I was supposed to get divorced tomorrow - part 2

[1853dave]

New signature:

[GoBison]

Dave I am curious about the letter that the DB coach suggested you write. I am thinking about writing a letter to my W and not sure what all should be in it. I have one DB coaching session left and may get some additional information there.

[InPassing]

...so I asked her what made her decide on seeking the D after things had been going so well for those few weeks. She said, "Oh, we don't have time to discuss this now."

I think when women get like this, it actually means, [I dont have a defensible reason, and I know it, so I'm going to make excuses to avoid admitting that].

Note that "no DEFENSIBLE reason", is not the same as "no reason".

INdefensible reasons, are usually all the same reason: "I'm seeing someone else, but I'm not ready to admit it now."
The other one being, "I'm having a midlife crisis, but I cant admit that I'm out of my mind and making no sense, so I'll pretend i'm just 'too busy' to tell you my sane reasons now"

[1853dave]

IP,

I agree with your assessment. She has been doing a lot of avoiding again. We can actually spend some snippets of time together, and I am careful to not bring up any conversation about anything, and things go well. If I do bring something up, I do it via phone (my experience is that things go better that way) but even over the phone she is showing avoidance.

I also agree with the second reason you cite - the midlife crisis version. The entire midlife crisis chapter in DR fits her to a "T".

We had a bad conv on the phone yesterday. I had plans to have the girls yesterday after school. W calls me and tells me she'll pick them up and take them home for a snack, time to do homework, etc. and I could pick them up around 4-4:30. I was good with that, as we often do those times. At 3:25pm she calls me and tells me that D9 is tired, and she's going to keep her home. She was also going to keep D4 home too. What?!? This was my agreed upon time, and she, once again, changes things at the last minute. She then tells me the REAL reason. She says I am putting things into D4's head, telling her I want to move home, and that Mommy is being mean to me. WHAT?!?! I am NOT doing that - in fact, almost every time I take D4 out to play, she tells me out of the blue she wants me to live with them again. I tell her "I know honey..." She then tells me that she thinks Mommy is being me to me. I tell her that Mommy is probably just a little upset, that she's not being mean to me. Poor little D4 is coming up with this all by herself. I tell W this, and she will not believe it. She thinks I am using D4 as a sounding board. This REALLY turns my crank - I would NEVER do that to my little girl. By now I am fuming mad, and for the first time in over a year I actually go off on the W. I am careful in what I say, but I let it rip. By now I am yelling into the phone - a rarity for me. I tell her I am sick and tired of being controlled by her. I am sick and tired of borrowing my own children for just hours a week. I will not tolerate this any more. Things will just go bad from here. I am tired of being put upon for the past year. I told her that I know I am the root of all evil. I know I am totally at fault for everything that is wrong in her life. I know I am the entire reason we've had 10 years of a BAD marriage, but I will NOT continue to be deprived of my children.
She says, "I never said that!" WHAT?!? I yelled back at her - "It is in all of the documentation! You said this continually in counseling! You have told me over and over we have had 10 years of a BAD marriage! I'm tired of this! I'VE DONE NOTHING WRONG!" --- and I hang up the phone.

OK, so I am not real proud of this performance. I am even somewhat embarrased posting this on the forum, but it is what happened. I almost picked up the phone and called my attorney, but I thought the better of it and just cooled off for a bit.

About 25 minutes later, D9 calls me from W's cell phone. I was surprised. She chats with me a bit, tells me she's tired and just wants to stay home. In the mean time I can hardly hear her with all of the background noise. Turns out W took them to Target, to the Starbucks while she gets her car repaired (bad brakes). I thought the plan was to keep them home, since they were "so tired..." Whatever. More smoke and mirrors.
I then talk to D4, and she seems ok. Then I was about to hang up, when D4 tells me 'Mommmy want to talk to you'... So, W gets on the phone and tells me, in a decent tone of voice, that while D9 is tired and still working on homework, that D4 wants to be with me today. I was glad to hear that. We arranged for me to meet them at Target 20 minutes later, which I did.
We spent a nice time together - D4 and I had a great time. I did miss D9, however... Took D4 home at 7pm. W and D9 were just sitting down to dinner - she made my favorite soup, and it smelled so good...but I was not invited, so I had to leave. Before leaving, I motion to the W that I was leaving an envelope on the counter, and I just said, "This is for you, read it if you want to, or not..." - I kissed the girls goodbye, and left.

End of story.

[1853dave]

GoBison,

The letter had nothing negative in it - I used it as a last resort so to speak. No ultimatums, no pleading... Just a note to tell her that I was sorry things ended up where we are today. I never dreamt that this would ever happen to us. We've shared a great 10 years together, and if I could, I'd do it all over again in a heartbeat.
I revisited some of the highlights in the marriage. I recapped our courtship, the birth of our beautiful kids, how we were such a great parenting team. The trips we've taken together, some positive experiences, how I was always proud of her for this and that, and how I really enjoyed having her as my wife and partner.

Also, of how I really enjoyed just spending time together. Perhaps I will miss that the most...and then I told of other things that I will miss, from her smile, her dimple, her pretty eyes and how they seem to light up when she's happy or excited... I will miss her cute chuckle, the touch of her smooth soft skin, the touch of her warm, soft cheek against mine...

