Coming back from my emotional abuse

[GoRoPo]

Thanks again Fogg.

A few specific questions:

1) A big part of the original problem was my un-involved-ness, selfishness, doing what I wanted when I wanted. I know that this has been discussed here before.

Today she is taking the girls to a friend's house, and she invited me to come along with. I mind-read that this is primarily because she knows how important it is to me to see the kids and she doesn't want to "hoard" them. Either way, I am fine giving her space and going to do something else tonight.

I assume that I shouldn't tell her "No, it's fine. I'd like to but I'll give you some space. I'll go XXXXX", right? What should I say instead?

2) Should I just NOT WORRY about her, her depression, hiding upstairs, etc? Just act as if everything is OK? Seems so weird to me, to act all peppy and happy when she's clearly moping around.

3) I know that she thinks that separation is imminent. It came up last week in therapy, etc. As I said before, I am (was?) willing to concede me moving out as a point of repentance, good faith, call it what you will. How do I now reverse that and tell her that if she wants to move out she is welcome to, but I will be staying, without seeming like a complete a-hole?

4) Therapy seems to be bringing up these issues and exacerbating them. I know for a fact that when it went in her head from me being "crappy" to me being "emotionally abusive" it was a big blow and sticking point. She has told me that on more than one occasion, and even just that terminology is making it harder for her to forgive.

I know that it's something that we have to work through, but do you guys think that therapy is still the right course of action here? Our therapist is great, but she isn't a divorce busting therapist -- or rather she seems very pro marriage but maybe is holding her cards close to the vest to deal them out at appropriate strategic times. Not sure if she has a plan, but I'd hope so.

[GoRoPo]

Further to question (1) -- should I just go to where she is if I want to? Am I over-thinking and trying to be too strategic?

[Fogg]

I know your looking for some advice right now and was hoping someone would notice and add their thoughts. Due to your situation with your W being so different than what I'm familiar with, I'm a bit hesitant to offer any specific advice about those things. I think that's also why you haven't been getting much input so far, people comment on what they can relate with. Many of us have S's in A's, so certain actions make more sense to us than someone trying to avoid a W from leaving. For me I can just relate to your thinking and obsessing about things and offer what I've learned so far.

Have you read the book? I think it focuses more on this situation than what we mostly go through(going dark, LRT, etc)

1. "No, it's fine. I'd like to but I'll give you some space." I wouldn't state the reason as your giving her space. It also comes across as "I would like to go, but because of YOU I wont, so ill do what I think you want".

2. You cant fix her, she has to. The more you try the more it looks like your pursuing her. If space is what she wants, try to respect that.

3. Regarding moving out, I didn't realize you already told her you would. Have you told her you would move out or just offered to, if she wanted? I said the same to my W early and its only caused me issues. The decision I made recently was based on what I believe my best course and what my IC suggests, but still hasn't happened yet. For you, I wouldn't just try to move out thinking it will help.

4. MC is generally not useful once a S checks out of the M. I'm not sure if your W has fully or not, so not sure.

I will say this, my W also had issues being around me early on in the house and I stayed in the house all day and never went out. It didn't help me. You should find ways to get out of the house some days (not move out), but just GAL.

[GoRoPo]

Is it worth asking (at therapy) what it was she DID love about me? Or let the therapist plot the course?

I really have no idea what it was she loved about me at this point (yes I am a bit broken right now) so can't work on reinforcing those areas consciously.

[GoRoPo]

I think it's safe to say she hasn't checked out. She truly doesn't know if she can get over the the pain I have caused. Almost like I was the unfaithful one, really. Which I did break the promise of the love and marriage, absolutely.

Which is why I am so unsure about how to approach this. All the changes I have made so far have been permanent and positive, and she has recognized them before. Just not sure what to do in this moment of her trying to figure out if she can be with me still.

I haven't specifically offered, more implied. Told her I had been talking to friends about possibly staying with them. Early on I had more of a scorched earth reaction, or maybe less so just that I wasn't going to help or take part of her moving out in any way.

[GoRoPo]

Yes I have read and re read the book DR. I'm continually working on myself. Being out of control is a very hard one for me. Thus my posts methinks. Gotta let go and detach right?

[Fogg]

Just not sure what to do in this moment of her trying to figure out if she can be with me still.

You keep working on yourself and let her figure out her own path. Its difficult, but there may be nothing you need/can do other than be patient and not put any pressure on her.

[GoRoPo]

Thank you again Fogg.

I know it's NOT detachment, but I always feel better when I truly feel that we have hope to stay together. Like, she's still in the house, we still talk and laugh, we are going to counselling, she hasn't decided upon a course for herself yet "we may need to separate" is about the furthest it gets.

Is it OK to let myself feel this hope? Is there anything wrong even if it is denial?

[Fogg]

Nothing wrong with hope. The issue becomes when you look at those small things (her in house, not saying D, still talking) it makes you feel good. At some point one of those things may change and you will not feel good anymore, you will feel bad. Its all about your emotional sanity.

For many of us we look at something like them still talking to us as an expectation of things getting better. When they suddenly stop talking to us we think things are getting worse and that crashes us down emotionally. The truth is them talking may or may not be a good thing for our sitches, its hard to really tell. Over time letting those expectations effect our emotional state over and over can wear down a person, its not healthy. So avoiding those expectations is whats best in the long run.

Even if things are going bad you can still have hope.

[GoRoPo]

Thanks again Fogg.

Hey everyone, so I figured I'd post an update here. Journaling live here and so forth. If I get any responses, great.

So, as of this past Tuesday, my wife officially said that she wants a separation while we were in marriage counselling. After she said it, the therapist asked her how she felt, and she said it was like a sandbag lifting off her heart.

I kind of knew that was coming. I have had two DB coaching sessions so far (paid for three, finances are tight but want to continue as needed). Coach has been great, talking about all the opportunities that are there to DB, not focusing on the separation so much as what I do getting there, leading up to it.

I compare it to jiu jitsu. Using what how she expects me to reply, and doing the opposite. Haven't had a chance to implement any strategy from the last session, which was this past Friday after she talked about separation. She had already planned a trip to go visit her family in another state, and took the red-eye the next night.

One of the things that she said that was interesting was that she was super scared, and that she needs me but doesn't want me. Didn't hit me super hard or anything, just something I've been thinking about.

We have been super friendly in texts while she's been away. It's all so strange. Like she sent me text that she was sitting there in the room with the windows open, listening to the rain and watching the lighting. And that I did a good job that day (had a bunch of friends and kids over for a swim party). And "Goodnight".

I know it's foolish to hope that she will have some major change while she's away, come to her senses and come running in to my arms. Man how awesome would that be?

Anyway, just updating. We will see what happens. Right now I really have no idea how I can logistically move out.

One actual question:

This will be a controlled separation, at least that was the plan last time we spoke, with pre-determined "rules" and so forth, like no dating, how much or little contact, etc. She said that if she had a magic wand, she would wave it and we would be healed and together. She has said that her goal for this separation is to gain clarity and see if she can heal and open her heart to me again.

We have a pool house and another detached structure on my property that I use for an office. I really want to do this controlled separation correctly. Do you think that being in that close proximity would be far enough, enough space? Or should I continue to look for alternate options to get even further away?

Thanks for reading.