Not sure where to start, or end. WAW?

[john28]

I'll be honest, it's not a deal breaker for me. I believe she is sincere in not contacting this person. I have made another mistake about asking for something when I didn't really NEED it to prevent a deal breaker.

I just feel like I rocked the boat more now, and that she really is giving up the OM - I just solidfied my insecurity and self-pity by asking for transparency when I didn't really NEED it to continue this M.

The thing is, I believe she is sincere in working on the M, but all she can commit to right now is not leaving -today-. That's her committment. To see what happens today, and not leave. That's how she's trying. I think that with enough time of her staying and not leaving, then we can begin to work on the other issues like resentment, infidelity, trust, control, everything. I feel like it might be too early to make demands when she doesn't even WANT to be in the house, and is just staying because she wants to try to see what happens.

Do you think that is a good strategy?

[wanttobebetter]

She said that she doesn't want to feel like I'm her father checking up on her all the time, and doesn't want to live in a relationship like that.

A: "I understand. I wouldn't want to either. Unfortunately, since you are the one who has had multiple affairs, I have decided that this is something that I need in order to protect myself, and know that you're sincere in trying to work on our marriage, without the influence of a third person. If you don't want to, I'll have no other choice than to assume you either ARE still carrying on with someone, or, you at least want to keep the door open so that you CAN. Either way, I'll have my answer."

And then I'd give her 5 minutes to decide, without letting her out of my sight.

Tough stuff, I know. Serial infidelity always is.

Puppy

[/quote]

This is the most important advice you have been given and you have to settle this issue before you can worry or move onto another.

We all know you love your wife and you want it to work...we get it. But there are serious issues here that should have been addressed years ago...

[eeyore_no_more]

Just so I'm clear, you're okay with your W having the opportunity to carry on an EA in your house, around your son, while you have no way to verify or know where you really stand in your M? You're okay with her putting up walls of secrecy between you, while leaving the door open to cheat on you AGAIN?

BTW, she was nice to you because you caved. You told her what you need, she said you were controlling and acting like her father, and you backed down. She gets to carry on without worrying about you finding anything, and you get to feel good for the rest of the day until tomorrow, when she tells you that "nothing's changed".

Sorry to be blunt, but most of us here have ridden this train before, and know where all the stops are...

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I just feel like I rocked the boat more now, and that she really is giving up the OM - I just solidfied my insecurity and self-pity by asking for transparency when I didn't really NEED it to continue this M.

OK, then I guess I can't help you, Suma. Why you would NOT need transparency, after multiple offenses, says as much about you as it does about her. In any event, I feel like I'm just beating you up, which I don't really want to do, so I'll just wish you good luck.

Puppy

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Just so I'm clear, you're okay with your W having the opportunity to carry on an EA in your house, around your son, while you have no way to verify or know where you really stand in your M? You're okay with her putting up walls of secrecy between you, while leaving the door open to cheat on you AGAIN?

BTW, she was nice to you because you caved. You told her what you need, she said you were controlling and acting like her father, and you backed down. She gets to carry on without worrying about you finding anything, and you get to feel good for the rest of the day until tomorrow, when she tells you that "nothing's changed".

Sorry to be blunt, but most of us here have ridden this train before, and know where all the stops are...

Sorry for the hijack, Suma:

Eeeyore, you're really VERY good at this! I know sometimes we are much better at giving advice to others than we are to ourselves (I know I certainly am!!), but I hope you'll strongly consider helping out on other people's threads more often.

You know me well enough to know I'm not a real "blow-smoke-up-your-butt" kinda guy. Really, some of your latest posts are DAMNED good.

Puppy

[john28]

OK, then I guess I can't help you, Suma. Why you would NOT need transparency, after multiple offenses, says as much about you as it does about her. In any event, I feel like I'm just beating you up, which I don't really want to do, so I'll just wish you good luck.

Puppy

I'm truly valuing your advice, and I don't feel like you're beating me up at all. I really value your input, so don't stop I feel like I have enough transparency right now - I have her email and history of her computer. That's transparency for me in my mind.

For curiousity, what would that say about me (honestly) if I didn't want transparency after multiple offenses? I'm a big boy

[sandi2]

I'm just getting so many mixed signals.

The signals are very plain and simple to me. But you are blind and hard of hearing.

This young girl is seeking emotional fulfillment that you have not given her. She "knows" how she should feel toward you, as when she gave the correct answer of, "I love and respect you", but she doesn't feel the "in-love" emotions she craves.

She's not happy, doesn't want to be with you, broke off EA, agreed to go to MC, and she's agreed to stay in the M. She is showing very positive signs, considering she's a WAW in heart. But the biggest problem that I see is the fact none of this is good enough for you.

If you were my son I would probably grab you by the ear and pull you down into a chair and hear me lecture you for at least an hour, but since you aren't.....I'll go easy on ya.

First, stop expecting something from her. Put on your big boy britches and make up your mind to be a strong, confident, sexy man who does not need physical affection to give you self-worth.

We women can read our H's soooo well. She knows why you linger for hugs & kisses. I'll tell you a little secret....it turns her off, so you need to stop doing that. Those things you say to her....thinking she will give you affection....goes against the grain and hurts your R.

These lingering looks and the things you say about hugs & kisses make you appear clingy, needy, and a weak male.

You are expecting more than she can deliver at the moment. You think since OM has been dropped that she should snap back into the W she used to be. But she can't do that before going through "withdrawals" from OM. If the A is truly over, then I think she's doing exceptionally well.

You want to see her putting forth effort but you don't understand that her staying there with you is her effort. That alone is tremendous work for her.

You need to back off and stop expecting affection. You let her go to you willingly. Otherwise it is pressure. She reads you like a book....and she knows what you want to hear and what you want her to do physically. Don't ruin the chances for a complete reconciliation by putting this pressure on her.

It will take time for her sexual attraction for you to warm up. It will take a lot of patient on your part.

BTW, don't do anymore of those temperture checks!!! You are a long, long way from even getting close to doing that.

[john28]

Sandi - thank you. Brilliant. That's what I needed to hear - the truth. I feel confident in everything you just said. I've said it to myself before "This is her way of trying. Don't expect anything", yet inside my heart I crave that attention and love NOW. This is my failure.

This is brilliant. Thank you. Time to stand up, be strong, stop expecting, act As If.

From what I gather from you your advice is, and correct me if I'm wrong:
- Stop initiating physical affection
- Stop saying ILY
- If she does offer affection or an ILY, then say give it back to her, say thank you, and don't expect it again?

Right?

[PMA_Baby!]

Whatever it took to GET IT. I'm glad u did

Now walk the walk.

PMA

[eeyore_no_more]

Hang on a sec. I have this dead horse I need to beat for a sec, then I'll move on...

Other than her word, how do you know the EA is over? Your game plan is MUCH different if she's currently having an affair.

I haven't seen anything so far in this thread that says she's remorseful about the EA, just that she's sorry you got hurt by finding out.

If you have intel showing you it's over, then absolutely, put your Big Boy Pants™ on and give her the space she needs to get over him and work on her feelings for you, without any R talks or pressure for affection.

If you're just going by her word that she'll be EXTRA GOOD this time (pinky swear!), she's just stalling until she figures out Plan B.