I have been lurking here for almost 5 months since my world came crumbling down. I am a 38 year old medical professional (American) married to an Australian that I met 9 years ago who came over from Australia on a tennis scholarship. He finished a degree in material engineering and graduated in October 2002. We met on-line, had an instant connection, and married almost 18 months later. Our immediate goals were to live the "atypical life", to travel, invest in retirement property similar to his mother who travels about 6 months a year to exotic places, and to semi-retire in our 30's....
Fast forward to today...
During the course of our marriage, I have supported him financially. He never wanted to work a classic 9-5 job so he worked for a year or so at a dead end job in engineering-realized he hated it-and asked to quit so that he could play professional tennis for a year or two to make a go of it. I wholeheartedly supported him in this endeavor, taking call every other weekend. He is super athletic and disciplined, I love to do occasional sports and exercise, bur my weight and fitness level has been an issue for him since we married. However-I supported him and he went on the road for 2 years before taking a job as a Division 3 head coach in tennis.
Our main issues have been financial. I have had spending problems where it has come to our disposable income. I was generous buying things for my husband, my family, and myself. We (with my husband's support) traveled to Australia, Austria, France, and Italy. We went to Costa Rica when I was 5 months pregnant with my daughter, Casey.
We waited 6 years to have our first child. We bought a house 6 months later. I took a high powered job as a Medical Sciene Liaison for a pharmaceutical company. Together we made a huge salary and we have had multiple problems with discussing financial issues. He would question, I would get defensive, he would back down-and then....all would be well for a time.
I gave birth to my son last July. Starting in the fall, I noticed a change in my husband. He is 4 years younger than I am but is the most open and honest person alive. He started to play piano again and singing with a girl who was at the college he was coaching at. He insisted that nothing was going on. He joined Crossfit and began eating a paleolithic diet and became angry about my slowness to lose weight. In November, he began asking questions like "when was the last time we really talked" or "wouldn't you feel better sharing your life with someone who shared your religious beliefs..." etc. I became more and more scared that something was going on. He even began thinking about some of his first loves and "what may have happened". He became convinced that he had been molested as a child (was having some flashbacks I believe" so I just thought that he had a lot on his plate. I told him again that Iloved and supported him.
The Friday after Thanksgiving we had another series of talks. He had calculated that we should have so much much money available for our "retirmeent' property. I finally admitted to him that I have misspent money, used credit cards, etc. He disappeared for 7 hours (leaving me with the 4 month old baby),came back and informed me that "ILYBIANLW". I begged, pleaded, and cried. He blamed the money and then ripped me apart, telling me everything had been for me in this marriage and he had nothing. That he could have "taken or left it" as far as children.
I found a copy of Divorce Busting but he was too far gone. He only makes $19,000 a year but told me he felt trapped and "wanted to work on the marriage by moving out". He promised that it was the best help for our marriage and that he could move back in a couple of months if things improved.
He left me on 12/29/2010, when my son was 5 months old (and a daughter he adored 2.5 years old). He moved into an apartment down the road and has used $13000 (10,000 for start up costs and expenses not paid for by his college paycheck) as well as a 2000 advance from our income tax. As you can probably figure out-no marriage counseling (he is doing some personal counseling now), and it has been 6 months already.
I am almost ready to throw in the towel. I have done several no, nos-(asking about R, discussing the past, telling him I have changed) and he admits that I have made HUGE changes that he can see (I have lost 55 lbs since my son was born, great PMA, joined a soccer team, am flying to Zurich in two weeks) but said he can't forgive me for costing him 8 years of his life and where we could have been had I only been truthful about the money. I cut off the financial support (minus the car payment) back in February but he is now pressuring me to help him with " alittle support" by taking the kids during the day so I can work and not pay a babysitter.
I am tired. I have done every diaper change, 4 am bottle feedings, lost weight, exercised, and been the primary breadwinner. My job requires travel so I have had to become superwoman taking care of everything (baths, doctor visits, etc) and my husband looks like he has gotten off scott free. During my last conversation about our R (had to do it, he is reneweing the lease on the apartment and expects me to support him), he told me he wishes to be my friend and "biggest cheerleader" but can't be my husband right now and that he hopes that I don't go and get an attorney to make this ugly for the kids...
