What takes so long for us to GET is that it really doesn't matter how you feel about your wife, what she's done, and how what she's done reflects on you as a man.
Sorry.
You don't control her actions. You can try any "strategy" you want. You can be mean, you can be nice. You can smother her or you can shun her.
In my opinion, this is about HER making her own decisions and removing you as far as possible from her decision making process.
You push and you'll find out just how much this is about her and NOT you.
Here's the hard part Eric...
You have a decision to make. That decision is a question of how far you are willing to go for the (possibly slim) chance that you get your wife back one day.
Are you willing to live your own life for weeks, months, maybe even a few years while she figures out what is going on inside of her? There are no time guidelines on this stuff. If she doesn't choose to divorce you, can you accept that she's got some significant crap going on inside of her and it's that crap that has sent her packing?
See, that's why we tell you early to make this about YOU. That's why we tell you to take advantage of the fact that she wants nothing to do with you. That's why we tell you to look at this as a mid-life correction for YOU.
This [censored] is tough. Make no bones...and it's not for everyone.
And Eric? You are guaranteed nothing. She may see the light one day, and she may never see the light.
You will recall that my marriage ended in divorce...not all of us win the battle for the marriage.
Know what though? I'm pretty damned happy with my life these days.
That's what we want for you.
Blessings,
bill
"Don't tell me the sky is the limit when there are footprints on the moon."
All I just became a fan on the Alt. I am going to try and look folks up.
"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter". "Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!" "Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
I am curious if there is a difference between the terms chicano, latino and hispanic.
Also, I was at my nephews birthday party in their town with a predominate Mexican and Russian population. A non-hispanic school teacher scolded my sister in law (who is Russian) for mentioning someone she does business with as Mexican. This teacher said it was very offensive to call someone mexican and that the proper term was hispanic. I was stunned, but my sister in law and her sisters took it in stride and joked that they dont want to be called russian's anymore and would prefer something like "crazy nadia's". I dont get some of this PC crap.
If you confirm that your W is having an A with her boss, do you think it is fair to the OM's wife to keep it quiet?
One of biggest things an A thrives on is the secrecy. Exposing it can shorten the term of the A considerably. I know that it worked in the case for Puppy Dog Tails who helps out newcomers. Of course if you expose your W's A, she will be majorly pissed, but do you want to live in fear?
Even without confirming, it seems you are living in fear which is somewhat understandable since the bomb was only back in Sept. Take your time in making any decisions and try to run them by here before you do. Use the 48 hour rule when you decide on something because after 2 days your feelings may change.
Kerry, Latino is a broad term that encompasses many striations of our culture...we could be: Cuban, Puerto Rican, Mexican, Colombian, Venezuelan, Spanish, etc...you get the point.
There are many subtle and not-so-subtle differences between each of our respective cultures...I believe that there is a difference between the terms Chicano, Latino and Hispanic...I suppose I would most identify with the term Chicano which really derives from the word Xicano...which, in turn derives from the term, Mexica (pronounced "Meshica")from some of the indigenous Indians that lived in Mexico (which is where Mexico got its name eventually).
Personally I am okay with the term Mexican....but I live in South Texas and so there are a lot of down here...However, I would not want to be called Cuban or Puerto Rican...or anything else if that is not my heritage...YES, we are all Hispanic....but to call a Cuban a Mexican and vice versa is faux pas.
Stick with Hispanic----personally, Hispanic refers to a heritage whereas the term "Latino" implies any 'Latin', i.e. Romance based, language so you would have to throw in the Italian, French and Portuguese. Not so sure they would want to be considered "Latino"....
Jinkies! Bet you didn't think you would get this answer!
Okay enough! I'll step off the soapbox...
xox Vali
Aug '06: H moved out July '08: H had a kid with the OW May 12 '09: emancipation day
"Life moves pretty fast. You don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it." -Ferris Bueller
Thanks for clearing that up Vali. But, you now have raised another term I want to research - Romance based laungage.
Jack, it is great to have differing opinions. I suspect you may have had similar disagreements with Puppy in the past but I dont usually follow debates too much (except for the LostPhil debates ).
Eric, I am not saying that you should snoop further or try to expose an affair. Every situation is unique and has some grey area to it. For instance, it is difficult to define whether ones spouse is MLC, WAS or simply temporarily in a fuzzy zone from being sucked into an A. Or the betrayed spouse may have different levels of tolerance towards an affair based upon their personal values, culture or up bringing.
I was just wanting to let you know that there are times when exposing an affair is the right thing to do and can be done without being vindictive. Here is a really good article (which quotes Michele Weiner-Davis) that discusses the exposing of an affair...
If you ever do decide to expose, I can tell you, from my own experience, to be cautious about letting friends and family know. It is better to confront personally so as to remove the luster of secrecy and then back off. My exposing was a huge disaster for a short period of time, but it also did not cause my divorce - she did something much worse which crossed my line and I filed. When I exposed my W's affair to her brother/mother, my stupid intention was that they could talk sense to her better than I could because of culture/language differences (my XW is Thai). I also did this before I could get any advice from these forums.
