Very sad to be here but H says he is leaving

[brokenheart71]

So here is my story... Been married 18 years and a stay at home mom for 12(D12 and D8). We had what I thought was a pleasant if unbalanced marriage - he worked a lot I took care of the kids a lot, almost never argued about anything. We have almost always lived around his schedule - me always accomodating his work. Then about 3 years ago H announces that he doesn't love me, hasn't for a while and had a brief affair while traveling on business about 6 months before that. Things were very tense for about a month but I finally convinced him to go to MC. While he resisted at first and and said he was only going as a favor to me (or so that I couldn't say that he wouldn't try) by about the 3rd or 4th session he had a huge turning point. Said he was so sorry, didn't know what he was thinking, was so glad that I had been so strong and fought for our marriage. We went on a long family vacation and our schedules got busy so we took a break from MC but then he said he didn't think we needed to go back. I thought we probably should and said so but did not insist. And thing were great for a while and then still good after that.
The last year or so have been troubled at times for us and have felt more distant from him. He often says he is stressed/busy with work. He has a business with 2 partners and loves his work but is very unhappy with the partnership structure. His work schedule/habits put a huge strain on our relationship. We also found out we were unexpectantly pregnant in Jan - he was (or at least acted) very happy about it. But in March I had a miscarriage. He was great for those several days but then began to draw back from me - again saying that he is very busy with work. Then a month ago he announced that he no longer loves me and hasn't for a long time and wants to move out. He has spent many nights at hotels and a friends house and traveling. The nights he has stayed here we sleep in separate rooms but he says he gets no sleep when he is here. I have only really argued or lost my cool 3 times - the night he told me, about two weeks ago while he was traveling and we argued (mostly I just yelled at him) and then last night.
I had a huge charity event that I have been organizing for months and it was on Saturday night. It went really well and H told me several times he was so proud of me and that I had done such a great job. That night (we both had several drinks) he got very emotional saying that I deserved someone better, and that he really loves this family and that why it is really hard to do this. I thought these were good signs but he totally disappeared all day yesterday - I knew he was golfing in the am but still wasn't home by 6pm. We haven't said anything to our kids and they kept asking where he was. I texted a couple times and then called, and then called some more. When he finally called me back around 8:30 and said he was still hanging out at the golf club I lost it. I yelled that he needed to make up his mind whether he lived here or not and lots of other things. He said he was not coming home that night, I said it would have been nice if he had told me that early in the day. He didn't want to discuss on the phone last night (especially since I was very angry and yelling - I really don't usually show much emotion or call him out on anything). He said we could meet today to discuss the situation but that he is still planning on moving out. I asked if he is seeing someone and he said no, and I do believe him about that.
Now I'm not sure what to do. I have tried very hard to detach and GAL the last month. I don't know if I should encourage him to move out or stay. Part of me thinks he does need some time away to clear his head, and maybe we would be better off to wait a month or more to discuss our R. But the other part of me is afraid that he won't come back, that he won't miss me. I am also completely dreading telling our kids and then our families and friends.
Thanks for any advice you can give.

Brokenheart71,
Me 30 H 40
married 18 years

[Cadet]

Welcome to the board.

Have you read the DR book yet?

Get out and GAL.

DETACH.

Believe none of what he says and half of what he does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

You are on moderation right now on the forum.
SO post in small frequent posts until you get off of it.
Stick to this thread until 100 posts for your story.

Your H is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
Use it wisely.

Knowledge is Power.

[brokenheart71]

I have read DR

Just talked to H. He has an apt picked out and will be signing the lease soon. He wants to think/talk about/decide how he will be seeing our girls before we tell them. His suggestion of what time he will spend with them(he wants to still come have dinner with us and stay until they go to bed) is way more than how much time he spends with them now. I said its ironic and makes me really mad that he has made more time for me and is planning on making more time for them now than he has the past couple years. Really no response from him. He did say "you are one of the nicest and probably best people I know. This isn't about that". And that he has tried very hard to be in love with me but just isn't - I told him I wouldn't argue about his feelings but would not accept that he had tried really hard. I also said that at some point down the road I would like to go to joint counseling , he asked what the point would be and I said that we would have to learn to communicate better just in raising our kids. He again didn't really respond. Near the end I said that he was welcome to have meals with us but not just to drop by unannounced. He agreed and I also said that I would not bring up our R for at least a month. He said that that isn't fair to me and I kind of snapped and said that he is not ready to listen and would only disagree with anything I said. And that I thought his perspective is way off right now, that I think he is taking the last 6 months of unhappiness and applying it to our whole history. I also asked what he was feeling 2.5 years ago when we went through MC and we were very happy, he said he should have been more honest with me then. I told him he did a heck of an acting job because he seemed pretty darn happy. He acknowledged that and I asked what he thought we were doing differently. He asked what I meant and I said that at that time we made each other and R a priority but had not done that the last year. Probably too much talking from me but its killing me that he says he just "fell out of love with me" and doesn't seem to understand that a R takes work from both partners.

