Being appreciative is fine but if baffles me why you dont do anything more than just say thanks or ok.
Why are you so resistant to building a life for yourself, obtaining the tools to do so and putting your former M and W behind you for good?
If you are going to take a look at the link then why not commit to actually trying the technique for 24 hours? Why not try and commit to *something* for 24 hours that is just for you and your own self growth and improvement?
I have to say I am really floored you mentioned your anniversary considering the M you had is over.
Yes, the D papers got dismissed but your W is still with other men. So, who cares? A paper is a paper and actions speak way louder than a divorce paper. As long as there is any form of an OM in the picture (be it casual, or a full blown PA/EA) nothing will ever change between the two of you and at this juncture your W is not ready to give up her freedom and any and all OM's. But she is in a good spot because she gets the fun/romance/sex of OM's and she gets the stability of knowing you will wait around and pine for her. Not a bad deal on her end of things, no?
I hope you learn to manage your expectations (in fact, at this point you should have ZERO expectations) and I hope you put your W, her requests and all thoughts of her on the very back burner for a very long time. That is why you cant grow, she is in your way and IMO she doesnt want to be in your way AT ALL but you like her there. Even though its a crappy situation it makes you feel safe. And it shouldnt.
I'm going to throw one last toss of the coin here for me...
Not thinking about your W is hard - I know that...I'll share an IMO with you ..most LBS's think about their WASs as much as you do...and I think that's quite natural...but...
They also recognise the futility of that...they recognise that those thoughts are not productive and they start to get a life and post about other stuff...
The brutal fact is Kev - by consistently refusing to deal with that you are alienating the fantastic people who are in the very very best position to help you...
Soon you will have no-one here and you will be asking "anyone?" to an empty auditorium - they'll all have gone home...
The only thing the folks who have stood by you through this are asking is for you to do something genuine for yourself- which absolutely does not include going to a poker game - which apparently you were not so sh!t hot anyway.
Tell us Kev - just tell us - apart from your W and kids...what floats your boat? What puts wind in your sails?
What DO you do? Apart from being that business thingie at work? And if you don't do anything at the moment - what would you LIKE to do?
Kev - sit back for a moment - project yourself forward - say in 6 months time - tell us what you would like to look back on as an achievement? Apart from - of course - anything to do with your Wife! Give us 3 things - 1 of which can be to do with your kids!
1. -
2. -
3. -
You need goals...if ever a man needed goals you do...
Folks here can and will help...but you need to give more of an indication that you're willing to step up and try than you have...
To date your efforts have been less than half-hearted on that front and I'm sorry to say from my reading weak and whiny - Kev you need to get pro-active.
Proactive is scary to a guy who is not...cos you will start making mistakes - and I understand that...but mistakes show you how not to make mistakes...in the future.
I'm almost afraid of suggesting this; cos I'm referencing your W in this, but from everything that you've posted...a determination on your front to actually do something proactive, that is genuine to you and to stick with it, would be the first for you and best 180 ever seen on these boards.
Kev - at the moment I see you as the Jedi of Procrastination - its the most undesirable quality of man...
Right now...you're paralysed...and you'll atrophy if you're not careful - in fact I think you're close if not touching that quality right now...
That might be where you want to be? To be the victim in this and then blame your W for what's she's done...
Is that it Kev - that you want folks to feel sorry for you? I'm afraid that's not working here...
Is there a weird psychology going on? If you keep posting as you do and then people get frustrated and p!ssed off and leave -does that confirm to you that they don't understand? Don't understand your particular and unique circumstances?
Kev - you have got a goldmine in the responses to your posts...What it needs though is for you to set aside any notion of pride, and belligerence that is borne out of a sense of righteousness and start acting positively / pro-actively.
No offense R@, but Kevin using "the secret" will totally miss the point. Positive imaging, (newly packaged as "THE Secret") is all he does when he is not mired in his fears & Obsessing. Kevin needs to DO the things needed to MAKE his life better. He needs professional help. Imagining his W coming back rather than imagining his life HAPPY BUT WITHOUT HER, only prolongs his misery and failure to make any progress or grow at all.