I need some serious help. Should I throw in the towel? I love this man but still can't believe he left me with babies to take care of. BTW-finacial issues no longer a problem, took Dave Ramsey class through church and doing well. Even though I am doing better, he is scared that the changes are not permanent and does not want to give me any more months/years of his life. He wants "personal happiness" and wants to find his voice, complaining that he could never tell me how he felt because of my low self esteem...
Help-is this a WAH or MLC? He wants help with his finances to live apart from us but has not helped with the kids financially...time to call an attorney or to hang in there?
Would love some help from anyone...
Shannon M: 8.5 years T: 10 years in July Children: 3 years old/10 months Fall 2010: weird behavior November 26, 2010: ILYBNILWY December 29, 2010: moved out Currently separted
I have officially gone dark and it is scary-pleasant but strictly child exchange only. I have called an attorney and have tentative plans to file for divorce in a couple of weeks. Do I want to file-NO! But I am so tired, the constant pressure to support him (indirect but if I hear that he has to go teach tennis lessons in order to eat any more, i will lose it!) and my kids are suffering. I am just so tired....I am at a business meeting here in Chicago and between the weight loss and the smile on my face, I have been hit on 3 times in one day. When H saw me early this morning to watch the kids before I headed to the airport, he tried to initiate conversation and actually "checked me out" (new size 8 jeans). I kept it pleasant but business like, letting him know where I would be. Otherwise no text/calls/etc. Could really use some advice....my company may be laying off soon and for financial reasons, I may have to make some decisions about my marriage....if I am severanced, he may have access to this money and it could make things pretty horrible if we do divorce. BTW-did I mention that I will be picking up a second job at a bone marrow transplant clinic to start saving up pro-actively (I work as a PA) beginning in July? It is so hard to handle this by myself and even though I have great friends, my family lives in Maine and his family is in Australia. ANy feedback?
I read your post in my thread and I know it's been a few days, but I didn't see it until today. I just wanted to give you a big e-hug. I know how hard it is to put everything down into a little text box and just how far things have to be deteriorated before you get to that point.
This is my advice. I am no expert, by far, so take it with a grain of salt.
I could harp all day on your H's issues - because there seem to be many. I just don't understand how anyone can expect to semi-retire in their 30's primarily on another person's salary. And I definitely don't understand how you could agree to that. Based on some of the things you wrote, it seems that your entire marriage was based around you working your tail off so that he could live the easy life. That is not a marriage, it is a business deal. And when you signed on for this, what was it about your own self-worth that made you think this was a good deal?
Therein lies the crux of the problem. You are an intelligent woman capable of raising two children, holding down a high-powered job, conquering your financial issues and losing 55 pounds yet you still feel that you need to financially support an able-bodied man who has left you and your children and is trying to coax you not to use an attorney in your divorce.
Is this a man that you want to be married to? And also - really - is this the woman that you want to be?
You have some fundamental questions that you need to answer for yourself before you can even make another step forward. It seems to me that you are in a save-the-marriage hurricane, but what you really need to do is be in a What Does Shannon Really Want Quest.
Who are you? What do you want from your marriage? How do you want to raise your children? Ten or twenty years from now can you look back on your actions and respect yourself and the decisions that you made?
The focus does not to be on your H and what he wants/does/feels. You really need to sort out that stuff yourself primarily. And I really feel that when you do that, when you've proven that not only are you financially rock-steady but also healthy, wealthy and wise - your H is going to want back on the train. And then, it's up to you whether or not you want to let him back in.
Me: 33, H: 32 M: 12 years T: 13 years No kids D-Day: 7/2009 Separated: 10/12/10 Future Unknown GITS
"There's a fire starting in my heart, reaching a fever pitch and it's bringing me out the dark." - Adele
I want to make sure I am understanding you correctly. Your H wants you to pay him for "babysitting" his own children? If that's the case it's pure BS. Those are his children also, he does not deserve to be paid. Does he pay you for having them all the other times? I bet not.
