Holding onto Hope

[In Limbo]

I am new to this site and not sure I'm doing this right, but would really like to get hooked into this support system. My H and I met in high school and have been together ever since. We have not been happy for quite some time. After many months of suspicions, last month I stumbled across emails between him and his OW. I texted her when I found them, so she knows that I have seen the emails. It's an EA and he professed his love for her, but says it's not sexual. Whatever it is, he was more emotionally intimate with her than he's been with me in years and years, maybe ever. And he was doing all of this during the little time he was home, sometimes with me sitting next to him in bed. OW is 12 years younger, married and worked for him. He says he still loves me but wants more, wants a connection we don't have and he doesn't know if he wants to work on our marriage. He says he has not been in contact with her, but has not told her not to contact him and has not told her anything about us. He changed jobs two weeks ago so he doesn't have to see her every day, but he still does things in a group setting where she is there and I'm not invited. We are talking, going to counseling now and our communication is better than it has been in a long time. He says he is confused and doesn't want to hurt me. He says he loves me and misses me, but he's not attracted to me anymore and is emotionally detached from me. He even said maybe we would make better friends than spouses. He has moved out during the week and comes home on weekends. I am committed to working on our marriage and want us to be happy. I don't want to continue living the way we were even before OW. I have ordered the DB and DR books, but have not yet received them. My heart has broken reading all of the stories posted on this site. I am going crazy living in this limbo of will he go or stay and wondering how do I show my commitment and love without sacrificing my own emotional well-being. I am sick of this roller coaster ride of convincing myself I'm ok only to five minutes later feel like I won't make it through the night. I'm trying not to contact him and try to be positive when we talk, but it is so difficult. There's a lot more to this story, but I feel like I've written a book already so I'll stop here. I hope that someone can offer some advice on how to fight for my marriage without pursuing H too much.
Me-39
H-38
S-11, S-7
T-22
M-15
Bomb (EA)-3/11/09

[mnt_dreams]

My heart breaks for you too! But I can tell you that after several weeks of posting here, and reading the books and applying the principles of acting "as if" and getting on my life (without H) I am feeling better. Patience is really the key.

If your books don't show up soon, try the local library. I found DR to be a great reference and have read it once, and starting over again.

Hang in there!

[In Limbo]

Thanks for responding to my post. I am trying really hard to put into practice some of the principles I'm reading about but man is it hard. What makes it the most difficult I think is that he is so unsure about what he wants and the ILYs and miss you's keep me confused too. He's also home on weekends and we still ML, which seems to just confuse things even more. I'm sos hypersensitive to every little thing trying to figure out if it's a good sign or a bad sign or what. How do you get out of that mode?
Over the years I've lost so much of myself that I'm not even sure where to start with GAL. But I'm reaching out to old friends, going out for lunches, looking into classes I could take, losing weight and taking care with my appearance. Good start, I think. If I could just stop the crying bouts. Guess that will just take time. Thanks again for posting. It's good just to know someone is out there that doesn't judge and in some way gets what I'm going through.

[mnt_dreams]

People much smarter than me will reach out to you about what it means when he comes home, still ML, etc. I can relate to the hypersensitivity. Every little thing gets you cause to analyze and try to figure it out.

I think you're on the right track with GAL. Lunching, looking at classes, exercise. But be doing it for YOU. Not for H. Just for you to feel better and reconnect with what you care about. That will help you to stop crying. But hey, I think a good cry once in a while is therapeutic! Just give yourself some time and don't let yourself cry for too long before you go do something else that will bring you a smile.

[pollyanna]

The analysing of every little thing only stops when you have detached. Let go of the rope.

The way to detach is to GAL. That is start doing things and meeting new people. This does not happen over night but it will happen.

You cannot control your spouse, only can control your response. If your happy ML with H still and you feel safe , then thats good for you.

You have to stop focusing on him and everything he says and does. It wont help you one little bit. Stop persuing and by being so in tune with him, he wil sense that you are right where he wants you and that is available , should he have a change of heart. This is persuit.

Time is definitly the key. Crying is normal and a release. Allow yourself that time to grieve. It will be better for you in the long run. holding emotion in will only add to your depression. It would be nice if you could find a litle anger as well. That will propel yu forward. The nger though needs to be approriate.

