If you do the math you could even put that in the email to show him how much money he's costing his kids each month playing his lone wolf games.
I think right now you need to just get yourself in better financial position so you aren't at all dependent on him or your in laws. As well as building confidence and educating yourself about how to build a better marriage and how to avoid being bullied or manipulated... EVERYONE including myself needs to learn the last two... many of us deal with that during infidelity... we put up with WAY MORE than we should
I have figured that H is spending about $500-$600 extra a month by living out of the house and in his own apartment. This includes his half of the cost of the rent at the apartment that he shares with a guy that he grew up with. I just have to figure out how to phrase this in the e-mail that I am going to send.
I have begun the process of getting my financial health back in order. Does anyone know of any books or websites that I could read or visit concerning avoiding and dealing with manipulative behavior? Some marriage websites and marriage building resources recommendations would be appreciated also. I started calling marriage and family therapists this morning and I talked to one who sounded promising but my insurance does not cover any type of counseling so I have to wait until I get a job in order to afford his fees.
I did call the legal aid office starting at 9am and I was one of the lucky ones to have my call answered by the receptionist but the advocate who deals with family issues was not in today. Figures. I will start calling again on Monday and hopefully I am one of the first three callers again. They only see people by appointment.
H texted me to inquire about the taxes that we owe and I told him the amount. He was probably discouraged to find out the bill amount but he still managed to make a joke about it. I responded to his questions and once he found out what he wanted to know, that was it from him. His texts only pertain to business matters then he goes silent again. I am beginning to see what 4Luv is talking about when she said her H uses manipulation and control to avoid what is really going on.
Should I finalize that e-mail that I typed up and send it to him immediately since I have no idea when I will be able to talk to legal aid? I really want to let H know how I feel. Should I wait until I talk to legal aid or until the 1 year anniversary of him moving away which will be on May 1st?
Me:34 H:34 D:7 D:6 D:3 T:20years M:10years Bomb: Feburary 2009 Separated: May 2009 EA confirmed March 2010
There is no hurry on the e-mail. I would hold off until you get legal counsel. The email isn't the only work that needs done, you need to work on yourself so you can make healthy choices for yourself and your kids. Its NOT easy to say no to a spouse whom you miss and is hurting you.. its believe it or not VERY HARD to DO... but you need to get your emotional and physical health in a place where you can do that.
I think 4luv was doing some research on avoiding manipulation.
My number one point about avoiding manipulation is avoid talking in real time... use email so you have time to process what's being said and think of a response. If you have a live conversation you don't have time to do any of that.
That's just one tactic.
And ya, 500 bucks a month is a lot.. that's six THOUSAND bucks a YEAR... And this is only the expenses you KNOW about.. he is very likely using up a LOT MORE you don't know about.
I know it hurts to see those numbers, but that's the reality of what he's doing. Puppy Dog Tails talks at length about the financial damage infidelity and waywardness does to a home. It's not just emotional damage, it can bring financial ruin into your family too.
I know you want to let H know how you feel, but this is about strategy, not you feeling better short term. I don't think it is good for YOU to send it without legal counsel first. I think it will lead YOU to feel WORSE later on if your husband gets difficult from the email. I think its best for YOU to find out all your legal options. Once you have a FT and can talk in person with someone you will find that helpful too.
You are protecting your children and yourself, that's more important than the rush you will get from sending out one email. Knowing your family is being protected as best they can be.. .that's the goal here isn't it?
Allen is right ALJ...I am still trying to get better emotionally in order to be able to deal with husband. I recommend you do an internet search on "dealing with manipulation" or "manipulation in relationships". There are alot of good articles (I will try to paste them to your thread later) and I believe that in my case as well as yours we REALLY want our marriages to work but we all have to be very careful to not be manipulated back into something. I was just manipulated with some sweet words on getting back together with husband and after I talked to people on this board and IRL I saw husband's words for what they were...JUST WORDS and a way to control the situation.
I also think you need to open up your own account if you have not already. I did this early on in my stitch but I JUST (last week) sent in the paperwork to get my paycheck automatically deposited into my own separate account. I haven't told husband yet and I can almost guarantee that my actions will make him upset. But you HAVE to protect yourself and your children.
Me: 28 H: 32 1st marriage 4 both 1 1/2 year married 2gether for 9 1S: 6months 1stepson: 2yo
You are right Allen and 4luv. I just wanted to send that e-mail so that I could give H a piece of my mind in the process. I somehow thought that the e-mail would wake H up and make him think about what he is doing to us. However, it is going to take more than that for H to come to his senses.
I am hurting and missing him but not his actions right now. Sometimes, I even feel like I hate him. Right now, I cannot see myself with someone else and even if it did not work out with H, it would take me a long time to heal from the devastation of a walkaway H and infidelity, not to mention the trust issues that I now have.
I do have my own account along with our joint account at our bank but I might close it when I get a job because H can see what I have in it if he goes online to look at the joint account. 4Luv, thanks for the references.