If he were to imagine a life without her that was also happy, THEN I'd say great. But he won't do that. He chooses to be stuck and has for many months. Says and does the same thing over and over again and daydreams about the past OR about what he thinks the past was and wishing for it to come back will do NOTHING for him or his sitch. Hence his need for much more help than a book, or all of us here on this site, can provide. His search for "The secret" is his main problem b/c he won't work on himself since he keeps looking for shortcuts around real growth. Which also takes time. That's my 2 cents. And it's just mho. j-
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
Any ADDICTION is bad. Whether it's alcohol or your W. You should NEVER totally give yourself over to anything or anyone. Keeping your identity should be your number one priority. Everything else positive in your life starts with that.
The thing is (IMO of course) Kevin never had an identity as an individual man. He based his worth and happiness on his W and kids and prior to marriage he has admitted he was not happy or complete.
It is *very* painful to be left in a marriage. We all know that. But its also a true opportunity to begin to create your own identity as an individual person. And really, if you think about it how many people get this golden opportunit at the age of 34? Not many. And if people are being honest and you ask 100 people if they would like the opportunity to really recreate who they are they would probably jump at the chance. For some reason though Keven is highly resistant to this opportunity.
And yes, it sucks such an opportunity was born of terrific pain but it *is* an opportunity none the less. What Keven chooses to do with that opportunity is up to him. But one thing I can assure you of is if you dont take this opportunity now and jump in with both feet you will regret it for the rest of your life.
You can keep walking down dead end roads or you can turn around and seek out that road with all kinds of twists and turns. And twists and turns are way better than a dead end street.
When you see the C Monday I hope you tell the C how many people urged you to see him/her and why. Don't walk in and say "oh My w left and I'm a little depressed..." b/c that's NOT nearly what is going on here. But you have to lay it ALL out to the c, and tell them that you say you've "never been happy before meeting your w, and cannot be happy without your w", b/c you "don't know how to be happy" (with or without her actually), and when you were married, you drank too much & passed a job to her, she wanted out, you lost your job, moved... and the whole...shebang. Then get to the part where YOU START CHANGING YOUR LIFE NOW.
Otherwise the c will have less than a quarter of the story and you won't get anywhere with them - and you desparately need to get some movement now. Don't hold back. Tell them the real FULL history of this experience and the behaviors and choices made that you say you don't want to repeat. Get goals, and help. This is not a small task. Ask them their speciality or area of expertise. See if they think they can help you and then decide if you will let them, which means DOING YOUR PART...not waiting or doing the "Secret" thing that will win your wife back. This is so much bigger than getting your w back...IF only you could see that.
J-
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
I guess at the moment these are what come to mind.
Goal 1: To have found a happy fulfilling life Goal 2: To be the best father I can be towards my kids Goal 3: To have my career on track
and an added bonus...
Goal 4: To be in good physical shape
I will make sure I tell the counselor everything
I get to spend 3 and a half hours with D11 today. That will be nice.
I had dinner with W and kids last night. I filled up W's tire so she could drive. She had a tire going flat and needs to get the tires replaced.
I helped pay for D11 to go to church camp. I think that is important.
I know I will get the usual 2x4 for this. But it bothers me that each time I am with W she treats me like an aquaintance. We have been together for 12 years and I am treated like an aquaintance. I never get a hug from her or anything when I see her.
It really bothered me last night. I thought a while on it. You all keep asking me why I don't let her go. There are a lot of reasons. But honestly one is I don't believe in remarriage except in the case of a S dying. I made a lifetime vow and committment to her. And I feel like I have to honor that no matter what. I honestly don't feel like I can be with someone else.
W is now asking me if I can help her out with transportation today while she gets her van fixed. I know I should say no. But it is my job to take care of her regardless of circumstances.
Kevin
Me 36, W 37 M: 08/02/97 D13, D9 1st Bomb 02/08 Reconciled 04/08 2nd Bomb: 09/08 W filed for D 02/04/09 Separated 03/09 D dismissed 06/09/09 Still separated...
Goal 1: To have found a happy fulfilling life Goal 2: To be the best father I can be towards my kids Goal 3: To have my career on track
Yes, those are goals but now you need to break them down into smaller goals so you can execute them. We ALL want to have a happy life. As an INDIVIDUAL what does a happy life look like to you? And what are some immediate steps you can take to begin working towards a happy life as an INDIVIDUAL.