Dont tolerate his leftovers and crumbs that he throws you. It is not appealing. Try to get back up on your feet and take some control of your life back.

[In Limbo]

Thanks guys. I'm working on GAL and that will come in time. It's the indecision that's the killer because I know that I want us to work on our marriage. I have minimized my contacts, but still don't really understand how I should behave when he contacts me. I've just been trying to be upbeat and if he wants to talk about "us" then I've been being trying to listen a lot and trying to focus more on now than on the past or future. Not sure if that's the right approach or not. I guess I'll understand more once I read the books.

[Thinker]

Hi In Limbo,

I am sorry that you are in the situation you are in, but am glad that you found this place. It has really helped me a lot.

You will hear words and advice over and over again that all amount to the same thing...

1) Detach
2) Focus on yourself

They are both so easy to say, harder to understand, and oh-so-hard to do. Like us all, you'll try, succeed a bit, then fall down, backslide, pick yourself up, and then try again.

Stay in touch. It get's easier.

[Thinker]

I also suggest that you read 'Not Just Friends'.

DB is great for the WAS issues and the distance, but does not address the EA very effectively. "Not Just Friends" addresses the Affair.

It seems from the experience on the boards here that the EA has to stop before the DB efforts can work. I did not really understand from your sitch description whether the EA was still ongoing and whether your H is still in active contact with OW.

[In Limbo]

What a coincidence, I have just finished reading Not Just Friends. It has been VERY helpful. H said he had not been in contact with OW for last two weeks. But he had not told her not to contact him. Yesterday she emailed him and asked him if I had told him that our M could not continue if he was in contact with her. He told her yes and has had no contact since then. The EA was more one-sided with him pursuing her. From reading hte emails, I think she didn't fully realize his feelings. I believe the emails/calls have stopped, but they are still part of a work group that hangs out weekly and he's not willing to stop doing things with the group and also not willing to let me join them. Also not open to being transparent with login ids, etc. I guess one of the things that worries me about DB is that I know he has an emotional void now that OW used to fill. He's turning to me now more than in years and we are having mutually beneficial discussions/sharing sessions. I don't want to be so detached that we lose that because I fill like that's our chance at reconciliation.
I just hopped over and read your sitch. I see so many parallels it's weird. Although, I will say that in our M, I am the one that avoids conflict and over time the more I avoided dealing with things, the more resentment built up for both of us.
It's good to hear from someone who understands the whole EA thing.
It looks like you have a S10months. Is that correct? Could it be possible that W has post-partum? Just a thought.

[sandi2]

Hi Limbo,

I posted to you and another Newcomer on Alexa’s post. Did you see it? I won’t repeat what I said on that post and I’ll try to respond to what you have said here. I do hope you will stick with coming to the board b/c it will help you more than you could realize at this point. It may take a little bit to build up a support system, but you have already had responses, so that is good. While I am thinking about it, let me add that this board is for you. If I were you, I would not leave it on the “history” to be found by your spouse. The reason is that some have had to leave the board when their spouse would discover it b/c it was not understood by the spouse and some of them resented it and it just caused problems. I would not mention it to him b/c this is “your” therapy. The same applies for the books. Do not leave them laying around where he can see them. Do not discuss the books with him b/c these are your secret “tools” to use in busting a possible divorce. Everything in the books are principles for you and not him. It is like a team having a “game plan” and not showing the opposing team what it is. The DB/DR books are not some of those “feel good” or “how to improve your marriage” books………it is how to survive going through what your spouse is doing and how to bust a divorce. So, don’t show him nor tell him about your “tools” or you will defeat your purpose.

Limbo, I will tell you up front that I had an EA with OM via Internet. I told him that I loved him. The truth was, I did not love him. I “wanted” to love him b/c I wanted to feel passion in my life. I wanted to escape the misery in my life and I thought the OM was the answer. He fed my starved ego and I was quickly addicted to the excitement of the EA.

I would not be surprise if your H may be going through something like a MLC, but I don’t know. What I do know by what you have said, is that this OW gave him the feeling of “excitement” and he does not want to let that go. I think he does still love you, but he has had a taste of a secret EA and it is like a drug of choice for the person involved in it. It is good that he changed his job, etc., but if he will not tell this OW that things are over then that means he is still wanting to cling to her and what she does for him emotionally. I do have a question. I did not understand why he sees her in groups where you are not invited……..if he changed jobs. Can you explain that a little better, please? Also, I take it that it was his decision to move out of the home? Why did he choose to do that if he changed jobs and said he had not contacted OW?

