Quoting Sage:* expose myself -- without the a. as the "issue" in the m, we are back on level ground.
Oooo. Ding-a-ling-a-ling! This struck a chord, Sage. I think (and I remember about reading about this on the BB before) that I like having/taking the moral high-ground. Before DBing and all this junk happened, I would be a bit arrogant about what's right and what's wrong...try to impose my moral views on others. My judgmental attitude was one of the things that my W did not like. I don't feel this way so much anymore because I have come to the conclusion that, "who am I to judge?" Who's to say that someone doing something "wrong" isn't an opportunity for them to grow in the long run...or help someone else to grow? But, alas, I guess there are remnants.
BTW, this is kind of hard stuff for me to be writing about... I'm digging deep here...
So, when I think about this one, I guess I do have a certain power being the one cheated on, do I not? I have the power to give forgiveness, I have the power to trust, I have the power to let or not let my pain go. I can exert this power to achieve certain things...almost like blackmail. Now, I haven't been doing this (blackmail), but I still KNOW I have it. You see? Taking the moral high-ground, even without reminding my W of my "morals," still gives me this power. And power leads to control, does it not? And control (being a child of an alcoholic) is something I need to let go of...because I only have control over me.
WOW!
So, I believe this is one dynamic. The other is that I'm just plain scared. I'm scared to trust her again. I'm scared to give myself fully to my M because I'll be totally exposing myself. And my pain reminds me to be careful. I DON'T WANT TO GO THROUGH THIS AGAIN!!!
Thanks, Sage. Interesting...
Quoting JS:But positive growth is always good.
Yup. Changing for the better can never be a bad thing.
Quoting Dagny:You said you are dudley-do right. Is your W intimitated by this? Here she does the worse thing in a M, realizes her mistake, but has probably been scared to give you details, how can she confirm the suspicions of a man who is moral when she has been amoral.
I think you kind of said the same thing as Sage, but it was her words that really got to me. Thanks Dag.
Quoting Sue:He tests us many times..in many ways.
That he does, Sue, that he does... Thanks.
Thanks so much everyone. I think I've gained a bit of clarity today. This was a helpful exercise.
Quote: The other is that I'm just plain scared. I'm scared to trust her again. I'm scared to give myself fully to my M because I'll be totally exposing myself. And my pain reminds me to be careful. I DON'T WANT TO GO THROUGH THIS AGAIN!!!
Hi again- I too have many doubts...I try to remember the following poem when I am really doubting! I ran across this in high school and have kept a copy of it ever since!
To Risk
To laugh is to risk appearing the fool, To weep is to risk appearing sentimental, To reach out for another is to risk involvement,
To express feelings, is to risk exposing your true self, To place your ideas, your dreams before the crowd is to risk ridicule, To love is to risk not being loved back,
To live is to risk dying, To hope is to risk despair, To try at all is to risk failure,
But risk we must because, The greatest fear in life is to risk nothing, Those who risk nothing do nothing, have nothing, are nothing,
They may avoid suffering...but they simply cannot learn, feel, grow, live or love, Chained by their attitudes, they are slaves who have forfeited freedom, Only the person who risks is free.
Quote: Thanks so much everyone. I think I've gained a bit of clarity today. This was a helpful exercise.
Glad you are doing better....sounds like you feel better about everything today! Keep up the hard work...
Sandra
Never argue with idiots, they bring you down to their level and beat you with experience...
Not a lot of time to post...must bathe before midnight if I hope to tuck in nice and early (by 2 a.m. ).
Your last post rang some bells for me Jethro. The whole "higher ground"/morals bit...I HAVE to wonder if that's why the words "I forgive you" have not yet crossed my lips? There IS a certain power/control being the one betrayed and returned to.