Brokenheart71

[AnotherStander]

I have only really argued or lost my cool 3 times - the night he told me, about two weeks ago while he was traveling and we argued (mostly I just yelled at him) and then last night.

Let's start here, this has got to stop right away. I know you're angry, frustrated and upset, but when you argue or yell you're just convincing him that he's doing the right thing in leaving. You're pushing him farther away.

I thought these were good signs but he totally disappeared all day yesterday - I knew he was golfing in the am but still wasn't home by 6pm. We haven't said anything to our kids and they kept asking where he was. I texted a couple times and then called, and then called some more.

Pressure, pressure, pressure. It sounds like you've read DR, you should print out the DB 180 tips and keep them handy so you can review them at least once a day to remind yourself what you should and should not do. Read the below tips and ask yourself if your actions were consistent with DB'ing:

1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.
2. No frequent phone calls.
16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his whereabouts, ASK NOTHING.
21. Never lose your cool.
26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to speak out.

I yelled that he needed to make up his mind whether he lived here or not and lots of other things.

20. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while).

Now I'm not sure what to do. I have tried very hard to detach and GAL the last month.

That's great, but what you did with the yelling and pressure was a huge backslide and basically sets you back to the beginning. Backslides ruin whatever forward progress you might have made. You have to be consistent in your DB'ing.

I don't know if I should encourage him to move out or stay.

You don't encourage either. He needs to make the decision on his own. What you do is show him a happy, confident you. When he opens up to you emotionally you validate his emotions without agreeing or disagreeing. "Sorry but I'm still leaving." "You sound frustrated with our situation, I can understand why you feel that way and I support your decision." You're not telling him to stay or leave, you're simply validating his decision.

Part of me thinks he does need some time away to clear his head, and maybe we would be better off to wait a month or more to discuss our R.

Yes he does. He needs space and time. That doesn't necessarily mean he has to move out, but it does mean you need to seriously detach. As far as discussing R, your goal should be to NEVER bring it up. If he brings it up then let him talk and you listen. But you should never initiate any R, M, S or D talks. He will see it as pressure.

But the other part of me is afraid that he won't come back, that he won't miss me.

Most have that fear about S. But you have no control over it, if you force him to stay then he will resent it and things will get worse. He feels caged in and you need to throw the cage door open so that he understands you're not holding him against his will. It will be his choice whether to step out of the cage.

I said its ironic and makes me really mad that he has made more time for me and is planning on making more time for them now than he has the past couple years. Really no response from him.

You need to understand that he is not thinking logically right now. He's thinking emotionally. He's built a fantasy in his mind about what S is going to be like. In his fantasy he has never-ending time to bond with his kids, he makes zillions of dollars while barely working, he has Playboy playmates feeding him grapes while he reclines and watches football on a 100" flat screen and he looks like Brad Pitt in Troy. He will be excited about moving out because he's so convinced he's going to live his dream. Don't get mad at him or argue with him about it, he's going to have to experience the bubble bursting himself.

And that he has tried very hard to be in love with me but just isn't - I told him I wouldn't argue about his feelings but would not accept that he had tried really hard.

Well you're right, but again, when you tell him these things you are arguing with his emotions. He built a wall around himself and emotions are the guardians holding the keys to the locked chains on the gate. Argue with his emotions and they throw another chain and lock on the gate. Validate his emotions and they start lowering their guard.

I also said that at some point down the road I would like to go to joint counseling

I hate to keep hitting you with 2x4's, but you're really doing everything wrong that you possibly can DO NOT try to talk him into counseling! Counseling is for piecing, not for DB'ing. Go to IC for yourself if you need it, or better yet try a DB coach.

And that I thought his perspective is way off right now, that I think he is taking the last 6 months of unhappiness and applying it to our whole history.

I'm going to sound like a broken record, but don't do this! You're trying to reason with him. His emotions are running things, logic and reason are vacationing in Tahiti.

he said he should have been more honest with me then. I told him he did a heck of an acting job because he seemed pretty darn happy.

He'w rewriting history, very common in this situation. You're wasting time arguing with him about it because he BELIEVES his rewritten version for now.

So now you know what not to do. What should you do? Work on yourself, document your contributions to the marital problems and do 180's on those issues. Live the DB 180 tips. These in particular:

12. Act as if you are moving on with your life.
13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive.
14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends, etc.
17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse.
18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he will be missing
19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him someone he would want to be around.
27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil).
28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly.
29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write.

[TD35]

As hard as it is to follow sometimes, AnotherStander is right. All of this is pressure and just allowing him to validate his emotions. The fog is thick right now. Reread DB/DR and start working on you. Also, stick to the rules as closely as possible. At first you may have to force yourself to, but after a while they become second nature.

You obviously care enough to keep trying, but the best way to try is to focus on you right now.

