selfish. Is it too far gone and how do I best proceed?
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Your H or W is giving you a GIFT. THE GIFT OF TIME. USE it wisely.
Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon
Me-66, D33,S32
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
You have actually created two threads and I will delete the other one. You will remain on moderation for a bit. Also, please understand that the moderators are not paid workers for Michele. We volunteer our time here whenever we can, so if you need the moderators' assistance hit the notify button and please be patient. We will get to your requests/concerns as soon as possible.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
Hey R, welcome to the board and I am sorry you are going through this right now but it sounds like you have a lot to work on to improve yourself as a man and a future partner.
Unfortunately, the hardest thing for you right now is to realize there's nothing you can actively do that will change what she's going to do. Nothing.
You need to accept that, process it, surrender to it. That is the hardest part of all of this, the situation, in terms of what she does, cannot be changed by you. It's too late for that now.
If you want to reconcile, you're in a waiting game, and the only course of action that leads to reconciliation, IMO, is emotional distance and not actively trying to fix *anything* between you because that ship has sailed.
You need to focus on you, being the best man you can be, and taking your attention 100% off of her. Do not be her friend, do not be her safety net, do not engage with her at all beyond the minimum you can manage. That's it. Get her out of the house as soon as possible, co-habitation will make things worse.
Does that sound like horrible advice? Is it scary? Are you convinced that certainly it doesn't apply to you?
That's all normal. Everyone feels like their situation is unique, and there must be some answer, some solution they just haven't discovered that is within their control. There isn't. You don't have an option that doesn't suck. You have to pick the least $hitty option of all the $hitty options you have and learn to accept that. The option that [censored] the least is protecting yourself by giving yourself emotional space.
Distance from her emotionally, but be happy, upbeat, successful and positive on your own. Fake it until you make it. That is quite literally all you can do, and that, my friend, is a very bitter pill to swallow.
Thanks, LH. I know I have a lot of work to do and it needs to be for me and to be a better man and partner in the future. I was complacent and took a lot for granted, just doing what I wanted to do thinking there would never be consequences. I've always been coddled and given infinite chances in during my life, which is probably why I've been so immature. This is what it took for me to hit rock bottom.
I read your whole post the other day. It reminded a lot of my situation. I had built up a lot of negativity over the years and then my wife had enough and finally bomb dropped me one day.
My biggest rules for you are:
1. No more ILY's 2. No more pressure 3. No peacocking
Read Sandi's 37 rules every day. Work on being a better you every day. Go GAL. Do it. Whatever that me be for you. I know the sex issue hits home for me. I find sex a bit dull and I know that it is in my head. I didn't have a ton of partners or one nighters but I've never gone more than a couple of years without a new, "fresh" partner in my mind. This isn't a big concern for you right now though.
I believe you are in LRT territory. Last Resort Technique means:
1. Stop Pursuing 2. GAL 3. Wait and See
Learn how to validate. Learn how to be still and calm instead of filling in the silence. Learn active listening. Learn how to bite your tongue. And be very, very patient. I don't care how stubborn she is I can tell she is not totally gone so you do this right and you do it right now. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
In the last few days, there has been warmth from her. She is normally very stoic, but she has cried a lot in my presence and around me the last few days
It sounds like she still has feelings for you and no affairs. I believe you have a shot.
I read your whole post the other day. It reminded a lot of my situation. I had built up a lot of negativity over the years and then my wife had enough and finally bomb dropped me one day.
My biggest rules for you are:
1. No more ILY's 2. No more pressure 3. No peacocking
It means a lot to find someone with a similar story. I have combed through a lot of posts (but still tip of the iceberg), and couldn't find one that totally resonated with mine. I think I've been following these rules, but can you elaborate more on "no more pressure" and "no peacocking." I definitely get the general idea, but just wondering if you have any more specifics.
I have been reading the rules everyday and have been maintaining my poise. Copy of DR is in the mail. Only one R talk so far that she initiated where I made sure to validate as much as possible and gave her the "I don't agree with this but if it's what you want I accept it." Unfortunately, it also tapped into her (very strong) logical mind and I could tell the resistance was starting to build - she still insists we are two different people who aren't capable of meeting each other's needs. This is when I gave her the "I don't agree with this but..." and ended the convo. Overall, there has still be warmth and she has started to ask me where I've been going during the day.
My priority has been working on me, and reflecting and learning from all the mistakes I made during the relationship. Lots of reading and journalling the last few days. I had been in denial for a long time, but nothing brings clarity quite like a BD after you get through the initial fog.
I am definitely in LRT territory. No doubt about that. She already found a new apartment and I am about to sign a lease today. I have stopped pursuing and have just been keeping it as light and playful as possible without being cold or distant. GALing has never been a problem for me. If anything, I've prioritized too much GALing during the relationship and we/she was on the backburner for a long-time. And the wait and see. Yep. Gotta accept this is what is happening, take it one step at a time, and see what happens.
Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Learn how to validate. Learn how to be still and calm instead of filling in the silence. Learn active listening. Learn how to bite your tongue. And be very, very patient. I don't care how stubborn she is I can tell she is not totally gone so you do this right and you do it right now. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Indeed. Been working on validation the last few days too. I had been doing the opposite leading up to the BD. Can't control the outcome, but I can control the process. Thanks for your advice.
Originally Posted by CWarrior
It sounds like she still has feelings for you and no affairs. I believe you have a shot.
This was my initial instinct, but I wasn't sure if reading into it too much. Thanks for the insight.
