To summarize current situation. W has initiated in-house seperation, roughly 2 weeks ago, has declared intent to move out and divorce. We have not told the kids (twin boys, 8 years old) yet. She wants to maintain the family unit as much as possible, she has called me her "best friend" and good co-parent, but has lost the husband / wife connection. I have, over the past year or so, ben drawn more and more into the demands of work, and she has felt the loss of attention. W has said that she is at peace with this decision, and the seperation period is for me and the boys; her therapist is encouraging her to do it quickly.
This started two weeks ago.
Wife has responded postively to me doing more things at home. We're having good conversations about general things. She has sought out hugs and other physical contact, but not consistantly. I'm trying to stop seeking out such things myself, but not successfully. Unclear to me how bad this is.
We're sitting and watching TV together, etc. She is spending more time with friends, taking a trip this weekend for example.
I'm making an effort to get home earlier, spend more time and focus with the kids, playing games, etc. I took them to an amusement park yesterday. Last Friday, W joined in on a game of Uno, and we all had a lot of fun.
The other thing I'm trying to keep up is playing music with my friends. W has said that, this is when I seem to be most happy. She has also enjoyed it when I just play for the family, so I think I should do more of this too.
I'm trying to figure out how much attention to give W. If this is the problem, I want to continue with this 180. I'm trying to spend MORE time with her, without following her around this house. But I don't want to push her away either. She is accepting foot massages from me, so I'm doing this sort of things too.
So, my focus right now is correcting the balance in my life, my kids, doing more "acts of service" at home, giving W more attention. I want to continue time with music and friends, without being more absent from the home. She has reacted positively to these things, but is still determined to leave.
My advice is stop the foot massages, instead put more focus on things with the kids that she would be capable of joining in on. Invite her to join but don't be or show that you are upset when she declines. Try to arrange your music to times that won't detract to much time from family time. Sounds as if you have figured out your 180s, keep them up and just present yourself as someone she would want to be with.
I'm trying to reconcile giving her space with giving her attention, which she is somewhat responsive to. But you know, I was rubbing her feet like this regularly before she brought up D.
I've got to stop seeking out physical contact - hugs and such. Let her offer, if she's going to do that (and has a couple of times).
She saw her therapist yesterday (second time). Told me she was going, but when we talked about her day, she described lots of stuff that happened, but not that. I'm afraid to ask what they discussed, afraid it's more of encouraging her to leave quickly.
Stick to one thread at a time. People only have so much time in a day and it is impossible to get to everyone to help. Don't start a new thread until the moderators lock your first thread.
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This started two weeks ago.
I know the pain you are in Bill, but two weeks is not enough time to see any changes yet. This is a sprint, not a marathon. It is time to man-up buddy. I'd loan you a set of brass ones, but they are already on loan. Put on your big-guy panties and board the roller coaster.
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Wife has responded postively to me doing more things at home. We're having good conversations about general things.
She is reacting positively, but at this point she doesn't believe these changes are permanent. Time is the only way to prove they will be. She is also thinking that you could have changed these before and are only doing them because of the bomb.
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She has sought out hugs and other physical contact, but not consistantly. I'm trying to stop seeking out such things myself, but not successfully. Unclear to me how bad this is.
Trust me, its not good. I know its hard to see the distance between you, but asking for affection not offered freely will only remind her of the distance.
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We're sitting and watching TV together, etc. She is spending more time with friends, taking a trip this weekend for example.
I'm making an effort to get home earlier, spend more time and focus with the kids, playing games, etc. I took them to an amusement park yesterday. Last Friday, W joined in on a game of Uno, and we all had a lot of fun.
The other thing I'm trying to keep up is playing music with my friends. W has said that, this is when I seem to be most happy. She has also enjoyed it when I just play for the family, so I think I should do more of this too.
All good, but you have only just begun. Can you really make these things stick? It takes at least 3 weeks to form a new habit and months more for someone else to believe its real.