Me:34 H:34 D:7 D:6 D:3 T:20years M:10years Bomb: Feburary 2009 Separated: May 2009 EA confirmed March 2010
H called today to talk to the kids and we somehow got on us and our problems. H has conveyed to me that basically that our marriage is over. He stands by his alibi that his mind has been "gone" for years and I should face the fact that he has moved on. He thinks that our separation is a license for him to be with OW and if he could have, he would have signed separation papers before he walked out our door to move away but didn't have the money to file. I disagree, H has had plenty of money to file if he wanted, instead, he needed that money to fund his getaway. He flat out refused to go to counseling because he does not need anyone to tell him what our problems are or were, we already know and no one can force him to feel love for me.
I don't know why I tried to reason with him, it is no use. He goes on to say that he tried to tell me and talk to me about us not spending any time together and me putting everyone before him but I did not listen and we would have been having the same problems to this day so he had to leave. He couldn't take it anymore and now I want to all of a sudden work on our marriage. I guess he thinks that I am bitter. He says the problems were both our fault but it sounded like he was mostly blaming me. I asked him why he chose to get involved with OW, after all, we are still married and he replied "what am I supposed to do, be alone forever?" I said something to him about me raising the kids by myself and he replied that "that is not true because they can come spend the summers with me but meanwhile, at least they will see me whenever I can get up here as opposed to not seeing me at all." From the sounds of it, his mind is made up.
Surprisingly, I am not sad from this conversation. I steeled myself through the whole thing. Not to say that I won't feel hurt about it later on tonight. I just have to face reality. Maybe my marriage won't be saved but I am not giving up. I do love him and unfortunately for him, he does not love me.
Me:34 H:34 D:7 D:6 D:3 T:20years M:10years Bomb: Feburary 2009 Separated: May 2009 EA confirmed March 2010
ALJ, I will warn you of this even though you have likely heard it before.
1. Do NOT argue with your spouse when they are wayward, this just STRENGTHENS their resolve.
When you push them, they argue and they HEAR themselves SAY
"I am done" "Our marriage is over" "I am in love"
etc
When YOU ARGUE and THEY counter with the usual stuff above (its classic script we have all heard it) you ALLOW them to CONVINCE THEMSELVES...
Each time they HEAR that they get MORE and MORE sure of themselves... have you ever heard the concept about VERBALIZING your goals to strengthen yourself? Say it so you HEAR it and then you FEEL it?
That's exactly what you do when you argue with a wayward, you HELP THEM FEEL BETTER about AVOIDING YOU. Why would you feel that strategy of theirs? You are just doing a LOT of DAMAGE to your MARRIAGE.
you make YOUR JOB much HARDER when you argue.. so STOP that right away!
2. Do NOT PURSUE your SPOUSE... it just scares them off.. and arguing IS PURSUIT
3. IGNORE what your spouse tells you. I am done, we are over, our marriage is over, I want a divorce, we have ALL HEARD this stuff, its classic script... pay it NO HEED.. this advice is RIGHT out of MWD DIVORCE REMEDY BOOK
4. Protect yourself instead of arguing with HIM... chasing him is NOT going to help YOU, it just makes YOU feel miserable and HIM feel REALLY GOOD about how desirable a man he is.. you just feed his EGO at the COST of YOUR SELF ESTEEM...
5. Stop talking to him... just shut him out. Next time he calls, don't answer, get him to chase YOU for a while ok? You sit at home and wait for him to call like a pining child and he can decide to call you when HE wants to allow you to bask in the glory of HIS presence.. its nonsense... ignore his calls... when he asks where you were, tell him you were out with friends...
6. Read Divorce Remedy again.. particularly the LAST RESORT TEchnique. Few people on here mention this, but in DR in the infidelity section MWD tells people to head to Last Resort Technique right away... its right in the book.. and you are NOT doing that, you are pursuing him rather than strengthening yourself.. you are GOING to make YOURSELF very ILL with that approach, trust me I've been there...
Sigh. You are right Allen, I should have known better. Why would I think that me arguing my point to him would do any good? What's really weird is that I am not the arguing type. I guess I started to feel hopeless about our situation and was trying to make him see my point of view. Instead, he made me look like I was crazy and told me I didn't know what I was talking about, especially when I started talking about emotional affairs.
H is not going to ask me where I have been or inquire about anything about me, even if he doesn't hear from me in a while but that is not important. Of course, the aruging did not solve a thing, it just reinforced all the points that you made above. I will not do that again and I have to get my DR book out and go over the LRT. I have forgotten some important information concerning how to put it into action since I have not read it in a while.
I have started walking 5 or more miles a day and have started volunteering at the hospital again. Summer is almost here and I really want to enjoy it because it goes by so fast. Detachment is not an easy thing for me but I do not want to be ill because of what H is doing.
Me:34 H:34 D:7 D:6 D:3 T:20years M:10years Bomb: Feburary 2009 Separated: May 2009 EA confirmed March 2010
It's not me really who's right.. I am just telling you what's in MWD's book.. nothing out of the ordinary there...
Your actions are classic pursuit - it won't work, it actually drives him away.
But my fear is that it feeds his ego and DRAINS YOURS
If you want your husband to PURSUE YOU then YOU need to show him you don't care anymore.
Ever heard of the game "hot and cold?"
MWD doesn't use that descriptive, but its more or less the same thing as her strategy...
You need to shut this guy out completely... if you can keep him away from his kids until he gets his bullying under control that's even better. I don't think you want your kids bullying you when they get older.. and if they see or hear their father doin it, they will learn that and do it too.