I'm going to have to give this some meditation time while I soak. Thanks!
where you seek W's forgiveness is where you'll find your own and it will show W the absolute need to seek yours AND it'll make the path easier for both of you
Quoting jethro: So, when I think about this one, I guess I do have a certain power being the one cheated on, do I not? I have the power to give forgiveness, I have the power to trust, I have the power to let or not let my pain go. I can exert this power to achieve certain things...almost like blackmail. Now, I haven't been doing this (blackmail), but I still KNOW I have it. You see? Taking the moral high-ground, even without reminding my W of my "morals," still gives me this power. And power leads to control, does it not? And control (being a child of an alcoholic) is something I need to let go of...because I only have control over me.
Sounds like you hit the jackpot with this one, jethro. Good stuff (and I appreciate how hard the "digging deep" is for you. Makes it even more valuable in my book!)
Sage
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
To refer to a quote from "Shrek", I guess we are discovering we're all onions! Jethro sounds like you're starting to peel away some of the deeper layers and with that comes some of the lessons learned that get us closer to our self-enlightenment, but at certain points we need to take a break too...
Quoting Jackie: I think a vacation is a great idea. How about at least a mental vacation? Give yourself a week or two where you will use every visiualation trick you know to stop thinking of the R, and just do whatever else you do that is not about M.
I have discovered this past week just how wise this advise is and what a 180 it has worked out to be. I've been so unbelievable busy this past week that I just haven't had the time to ponder R, M, OM, PA ... or what's going thru W's mind, her thoughts, or even my own. It's forced me to take a mental hiatus (and it seems for my W too in some regard), including even getting on this board or anything else to do with "working on M", and it has done wonders as I still was able to recognize the positives but didn't allow me to analyze or pick the sitch apart (of course, the down side to this is I'm now hopelessly behind on this forum) ... in short it forced me to stop thinking so damn much (and again the same seems to go for W too.) ... so we've been getting along great for the last week and I've come to realize just how much torment I been putting myself thru and how much effort it was taking to continue that train of thought process. Actually, its worth considering as a 180 to continue for a while longer ... the trick will be finding more to keep us so busy.
I took a couple months off from the bb and I am slowly getting caught up with my bb friends threads. I am glad to see you and the Mrs's are continuing to work on the renewing of y'alls M. As for me, June was not a pretty month but July is looking to be a positive one.
I made a few posts on my old thread in the Sep forum and now have moved over to the Surviving the Big D forum. I noticed in one of your last posts about being scared to trust your W again. Having trust again seems to be a common fear whether you are piecing the M or surviving a D. I know I am struggling with it myself.
Come by when you have time. It is always nice to hear from my dear friends.
Hi, I've just been reading over your post, and sympothize with what you are feeling. I too, successfully DB'd. But sometimes, even after W being home and commited for over 2 yrs. now, that I still feel angry sometimes. Resentful sometimes, that my W don't truly understand the pain, and anguish that I endured during our S.
Don't get me wrong, our M is better than ever. But S, effects us more than our WAW's realize.
I found that the 10 mos of Dbing, didn't compare to the DBing since she has come home. The hardest thing is to maintain the frame of mind I had while DBing to get her home. My 180's have stuck, but sometimes you have to step back like you did with your "kid time", and evaluate your sitch.
My W see's this and is really thrilled with my attitude change, (like you, I had the holier than thow attitude). It does get easier my friend.
Your fresh out of the black hole. Give yourself some time to process this. I know, that your W not divulging everything right away is frustrating. She is DBing so to speak also. She sees the changes you've made. And with every little bit of info she divulges to you she feels more comfortable with the man you have become, over the man you were. Patience my friend.
Don't think of them as still more lies being uncovered. Think of them as the stocks reaping the dividends that you have invested in your M. She's not making up more lies to cover other lies. She's just choosing her time to tell you. Remeber even though she's the one that had the A, she feels bad too, that she did something to hurt you so much. But, she is home and working on a better M.
).
Jethro sounds like you're starting to peel away some of the deeper layers and with that comes some of the lessons learned that get us closer to our self-enlightenment, but at certain points we need to take a break too...