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I'm trying to figure out how much attention to give W. If this is the problem, I want to continue with this 180. I'm trying to spend MORE time with her, without following her around this house. But I don't want to push her away either. She is accepting foot massages from me, so I'm doing this sort of things too.
Does she want you to spend more time with her or is what you thinks she wants? What has she complained about pre-bomb? You don't want to be a puppy dog (Sorry Puppy) following her, nor do you want to be in her face all the time.
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So, my focus right now is correcting the balance in my life, my kids, doing more "acts of service" at home, giving W more attention. I want to continue time with music and friends, without being more absent from the home. She has reacted positively to these things, but is still determined to leave.
Did you read The Five Love Languages? Are you sure "acts of service" is her love language?
Of course she is still determined to leave. Its only been 2 weeks. This didn't happen over night. She had to have a lot of bad feelings churning up for a while to get to this decision. Re-read the DR book on the WAW syndrome. Read the WA posts. Honestly, the only way to understand anything a WA says or does is to read and educate yourself here and through books.
You have to get beyond your hurt, detach and GAL first and foremost. You can't stop or change her. You can only change you. Changing yourself can have an effect on your R and M, but it will not happen over night, ever.
Me 45, H 46, S 23, M 26, Together 30, Bomb 6-2-08, S 6-19-08; H left 12-29-08. H home 12-09, Still MLC in 2012! Me- I have my big girl panties on. Bring it.
You are getting some excellent advice from shocked and wifey. Listen up.
One of the things that is understandably difficult at first is your reluctance to own up to the fact that your M is dead and isn't ever coming back (dont freak out yet). You have to start preparing yourself for your next R by changing you FOR YOU. You hope that next R is with your W, but it will be different, and MUCH better than what you have had to date.
So, at this point, as hard as it may be, you have to view her as a good friend, not your W. It doesn't mean you don't love her anymore or that you are giving up on the M. But, it does mean that anything she can perceive as pursuit has to stop. It makes you look weak and unattractive.
Get busy with GAL'ing, and this can include things with you and your kids. You will be able to spend time with your kids and your W will see that. A woman loves to see a man playing with her kids, especially when that man is the children's father.
The other thing is patience. You will have to have a lot of patience. Right now, you probably feel like time is your enemy. It isn't. It's definitely on your side. The longer you can live your changes where your W can see them, the better your chances are. But you have to be patient (not one of my strongpoints either).
Don't give up on 180. The changes need to be perminent. Spoke by someone a whole week into this program. I feel powerful even though my hot wife of 20 years says she is not in love with me anymore. That is her issue. I know I can make the future better. I am not sure she knows how. Now I want way more from the relationship.
Bill, Your next step is to find out what she is doing away from you. Is she seeing someone, texting, calling, email. You need to dig in and find what is pulling her away. It is not always OM, but there is usually a good chance of something, EA, PA. Be prepared for what you may find. No one wants to be here, but for where you at, this is a good place to have found. Shock
Wife has responded postively to me doing more things at home. We're having good conversations about general things. She has sought out hugs and other physical contact, but not consistantly. I'm trying to stop seeking out such things myself, but not successfully. Unclear to me how bad this is.
We're sitting and watching TV together, etc.
These all sound like positive reactions to your 180s. It's only been 2 weeks. I think your expectations need to be lowered a little.
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I'm trying to figure out how much attention to give W. If this is the problem, I want to continue with this 180. I'm trying to spend MORE time with her, without following her around this house. But I don't want to push her away either. She is accepting foot massages from me, so I'm doing this sort of things too.
I don't know that you should be giving her lots of attention at this point (avoiding pursuit). But I do agree with your 180 of being there and not at work or focused on work so much. The Uno, fun stuff with your kids. Focusing on getting healthy with your music and exercise is good. I do think this is a marathon, not a sprint, and you're going to have to do this long-term if you want to convince your W of the changes. And I think they're good for you and your family anyway.