TG brought up some interesting points. What is it that you want? Are you happy staying in a M where you are doing 90% of the household work? I know sometimes life isn't fair, but this is really unfair.
"Everyone you meet has baggage. Find someone who loves you enough to help you unpack." ¤Formerly DelinquentGurl¤
wow, do I already love the two of you (delinquent girl and thatgirl007). It did not start off this way-he did work and seemed excited about it but decided to make a go of tennis. We made arrangements (including who stayed home when we decided to have kids)based on the person with the most earning potential. If we (meaning me-per my husband) had truly valued our goal of investing in real estate property and traveling the world, I would have stuck to the budget we proposed. So yes-in a way, I worked hard and gave him everything because it was hard to believe that this amazing man, great accent, had chosen to give me his love. And he has loved and supported me emphatically for the first five years. Now, looking back, things started to change after we had children. I never realized it, but he compromised to have our kids and really resented it. I think he felt (even as other things like lack of sex, my travel schedule, etc) that he had settled on other things, since we were on the same page to live frugally and invest, it would pay off. I just never realized that he felt that he was "settling".
And now-I have to echo some of the things you have both mentioned. His mother truly lives this way, has retirment property in Australia that she rents out and she literally does not work anymore, just travels 6 months a year. She got into the Australian real estate at just the right time but now my H has it in his head that he gave up all of his real hopes and dreams and settled down to be with me-and I ain't it worth.
I have to tell you-this time in Chicago has been amazing and very powerful. I am surrounded by smart, educated professonals who have been my friends and colleagues for many years and they think I look amazing and they truly value me for me. I once said this to G-"it is amazing that when I leave this house, I am constantly told that I am beautiful, smart, and articulate, excellent at my job and then when I enter my home....I can't handle my daughter right, I am not applying myself to weight loss, etc. I think the finances was just an excuse...I think he would have left anyone, not because I AM NOT GOOD ENOUGH BUT BECAUSE HE HAS LOW SELF ESTEEM. I am starting to detach in a huge way and I don't want this arrangement anymore. I want someone who loves and values me for me. So I have to say that I am not sure that I want to be in this type if M anymore. He used to love me so much, now he just seems to be filled with resentment and bitterness. DO I REALLY WANT THIS? Should I give myself the chance to fall in love again with someone who truly values what I bring to the table and does not feel that he is settling?
I want to save my marriage but I am getting my gumption and my confidence level back. I am planning to file for divorce in two weeks and no, I don't plan to provide my H with support. He was funny-he never came out and asked for money but said quietly that he was working hard giving extra tennis lessons and teaching at the college so that he would only have to ask me for a "little bit of support". What am I, a bank? My family has agreed to come down for two and a half weeks to take care of me and when I told H this, he got very quiet and wanted to know "why they were coming".....
So-plan now is to really look inside of myself and think about the new R that I want, whether it is with H or not. I echo you thatgirl007-I look great now for me, NOT FOR MY H. And it feels wonderful!
BTW-did I mention that I am not a beachbody coach????
thanks again for all of your love and support! SLH
Yep, that's the attitude. Now, I can't say when/if filing for D is the right step. That has to be a decision that you come to. I think that defining what you want out of R, better yet a M, is the best thing you can do for yourself. Whether you get that from your H or not, at least you have a baseline reference point for what it is that you want from a R.
I do want to point out not to go into fantasy-land yourself, the way that your H has. Know that there is no "perfect" relationship. There is no knight-in-shining-armor who is going to make you happy and perfect your life. It's not unreasonable to want love, acceptance and respect from a R, though, and I think many of us have been so wrapped up in our spouses that we haven't felt the self-worth to want those things.
Still, you have to make yourself happy. You have to get content all by yourself regardless of what is going on around you. You have to become your own rock. And what a feeling it is, Shannon, when you get content in your own skin - flaws and all! It's the bee's knees and at times, I actually am grateful for going through all of this because of the woman I am becoming.
Keep it moving, girly, and keep us posted!