Okay, let me see if I can answer some of your questions. This is not a question you made but a comment:

“I am committed to working on our marriage and want us to be happy”.

It is good that you are committed on working b/c it takes commitment in doing DB work. You’ve already heard how it takes time and patient, if you’ve read very many posts. So, you have done the first step and that is to be committed.

Then you said,

“I don't want to continue living the way we were even before OW”.

That is another great attitude b/c you will need to focus on having a new marriage relationship that is different and better than the one you and your H had before OW came along. B/c if it isn’t, then he will find some OW after this one and it will continue to go that way. You see, he is looking for “something” in this EA that he feels is missing from his MR with you.

“I am going crazy living in this limbo of will he go or stay and wondering how do I show my commitment and love without sacrificing my own emotional well-being. I am sick of this roller coaster ride of convincing myself I'm ok only to five minutes later feel like I won't make it through the night. I'm trying not to contact him and try to be positive when we talk, but it is so difficult.”

He will act as if he is riding an emotional roller coaster! The point is for you not to climb on that roller coaster with him. If you do, then you will continue to feel like you are losing your mind, so refuse to ride it. Next, you DO NOT sacrifice your own emotional well-being. I think you said that you felt like you had lost yourself, so we will talk about that some more, but for now……….you need to have it set in your mind that you will not sacrifice yourself mentally, emotionally, or physically. Have the mind set that you are going to survive regardless of what your H decides to do with his life! In fact, you will need to be somewhat selfish (or at least you will feel that way) in order to protect yourself. As women, we are “givers” to our H and our children and whenever anyone tells us what I’ve just told you, we feel like we are being extremely selfish in doing that. Well, so what? That is what you must do in order not to become a sacrifice.

I understand the rest of that quote about convincing yourself you are okay and then feeling like it all falls through. That is normal. It takes what we call “baby steps” b/c you can’t arrive all at one time. You are doing the right thing by not contacting him. Let him contact you! Unless it is an emergency, don’t contact him first. Limbo, don’t allow your feeling for your H to dictate your actions and behavior. When our emotions are in control……we will mess up most of the time under these conditions, so it is important that your brain is in control and you are using the right thought patterns. Being positive when you talk to him is the way to go! However, try not to bring up anything about the future or your MR b/c that puts pressure on him and it will go sour. That is part of the DB technique. You will “want” to talk about it b/c that is what is on your mind, but it will push him farther away from you. He really does not want to deal with the R now or think of the future b/c he is running from it. He says he is confused. I’m sure he is, so you don’t want to put any pressure on him. It is vitally important that you not pursue him or add pressure to him in any way. I know, you are thinking about the pressure “you” are under. That is why we are here for “you” and not him. We are your support to come here and talk to us and cry and vent your frustrations to. You talk about the R to us and not to him, okay?

One thing I find rather amazing is the fact you are concerned about showing your commitment and love, when it was him that had an EA and it was him that left his family. I say this not to be crude or hurt your feelings………I talk rather plain and I hope you can take that b/c I don’t know of any other way to get down to the nitty-gritty of the stitch. But anyway, I suggest that you not worry about showing your commitment and love. The fact that you are the one that stayed in the home with the children and you have not filed for a divorce is showing your commitment and love. Why do you see it your place to show him this? Don’t you think it should be the other way around? However, don’t expect him to show commitment or maybe even love……..for a long time. It depends on how deep he is into this MLC or whatever he is going through. Some WAS cause their S to feel that they (the spouse) has failed in the M and that was why the H walked away. Don't take the guilt trip. Don't start blaming yourself. You probably made some mistakes, just like all of us do....but it was your H that chose to stray. Can you tell us why he left the house if he was going to break off the EA?

Anyway, you are committed, as we discussed previously……….but you don’t necessarily have to “show” him what I think you are talking about as “commitment & love”. I can’t talk about “everything” in one post, but we will get back to this subject.

“There's a lot more to this story, but I feel like I've written a book already so I'll stop here. I hope that someone can offer some advice on how to fight for my marriage without pursuing H too much.”