[brokenheart71]

I understand your points an recognize much of the advice from reading other's stories. One of my posts that did not show up said that aside from these 3 interaction he/we act completely normal. He calls and texts me several times a day to talk about really nothing. He is still playing words with friends with me. Other than we sleep in separate rooms, life is pretty normal. I know that I have lost my temper those 3 times and don't plan on doing it any more.
The other confusing part to me is that standing up for myself is a 180. There is basically no arguing in our relationship and never really has been - we've been too good at ignoring our problems. I have always been very accomodating and easy going with him having a lot of freedom to work and socialize (those often blur as he entertains clients a lot) without any questions or grief from me. I do think that he sometimes he sees me as a "martyr" that doesn't stand up for myself. Similar to how my mom acts which drives him crazy. He thinks she puts up with way too much crap from my dad and it too good to him (and I agree).
During our last conversation I said that I would not bring up our R for a month so we would both have some time to reflect and clear our heads. He said that I was being unfair to myself (again me not standing up for myself in hes eyes) but I have kept to it and plan to continue.

Brokenheart71

[brokenheart71]

Some of my posts aren't showing up. I had written thanks for the advice and I'm not surprised by much of but they were good reminders. Part of my confusion is that being passive and letting him make decisions without my input is "more of the same".
That being said, he signed a 6 month lease yesterday, want to tell our kids today and move out mid week.
I hope I find the strength to get through it. I can't eat or sleep and feel that catching up to me too.
Thanks,
Brokenheart71

[brokenheart71]

Not sure why my posts don't show up. I guess fr now I will just consider this more of a journal entry.
H rented an apt on Friday and we told our girls on Saturday that he was moving out - very hard. He promised them that he would still be in their life. He stayed her Saturday night (he planned on moving out on tues) but was up and gone before we got up on Sunday morning. D(12) had a softball tournament, he kept texting that he would meet us there bt never showed up. I was planning on going to a football game Sunday night. He asked when I was leaving, I said around 4:30 he said he would be here at 5:30 and asked if the girls would be ok alone for a little while. I did leave a little after 4:30 and he texted at 5:00 hat he would be home shortly. But then Ds call me at 6:00 to tell me he was in a town a couple hours away and wouldn't be home for a while. They were scared and upset. I called H and he again told me he was only a little ways away. I call the house back and tell them they misunderstood and he would be there shortly, they say they are on the phone to him right then and he is telling them it will be at least 2 more hours. I call him again and he tells me that"he will handle it" but won't tell me exactly where he is. I hang up and call my neice to go over. Around 9:00 he texts me that "sorry I was running a bit late, I thought the girls would be ok for a couple of hours. But since you thought it was important to call in reinforcements, I'll stay at the apartment tonight." He has never acted like this before. And our girls have never stayed alone for more than about an hour, I believe he did that.
Today he has called and come over to apologize to me and the girls, stating that he used poor judgement and it won't happen again.
Brokenheart71

[brokenheart71]

Update: After he actually left I am feeling better and more positive. While coming home and seeing his things gone was a jolt, I also feel a sense of relief. Telling my parents and a few friends has gone better than I expected with everyone being very supportive of me. I think I was in such a panic to try to get him to not move out that now that he has I am calmer and concentrating on me. I feel more of a sense that I am going to be ok - whether he changes his mind and agrees to work on things or not. I realize that I deserve someone who really wants to be with me, who adores me - and that is not him. Maybe that will change and maybe it won't but for right now it isn't and I don't want to live like that.
He has been over each day (its only been 2 days) to see our kids which is good. For now I will do what I can to keep it as easy for him to see them as possible. We all went trick or treating last night and was awkward at times (especially when we stopped at my parents - he just went around the corner and waited for us) but I think it was good for our kids.

Brokenheart71

[littleGTO]

Hi, brokenheart71.
Your sitch sounds similar to mine in some ways . Is there currently an OW? By all that you've said it certainly sounds like there might be.
My H also says a lot of the same things yours has said he wants to spend MORE time w kids when moved out (which will be on Sat); wants to eat Sunday dinner at our house; he can't sleep well (neither of us do); he took a 6-month lease (hoping to put a timeline on his decisions about us/OW).

Our H's are living in their own Fantasy world, as AnotherStander has said. Logic is DEFINITELY on vacation.

We are on a very long and windy roller coaster ride.

I understand your pain in having to tell your children about their dad moving out. We just told our boys on Saturday. They were very upset (although S13 did not outwardly ACT so, but I know he is hurting inside).

I'm sure there will be A LOT of saying one thing and doing another, so have NO EXPECTATIONS. However, where the children are concerned, it IS important that if he agrees to DO something with them/for them they HE NEEDS TO FOLLOW THROUGH. Otherwise they are going to let down a lot over time and feel resentment toward him. I would discuss this w him (gently, but firmly).

You CAN NOT CONTROL HIS ACTIONS, so don't try. His emotions are in control (again, AnotherStander makes such good points).

I wish you well in the coming days/weeks. It is not an easy or short journey we are on.

Listen to all the good advice here!