What was I an idiot? Of course there's an OM...

[Telemark]

"Both of my C have told me the med she is on, Wellbutrin, has a terrible track record for helping people maintain R's."

That's interesting...did they say why?

[workinghardguy]

Not specifically... the problem is that there isn't good knowledge on the actual biochemical mechanisms that make Wellbutrin work, therefore it's hard to determine why it does what it does.

My W was prescribed it in order to stop smoking. Though, that was a cover on her part to a degree since she was incredibly depressed and needed something. Since it was for smoking cessation her general practitioner could prescribe it. Last night she revealed to me that while we were on vacation in August (where she was incredibly distant and disengaged... I felt like I was alone on vacation) she was having constant suicidal ideations and thoughts. Most likely this was related to the start of the Wellbutrin regimen as it's a known side effect of starting it.

As far as its effect on Rs, both my C said that studies have shown Wellbutrin is terrible for helping people with depression and in marriages. For whatever reason is effects the brain chemistry surrounding making bonds. Combine my W's alcohol use with this and it's just an extra bigger mountain to overcome.

I simply tossed out last night during our talk that maybe once she is in IC she should discuss her regimen. No pressure, no direction just concern for her. I suspect her IC will see that and possibly consult with a psychiatrist to see if the med selection is the best option.

Here's an article that gets a little more into it, particularly related to the dopamine formation and uptake issues surrounding SSRIs:
Article on SSRIs and relationships

The article focuses a little more heavily on sex than just Rs, but I can see a lot of it in my W. Particularly the difficult getting to O... she still can but it takes much more than it ever did before. Whether that's our R or the meds or both... that's the maddening part.

[jbnati]

I think if your W used the Florida business trip as an example during your talk, it was probably a bigger deal to her than you realize. In the scheme of things, it's not a big deal. However, if it's big to her, hopefully you were able to just listen.

Maybe if she gets C it will help.

It sounds like she would really benefit from C. Your M would likely benefit, too. It sounds like she really does need to get healthy first. Unfortunately, she's not going to hear it from you, even if your intentions are pure. She may be thinking your M is most of the cause of what's going on. It's probably true, though that it does play a part.

[LearningPatience]

WHG, I don't think I've posted on your sitch before, but the discussion over Welbutrin somewhat piqued my interest.

I guess the main point I'd like to convey is that *all* ADs affect different people in different ways. In my own case, I've been on three different ADs, and the one that helped me the most, by far, was the Welbutrin (you can see why this piqued my interest:) It's had the fewest side effects for me also.

BTW, Welbutrin is *not* an SSRI, it's a different class of AD. One of the reasons I asked my Dr for Welbutrin was because of the well known problems SSRIs have with sex drive. I've had no problems, so to speak, while on it.

I guess the reason I'm responding is so that people aren't scared off of a particular medicine if it may be helpful. It sounds like it's not helpful to your W and it wasn't helpful to my S15. OK, they try something else. For me, bingo!

Anyhow, the sitch with your W sounds a bit like mine, so I can emphasize. I want to caution you that it's a looooong road and you will need lots of patience. And when that runs out, you'll need to find more.

Hang in there!

[JustStunned]

In our attempts to understand how we got here we often fix on one or two things. While in some situations this could be valid I believe the causes are often more holistic. It is not any one or two things rather it is the effect of many.

I believe removal of any one or two things will not resolve what has been built up as the “reasons” the WAS uses to justify their actions. The underlying issues driving the reasons will not be resolved unless growth occurs in both the LBS and WAS.

Just as we must look inward and grow so must they. It is unlikely they will do so while running away. IMO the best things we can do are grow ourselves while minimizing the things they are running from. During this the phrase too little too late crops up, this is a BS phrase designed to test our resolve for the growth we’re making.

Don’t stop and don’t fixate on a few items, rather expand and within the bounds of your personal honor as a parent do a little running away yourself.

Perhaps the local troupe could use another cast member? Involve the children?

[workinghardguy]

Thanks guys... I know I sound fixated on the mental health aspect, and partially I may be. At the same time I realize three things:

First, even if mental health issues are part of the root cause it can take a very long time, if ever, to truly resolve those.

Second, any mental health issue is simply part of this mess, not the sum of it. I have my own issues. Those issues I am aware of and have been for some time. When my W listed her issues I already knew 90% of them. I had just chosen not to act.

Lastly, there is something fundamentally flawed in our R. That's how we got here. Even if her clinical depression went away tomorrow would that change our R? Yes and no. It might make it easier to work on our R, it may clear her mind and create space where things aren't constantly hopeless, but the fundamental issues would still be there. Until I change those things about me there isn't a chance the R can be restored.

As far as the trip... yes I just listened and validated. I know that it talks to more of her issue of being wild and crazy and letting go once in a while. I get it. Should our R ever be restored it may be a big thing we can't agree on or have to compromise on. I believe she goes out too much. She believes I don't go out enough. Somewhere between has to be a happy medium.

And not pushing the C has to be the hardest part for me right now. I'm so scared for her at times regarding suicide and self-harm. But I know pushing C will only make her flee. So I wait... I wait for her to talk about it or ask for help in accessing it.

Yesterday she asked me "how it works" and thankfully since I've been through the process of finding a C, getting a diagnosis so health insurance kicks in, etc.. I could answer that for her. I think it went well... that part of the convo ended with her joking that she'll probably walk away with three or four diagnosis I laughed... didn't agree or disagree, just laughed with her.

[JustStunned]

I do not wish to heighten your anxiety about this. For my own peace of mind I am posting this.

If you believe she is serious about harming herself please get in touch with someone. Perhaps the local suicide prevention hotline would be a starting point.

[rickb89]

Oh man, WHG and telemark. This is happening to me too. A WAW living under the same roof, and her having an EA with My Cousin who lives in another state. I want to kick his ass in the worse way but have our 3 sons to raise, so I have to take the high road.

Ultimately, I agree with you guys that seeing ti through with dignity is the way to go. My 3 sons see that I have not taken the weaker path and respect me for it.

[kml]

WEllbutrin raises dopamine levels. Some other drugs, like Parkinson's drugs, that raise dopamine levels, have been associated with compulsive behaviors (like gambling or sex addiction)in some sensitive patients.

[workinghardguy]

Hey Just... trust me I know... I keep watching closely and at the risk of breaking good DB practices I flat out ask her a few times a week about her mental state. It's better the last few weeks and better since the bomb, but still not great.

I've had long talks with my C about what I can do. Short of having direct knowledge of immediate ideations there's not a lot. If I think she's actually going to self-harm I can throw her in the car and take her to the ER or call the police. Outside of that I can support (though she doesn't want that from me), suggest, provide information, and check in. But that's about it.

But she's an RN. She knows exactly how to hide and deflect the symptoms and signs. Trust me, I'm scared most days out of my mind. It just adds a level to this whole tragedy that is even more painful. To be locked out but have to find a way in... it's damn hard.