Me: 33, H: 32 M: 12 years T: 13 years No kids D-Day: 7/2009 Separated: 10/12/10 Future Unknown GITS
"There's a fire starting in my heart, reaching a fever pitch and it's bringing me out the dark." - Adele
I agree with you. I need to enjoy the person that I am becoming right now and I have to admit that it has been much easier to detach from him and his problems since I have such a great network of friends and family, as well as the fact that my job requires travel-I have to get out and be social, for my customers as well as for myself. I just postponed my trip to Zurich (which was scheduled for June 9th) to later this summer because of a nagging feeling in my stomach about the fact that my H will have the kids for 8 days in the house and that he could access papers/bank accounts/etc. That was not the only reason (my company is going through some big changes and we will hear about layoffs and severances shortly) but I sent H a short and quick email that my plans had changed, the trip was postponed, and he could make his plans accordingly.
TG-he freaked. He called me three or four times (he has not called me at all in the evenings, and sent a text message and email). He wanted to know what would prompt me to cancel a trip 4 days beforehand. I told him I was in mixed company (via text and 3 hours later) but that we could speak in the morning.
I calmly explained my decision to postpone my trip-he seemeed relieved that it wasn't something more significant than that. Wow-did he get nervous that I was about to do something significant?
My friend Nicole (the girlfriend in Zurich) gave me some great advise today-why don't I deal with one construction site at a time? Deal with my job and me first (combined) and once this construction site is stable, deal with my M once I have a better idea of my situation and what I want to do and make this R. And let him deal with the consequences of his decisions.
Shannon - I can't wait until you get you instant access posting privileges. I hate being two days behind you
I think your friend in Zurich is right. You can't be constructing a solid M when you haven't got yourself sorted out. Take some time to figure yourself out. There is no rush. You've got your kids. You have your friends and family. You have your work. There is a lot on your plate. Maybe H will fit in the picture and maybe he won't, but it's really out of your control right now.
I am well, thank you for asking, sweetie! This weeks seems to be creeping by. I am really looking forward to the weekend. I have no set plans - but that, in itself, can be an adventure. I like having the clean slate of a whole day with no plans to fill up as I see fit. It's a rare treat that I am planning to enjoy!
Me: 33, H: 32 M: 12 years T: 13 years No kids D-Day: 7/2009 Separated: 10/12/10 Future Unknown GITS
"There's a fire starting in my heart, reaching a fever pitch and it's bringing me out the dark." - Adele
Shannon, I just wanted to stop by your thread and offer support because you were kind enough to offer amazing support to me.
I just want to say, I can't imagine being the powerful woman you are. You have EVERYTHING going for you if you could only see it. You also deserve to be loved and respected in your marriage. To me, it seems like your husband has not lived up to that in the recent past. That doesn't mean that your marriage isn't worth working to save - only you can determine that - but a marriage is a *partnership* and your husband certainly isn't living up to the 50/50 ideal of a good partnership. He's also really not being a 100% father either (to put it mildly). Also, I believe that there are some boundaries that a spouse doesn't cross: harassing comments about weight and/or appearance is one of those boundaries.
In terms of earnings and power-distribution, all relationships are different. Mine was kind of the reverse of yours: my partner was high-earning/high-achieving/high-profile, while I was always supporting and clapping backstage. I didn't earn a lot of money, but my partner never cleaned a toilet, had a 'little woman' to bake every birthday cake for his office subordinates, and knew he was adored, cherished, and practically worshiped by me. Unlike your husband, I encouraged my partner treat himself to anything he wanted (he worked hard and I figured it was first and foremost *his* money) and when he moved out, I realized that my clothes - though mostly coming from the thrift store - comprised only about 10% of the clothes in our closet. It was kind of a wake-up for me: I was like a poor little match girl living with a man who had everything he could ever want - I never thought I deserved anything so I never asked for it and now he has left me with nothing.