Just retyping this almost makes me want to cry.

So, talk to your coach about this. I don't know that just whipping out the letter and sending it out is a good plan - talk to your coach, because I think timing on using this tool is important too.

I don't know if my letter will have any affect. If nothing else, it just tells my W my perspective on the relationship, since she seems unwilling to listen to me in person.

[C-Bart]

Dave,
Your breaking my heart. You need to protect your rights with your children. Talk to your attorney about ensuring you have appropriate visitation. I think you have a case pending. You need to file a PDL motion with a temporary parenting plan immediately. You have got to formalize your custody arrangement with the court. Your getting caught flat footed like most men in these situations. Don't be vindictive but don't stand still. As cold as it may sound this is now a business discussion.

Don't get me wrong. Keep DBing if that's what you want to do but protect yourself at the same time.

[1853dave]

I will likely be meeting with my atty this week in preparation for the mediation on Monday. I will present this to him, of course.

I also have documentation as to what and when, etc... Most of it in my DB Solutions journal.

I will still DB as well as I can, as I said, I am leaving the door open for her, but am going to do what I can to protect myself, as well as financially, for the kids as well.

[C-Bart]

Thanks I feel better. Good luck in mediation. Mine is tomorrow. Should be fun.

[InPassing]

... She says I am putting things into D4's head, telling her I want to move home, and that Mommy is being mean to me. WHAT?!?! I am NOT doing that - in fact, almost every time I take D4 out to play, she tells me out of the blue she wants me to live with them again.

This also seems to be a classic behaviour, of both the cheating spouse, and the MLC spouse. They couldnt possibly blame themselves for the consequences of their own bad choices... so everything becomes their spouse's fault.

There is sometimes a mantra in DB, about admitting faults, and not arguing with your spouse about faults.
For most normally balanced people, having your "opponent" accept blame, has a calming influence. Unfortunately, however, when someone is in the state of mind your wife is in.. accepting fault for everthing, makes things WORSE; it perpetuates her unreality bubble of "it's all dave's fault, I'm RIGHT in separating from him".


It's my personal opinion that when dealing with one of these, it is important to NOT do that so much.
If something really is your fault, then modestly admit it(without grovelling).
However, if something is NOT your fault... or is less than she is making it out to be... I would suggest calmly, gently, but FIRMLY, standing your ground.


News flash: it is not ALL dave's fault. A fair chunk of it, i'm sure but not more than that.
My advice is to admit when you are wrong, but stand up for yourself when you are not.

I think your stand on the phone, was great.
I think that sadly, your letter was not so great. probably bad timing for it. if she even reads it, which is doubtful.

[1853dave]

IP,

I think you're right about the fault part. I never did accept blame for anything I did not do. I had to be gentle blaming her - as that is a real touchy thing for her. Rather than telling her she wasn't communicating her needs to me by bottling them up inside, I was taking the higher road and saying things like "we" need to learn to communicate with each other better.
Pointing out her faults, blaming her for what she's done, etc - flies in the face of "would you rather be right, or married..." I truly believe this is a temprary phase she is in. She has all of the traits of a person in MLC. I don't want to divorce her now, no more than if I found she had cancer. I've been with her for 11 years, and I know her pretty well. Unfortunately, the person she's become is not the same person right now. Standard stuff here.

She has pulled this with her family before, too. When we met, she hadn't spoken to her mom in over 2 years... We start a relationship, she gets happier in life, and starts talking to her mom again. As of last Jan, she stopped speaking to her Mom (again, Mom is to blame for a lot of things, in W's distorted world) but lately started to connect with her in desparation, I believe, so that she could watch D4 when W goes to school.

W has in the past year has accepted some responsibility for things she's done. She knows she's not perfect, and she can even accurately point out things she's done wrong in the relationship. What surprises me is that even though she recognizes some of the mistakes, she doesn't seem willing to correct them. It's kinda of like "Yeah, we should have spent more time together, or focused more on ourselves, but....oh well. Too late. I want to get divorced."

I'm not sure I agree with you on the letter. According to my DB coach, sometimes it has a good affect, other times no affect, but it is a medium in which I can tell W my thoughts, and let her know that it's ok, whatever she does, and that I'll be ok. I'd rather it be one way, not the other, but it is in her hands, yet I am willing to listen if she changes her mind. I could never tell her that in person, since she seems to avoid that uncomfortable talk.

Yeah, I gave her a bug dose of "I'm tired of the way you're controlling me!" over the phone the other day. Things have been quiet since then.

You know, people tend to focus on all of the bad, on the things "she's doing to you!", on the unfairness, on this and that... When she's not Dr. Jekle/Mr. Hyde, she's very sweet, friendly, nice...which is why I fell in love with her in the first place. I still see this in her a lot of times. I can't help but think she'll wake up out of this at some point and wonder what in the heck she was thinking. She even said in counseling that she feels back about breaking up the family. She also admitted that the kids would be thrilled if I moved back home.

But, this is all about her, and her selfish drive right now is overpowering everything. I really wish she'd see a counselor - I think she can benefit from meeting with someone who could help her sort out her issues and feelings.

Well, it's not over until it's over... I'm not holding my breath, but I'm still hopeful.