Same with goal 2 - everybody wants to be a good parent. What does being a "good parent" look like to you?
Goal 4: To be in good physical shape
This is a good one to start with as you can start today!
I will make sure I tell the counselor everything
Have you made an outline that really dives into all the issues you must begin to discuss with the counselor yet? If not, make that a goal to be complete by the end of the weekend.
I had dinner with W and kids last night. I filled up W's tire so she could drive. She had a tire going flat and needs to get the tires replaced.
It was thoughtful for you to fill the tires. It was what you would do for any friend. However her getting the tires replaces is HER job so dont offer to get it done for her and dont remind her about it. Her car = her responsibility to get it done and pay for it.
I helped pay for D11 to go to church camp. I think that is important.
Yes, sharing expenses for the children is a part of divorce. However, since you make less you should only be expected to contribute what is on par with your income since your W makes more. If your W makes 25% more in salary than you do then she should be contributing 25% more to the childrens expenses until the two of you have a formal agreement in place.
I know I will get the usual 2x4 for this. But it bothers me that each time I am with W she treats me like an aquaintance. We have been together for 12 years and I am treated like an aquaintance. I never get a hug from her or anything when I see her.
Ok, well, you said it bothers you, let yourself feel that then move on. There is nothing wrong with feeling those things but you dont just feel them and move on, you dwell and let it fester. Sure, it hurts to be treated like just an aquaintance by the person that was once your spouse. But right now, other than co-parents that is all the two of you are. You have not yet accepted your M is over, you are not detached and you are still needy. You also have expectations that are not realistic at this time.
What I see as a major problem is you dont know how to live in the moment. You said you above you had a nice dinner with the W and kids. Instead of just enjoying that and taking it for what it was, a pleasant family dinner, you expected and wanted more. You always jump to the negative and IMO that really prevents you from being in a positive moment.
It really bothered me last night. I thought a while on it. You all keep asking me why I don't let her go. There are a lot of reasons. But honestly one is I don't believe in remarriage except in the case of a S dying. I made a lifetime vow and committment to her. And I feel like I have to honor that no matter what. I honestly don't feel like I can be with someone else.
Nobody is asking you to go against your belief system. But it is possible to detach and let go and still stay true to what you believe. If you really want to honor your W the way you say you want to then why do you keep doing things to her you know she does not like (bringing up R talks, being needy and clingy, pointing out the issues with her mom and so on). To me that is not the way to honor her. Right now the way she wants to be honored is with space and as a mother.
I am glad you feel you cant be with somebody else. You cant even be with yourself yet! And it seems to be you just yearn to fill a void of a romantic R. Fall in love with yourself first, heal on your own and dont rely on anybody else to heal you THEN see where you are at as far as dating goes.
W is now asking me if I can help her out with transportation today while she gets her van fixed. I know I should say no. But it is my job to take care of her regardless of circumstances.
No, it is not your job and this is exactly why I say you are her whipping boy. You filled her tires and that was plenty. Again, your W wants the perks of marriage (having a helpful spouse) without the actual M. Why doesnt she ask one of her boyfriends to give her a ride or one of her friends that she is always our partying with? This is what I want you to see, and yes it does hurt, but your W only leans on you when she needs a favor (rides, babysitting, money for the kids and so on).
I have to disagree "regardless of circumstances". As long as other men are in the picture you have to decide if that is a "circumstance" you are willing to accept. And if you do accept it then be prepared to always be taken advantage of by your W. It is one thing to offer a friendly gesture of putting air in the tire but anything more, sorry, those perks are gone when she decided the M was over.
Your only "job" right now is to improve you, get your W out of your head and be a good dad. The sooner you accept that and jump in, the better off you will be.
Nothing really changes with your W becuase you have not at all changed your stance or the dynmaic of anything. Why is that? Why are you so afraid to do that? I would say to your W (RE: wanting a ride to the tire place)... "Gee W, I would love to help you out but I have plans, hopefully it all works out for you." Let her see that you are not "on call" for her when she needs something and let her get a real good taste of what it will be like for Kevin not to be "on call" for errands or assistance as she needs it.