As you can see, your posts compared to mine are no book whatsoever……lol. Never worry about that. Plus, the more you can tell us, the better we can help. I do want to help you and show you how you can fight for your M, but if you have read the books from Michelle, you will find out it is probably not in the way you first thought fighting for a M was all about.

“What makes it the most difficult I think is that he is so unsure about what he wants and the ILYs and miss you's keep me confused too. He's also home on weekends and we still ML, which seems to just confuse things even more. I'm so hypersensitive to every little thing trying to figure out if it's a good sign or a bad sign or what. How do you get out of that mode?”

I know it is very hard, Limbo, and to say it is difficult is putting it lightly. Based on this quote from you about what he wants and him not being sure, etc., tells me that you are walking around on egg shells wondering what to expect next. He comes home on the weekends and you ML and it confuses you more. I would like to suggest that you be careful and even use protection if you are going to have sex with him, but that is your personal decision. As one wife said, she didn’t even know how to suggest that to her H. I hope he has not had sex with anyone else, but can you be sure enough to take a chance in getting a STD? The reason it is confusing when you ML is b/c to “you” it is making love with your H and maybe he tells you he loves you, etc. This is harsh to say, but, to him it may just be “sex” and he is getting that physical need fixed. As you know, men and women often look at sex in very different ways. Also, people here on the board have mixed opinions about having sex with your spouse when separated. Some say he is “eating cake” by being separated from you and yet he can come over and have sex to satisfy his physical needs. You may be thinking that you had rather he satisfy his needs with you rather than another woman. Michelle says that some couples find a “healing” in ML. The bottom line is that it is a very personal decision and it is up to you. Just don’t let him “use” you. If you do not feel good about yourself, then draw a boundary line there and tell him that if he can’t live with you as your H, then you can’t have sex with him as his wife.

Being hypersensitive to everything he says and does is also normal, but it is one of the first things to work on where “you” are concerned. Do you know why you are that way? It is b/c you are totally focused on him! You are walking around on egg shells and being totally focused on him. You are lining up your day’s activities based on him. Your entire life is based on what he says and does. Therefore, it will be natural that you live all tensed up and emotional and hypersensitive. That is the next thing to work on for “you”.

“Over the years I've lost so much of myself that I'm not even sure where to start with GAL.”

That is so much like us females, b/c we pour ourselves into our families. But from what you said, you are making a good start in GAL. It is hard to do anything that you don’t think includes him. However, to find yourself again, you must to things for “you” and things that make you feel good about yourself. All of the things you mentioned are great! Also, you need to pamper yourself. We get out of the habit of doing that too, right? Well, you need some changes made (I’d bet) and so I suggest to you what I tell all the women here, and that is to first get a new hair style. Get a different color….or at least some highlights. Tell the beautician you want something that will take ten years off your face. Then get a manicure or pedicure. Next, find a teenage girl and take her with you to pick out some new clothes. If you are on a weight loss program, just get a few until you lose the weight, but you need to update your wardrobe. Know why I said get a teenage girl? B/c they will tell you what looks too old on you. If you have become too comfortable in wearing slouchy clothes around the house or even out in public………please break that habit now. Make it a rule that as soon as you get up and have your coffee, shower, or whatever you do to wake up…….then fix that hair and get your make-up on for the day. Don’t go around the house in your housecoat or a pair of worn out jeans. Look good at all times. You do this for YOURSELF, but you never know when he may drop by unexpectantly……..and if he does, he will see you looking good.
So, your assignment (lol) is to work on feeling good about yourself and building up your self-esteem. Take the focus off of him and OW and put it on you. With two boys, I know your life is busy, but the more things you find outside of the home to keep busy at……..the better. Plus as you will see while we go along with this plan…….it will begin to get his attention when you are not so available for him all the time, due to the fact that you are busy GAL of your own. That makes you more interesting to him. Also, it is a male’s nature to want to pursue what is not so available to him. Do you see what I’m saying? It is opposite from what most everyone thinks they SHOULD be doing to fight for their M, but it works! You must trust the principles and techniques of Dbing. If you work it, you will come through this a better person.

Okay, so now you won’t feel bad about writing long posts…….lol. Limbo, take care of yourself. That is most important. I’ll talk to you later.

Sandi2