Shocked - yeah, I know what she's doing. In general, she has gone out with friends regularly to movies, dinner, etc. She's doing more of that - generally same friends. One of them here is newly seperated as well, and it's a bit of an ordeal.
Her best friend from high-school has recently relocated back to the bay area, and is going through divorce. Plus she's reconnected with other friends from high-school on Facebook recently. Plus her brother is down in the bay area, he's been going through a hard time too, it's a long story. SHe's been driving down there to see these friends and family. She went down there two weekends ago, she staying the night tonight with a friend who is pregnant - apparently her husband travels a lot, and she is lonely. So - yeah I see a bit of a trend here, in that a lot of people she's talking to are having some sort of issues.
She made the comment that, she hopes she can get a good night sleep - she's sleeping on an inflatable bed at home, and apparently it's not very comfortable.
W has said that she hates (and has never liked, before we were married) the prospect of dating, and can't see introducing a stepfather into the situation for the boys. Take that for what you will, but I'm confident that any kind of EA or PA is not part of the scenario.
Hubs, Karen, yeah I agree. Need to keep up with what I'm doing. Seems there was a part of me that thought, OK I'll address the problems and take care of this immediately. I know better.
W has been enthusiastic about talking at times, saying things like "Now that I have your attention...", and as I mentioned sought out / offered contact and affection. I suppose I've got to let her initiate these things and not pursue.
She cooked up a big breakfast this morning - can I say that this was just for the boys, but she made stuff that I specifically like, and served up a plate for me. So even though she's not saying ILY, I'm going to take that as a positive sign. When she left she said "Thanks for letting me go!" Not that I had (or expected) a say, but OK. I suppose it's a break from the kids.
Worked outside today, weeding, washing the house down (darn spiderwebs) and the car. Good to spend time outside doing physical things. Sounds like chores but I enjoy it. Boys are outside playing with a friend. Have friends coming over to play music later. I actually don't feel like it, but I'm going to force myself to have some fun.
Have to fight giving into the depression and anxiety. I felt it looming before this started, from work pressure. This is why GAL is important. I thought about working while W was gone - but I realize this is for ME, not for appearances.
I have a collection of hobbies - for example, I was building guitars for awhile. I have one in progress now, but haven't touched it really since last year. In the past, W has made comments that doing this really seemed to make me happy - she could tell a difference - but at other times she joked that she felt jealous of the guitars, because if the time I spent, so I was doing it less and less. In terms of music, W considers herself non-musical, and she's felt sad that it's something she can't connect with, because it's a big part of what I enjoy. We've done this before at home where I'm playing guitar and she sings, she really enjoys it but she feels embarassed too. I only encourage her.
I'm a big reader too.
So - my point is, my "GAL" elements in the past have been things that have to some degree have seperated us, that I've done alone. I've had less and less time for hobbies this past year, but still have relied on playing my guitar as an escape. I want to avoid the "Oh he's off in his room again" business.
Sorry, this post is getting long.
I thought I'd gotten to a point where I was sharing this a little more. My sister and her son were here this past spring, and my buddy and I gave a little "house concert" - W liked this so much, this is what she asked for for our 10-year anniversery in June - so we had a party where we had a bunch of people over, and my little band played. She invited up friends she had reconnected with from high-school, it was a great time. Up to the point of "the bomb" she was talking about doing it again before the boys went back to school. I kind of thought that my music thing, and her need to develop more friendships, was coming together nicely.
But yeah, in terms of W's life - she's puts energy into her business, which has been frustrating for most of this year - and the kids - which aren't always easy. She's had a hard time in her life maintaining friendships, which has been a source of sadness for her. I thought it was a good thing that she was reconnecting with people. Her experience is, she can relate to these friends better than the people in our community. W is a democrat and an agnostic, we live in probably a more right-wing area. The friends in the bay area are typically more liberal (except for this friend she's seeing today - I wonder how that will go...)
Man, how long have I been typing this thing - I had planned to not sit in front of the computer today.