Finally, it is so easy for those of us not in your shoes to be arm chair quarterbacks. Some, like myself, are not feeling the intense painful emotions related to matters of the heart you are going through. But, keep in mind that we also can see things in a different light than those caught up in the situation. There is a big picture that will take time for you to see. And for the time being, the best thing you can be doing is learning to DETACH better, losing fear, being consistent in your words and actions, GAL and focusing on the kids.
Your W said September for when she wants to file. That is a long time from now, but even more, it is tough for an MLC/WAW to really pull the trigger and file for a D. Many times they will try to get you to go along in agreement. Because of that, you should lose the fear because I doubt that a D is imminent.
BTW... I dont think your W is MLC from reading your situation. I would classify her more as a walk away wife - you said you were controlling and maybe you were not listening to her well. Maybe she felt that she did all she could to get through to you and she reached her point where the marriage is over out of frustration in her mind. These are things you can address as something to change and she will only see them through consisten actions - not from you pointing the changes out.
Kerry - thank you for your response. Yes I do believe that my wife is a WAS but also has some signs of MLC. She was very niave growing up and quite frankly I can honestly say that I took advantage of this. I have tried to be consistent but quite frankly she has as well. She has consistent done what she said she was going to do. She has not file and she is the one who has detached. I do believe that she feels that she need to live alone (she has never done this) in order to prove to herself and I guess in some one to me that she can make it. However, she is scared and fustrated since in order for her to make it she has to "hurt" me. I also know that I came across for the first 4 months as a needy, dependant individual. The reality though the more I think about this is that we do not have as much in common. Over the years I have changed and so has she and we seem to have lost the connection. you add to that her need to "find herself", the mounting debt that we have and you end up with a reciept for disaster. I believe the first EA began right before the bomb. One story that I have not mentioned to folks is that about a month before the bomb she wanted to be intamate and I turned her away. So I believe she feels rejected as a women. She is not the type to go the therapy and I believe still has codependancy issues, which is why she is reaching out to get her emotional needs met. I provide the finacial need and the security of her knowing that I would be here for her. What I am torn with is should I leave the house and just file. In a way I feel that that is what she needs to have some degree of closure and find her way. But this is not what I want but I'm not sure I can sit back and watch her fall in love with someone else. She is usually very nice to me and do believe that she is trying to make the best of this situation, with the exception of going to therapy. She has made a decision and for the first time in her life (and trust me when I say the first time) she is going to stick to it even if she is wrong. She was a very, very giving and sweet person who feels that I and everyone else has taken advantage of her. I did not help by alway being critical. I can now say it was my own insecurities that caused this. I guess I struggle with thinking that no matter what I do that this marriage can make it. I spent several year focusing on my needs and enjoying myself while she was the good wife at home. So my GAL needs to be somewhat tempered in that I cannot start going out and really hanging out otherwise I send the wrong message. In terms of consistent this is why I kept up with making her breakfast. Anything I do now that is not consistent would be view as just that - see he could not keep it up. At least that is my opinion. Exposing the A may or may not work. If I expose it she will know that I looked up the person info which comes accross as manipulative, which I have been accused of (rightlfully so) being. So I really don't know what to do. Yesterday she was glowing speaking to the person, which made me sick. I have also realized that my relationship with the kids will not be impacted. From a selfish perspective, I think that filing now may be in my best long term interest but I do not want to end this M. The last time I brough up the first EA (in Dec) we made love that night and she cried. I explained to her that I understood taht part of this was my fault and that I was trying to understand. The next day I blew up and she contact and Attny - althought she has not followed thru with anything. Partly because I believe she is concerned about finances. I'm schedule to recieve my year end bonus in a few weeks and this could be the money I use to set myself up. I consider trying to hide it but then again that is the old sneaky me so doing that would send the wrong message. Am I affraid of loosing her - yes. She was the best thing in my life for a very very long time. Early on when the bomb was dropped she talked about wanting to remain friends for the sake of the kids. I'm not sure how that is going to work. Her parent have told her she should get therapy. I have mentioned it but she consider anything that anyone says as controlling and right now she is not going to be controlled by anyone. I think the 1st EA is over since he was in another state. This new one is a little worst since it is local. According to me MC she believe that she is having an identity crisis and subcontionally is not sure if she wants the divorce. The MC that we originally went to (we went to 3 sessions) felt that she would "experiment" and compare the OM to me. Since I believe the OM is married I do think I have a chance slim as it may seem. I have lost 63lb in the process. I can now say I'm a sexy 175
I've tried to GAL but I know that she can see my pain. She has told friends that they will need to be there for me. Once again, she cares but I really think that she is done. In Dec I told her that if thier was any doubt to hold off - she said she felt a sense of peace when she made the decision. My two boys are older (16 & 14) so they are pretty independant. Oh...she also said that she has been feeling the way she is feeling for several years but that she wanted to stand by her man. That is until I did something stupid. As you can image all of the girlfriends did not help. Typical - you go girl - you can do it. At this point I think some of my goals are:
1) Have the affair end by April 2) Have her open up about how she feels by May 3) Have her admit to wanting to hold off the D by Jun
She has a ton of walls around her right now and I cannot seem to get her to let her guard down. Talking to her will not help. I suspect that you are going to tell me to GAL but look forward to any other advice.
Especially about the A.
"The difficulties of Life are intended to make us BETTER,not bitter". "Fear is a prison, where you are the jailer. FREE YOURSELF!" "Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B." - Jack3Beans
).