I didn't mean to go on and on about myself, but I just wanted you to realize that I'm not condemning your husband for not earning much money - every family finds its own balance and not every person has equal earning potential. HOWEVER, what I am trying to point out is that your husband (while accusing you of flagrant spending) actually doesn't seem to understand the value of money himself. If he has already spent $13,000 of the family's savings and now expects you to play 'sugar mama' and bankroll his continued absenteeism from his family obligations...well that I just CAN'T understand. If the genders were reversed, I still would not be able to understand it.
Speaking of sugar mamas, your husband seems to be determined to compare you to his own perfect, entrepreneurial mother. A woman can never win when a man idealizes his own mother to great extent, and I believe that this is a sign of immaturity. Didn't mean to go all Freudian, but its just an observation. Does he want a wife or a replica of his mother?
Me: 35 Him: 43 Together: 19 1/2 years 1st Bomb (IDLYAM): March 2011 2nd Bomb (OW): April 2011 He abandons home/bills/everything: May 2011 He's bought a new house for OW: September 2011
I canceled my Zurich trip. Part of it was the situation with my company right now so it has been postponed for a few weeks. However, I am preferring that family be around to take some of the burden (and worry on my part) of the 8 day trip off of my H. He will be in the house for 8 days and now that I have set clear boundaries regarding financial support-I don't think he is capable of it but sometimes people do things that they don't think all the way through. I am planning to go in July or August so I am quite excited about that. The situation has improved somewhat in that we have pleasant conversation when we do child exchange, ask about days,plans, tennis lessons etc but no pro-active requests for spending time together have been initated by my H. He looks a lot, seems reluctant to leave but manages to do it. He called twice last night which I ignored....(a 180 for me since I used to jump all over his calls and hope to have meaningful conversation-I am usually disappointed!) but he finally text messaged to ask for a favor to come late today to pick up the kids so he could give a tennis lesson at 6:30 am this morning. Since this is now his sole means of support, I worked with him via text message to arrange this. I kept it business like and did not respond to his last text message.
If this sounds harsh or cold, it really isn't. I am in full LRT since pouring out again to him two weeks ago that was still in love with him, that I had changed, and that the old wife he knew and person was gone. It was a hard and cold conversation on his part, that again he saw all of the changes but would not sleep on the couch and move home hoping these changes would truly stick. Since than I have been pleasant but business like and working very hard to detach. Is having him back a need? No. It is a preference and I am so blessed to have my family/friends/children and of course God that I can live my life well without him. Especially since I know what part I played in this and how I wish to move forward treating him (and others) very very differently. My priorities have changed.
With that being said, I don't see that he has made a lot of changes in that he has not accepted the reality of the situation that we are not (his choice) moving forward as partners so we are not going to pool our money together to support two households. He keeps giving tennis lessons, he is a coach and will restart in the fall, but still feels that I need him to do my job and that I will support him to keep the status quo. Did he say this? No. But yesterday something happened. I agreed to pay his car payment until his lease ran out (I agreed to do this when he first moved out hoping to sway him by helping him financially-wrong thing to do of course!) which means making June and July's payment. It is a $450.00 car payment, it is almost paid off, and it is a shame-Rav4, low mileage-great vehicle. I warned him in April that he would need to sell the car or make arrangements to resume payments. He has never had to make a car payment in all of the years that we have been together; well, when I was out of town I was not paying attention while doing bills and accidentally authorized HIS ACCOUNT and not mine for the draft to come out of. You should have seen his text message-I felt sorry for him. He absoultely panicked. I very nicely assured him that it was not intentional and that it would be addressed. But the reality is that this will really happen in the next few weeks and I am tired of trying to make him see reality. Now that I am on the Dave Ramsey plan, I have to begin taking care of me and the kids, not his bills.
Georgia does not recognize legal separation. At this point, filing for divorce may be my only protection. Do I want this? No. But I don't see the situation changing, I am paying for everything (house, kids, babysitters, medical, etc) and although he watches the kids during the day, he is still expecting that I will support him. Any additional advice? I am considering drawing up the initial paperwork since it will take some time to file and-well-he needs to step up. I don't care so much about the bills and kids but I don't want to support him since HE left me, not the other way around. Any advice???
