Peicing hurts like hell and is harder than...

[cat03]

bump* hope this day finds you in good spirits

[Manwithaheart]

Ok going back to the whole kissing ting...

Was sep 6 months and got involved with another woman (lives accross the street).. lasted 2-3 weeks.. did somethings not proud about. Started to get involved with another woman (sorta) after that and my W decided she wanted to come home. oh boy... I love my W so I choose her.

Was honest about what happend and it has caused some ripples in the peicing situation. SO DON'T DO IT !

learn from my mistakes. Even if she did leave and had a PA with another man, in her eyes your are just a guilty and hurt... funny eh ?

[LoginName]

Thanks for the input.

I think I know what you mean. Of course I'm engaging in a little mind reading here, but I think my W does think that I should be "faithful" and wait. And of course I should be. Until and if I, she, we, decide to Divorce, I need to keep my vows. Hopefully she is keeping hers.

Being honest, I want to tell her about the kisses. I want to see if she is jealous - to see if she cares at all one way or the other. But I won't.

When my W first came back, I read a book that said absolute honest is the best way to proceed. It sounded good (still does, but maybe only in theory). I confessed everything I could think of that I'd done wrong. I don't think it helped. Maybe it didn't hurt. I don't know. I think it's another case of it not being about me - it's all about her, in her mind. She has little or no energy to spare for me and us.

So, Manwithaheart, how did it, is it, going for you? Is or did piecing work?

[LoginName]

thanks for the bump, Cat. It's the nicest virtual physical contact I've had for a while.

I am in good spirits, overall. I also feel like I'm reaching a decision point. I could use your input and advice. But now work is interfering with my life so I'll have to post later.

Thanks again, Cat, take care....

[cat03]

sure toots. There are some who want to know everything (me) and some who rather not know (H) What kind of woman is your W? I thought I was being honest by telling my H all the fears I had and the thoughts I was having about fulfilling my needs, he did not like it one bit. He told me once "I rather not know", I think it was right after he came back, he asked me "have you been with someone?" and right away he said he rather not know because he'd only get angry and nothing good would come out of it.

At the level where you guys are now, I wonder if telling her about the kisses would do more harm than good, I m really not sure.
Take care LN))))

[25yearsmlc]

My two cents,

it would do more harm than good. Period. The only possible good thing to come out of it is the knowing that OP found your spouse attractive. Once that fact is established, nothing else is needed. Details hurt and cause obsession on the spouse's part and sometimes, for nothing. I can tell you that a guy kissed me when H and I were separated. Actually 2. One guy's kiss was NOT invited although I felt sorry for him due to pain in his life and would have "allowed" a hug, if ykwim. Anyhow, his kiss was so wet, slimy and all over the place/face, that I almost laughed. OMG, I MISSED my h MORE then. But why tell my h that?

The other kiss was from a nice guy I really liked, but would never choose over my h or M, and no, we didn't go further and yes, I could have. Too weird to be with a new person after a long M. I would think it'd take a good long time for me. My older sister didn't start dating at all, post D, for over a year. She then dated a guy for a year, before any PA started. BTW, she married him. But she also said at first it was pretty weird. I doubt the PAs these WASs have are ALL totally wonderful. There is value in familiarity.

But unless you fear a STD, who really benefits from knowing? I think the LBSers who want to know, REALLY just want their fears allayed and to gain peace from knowing either nothing happened, or it wasn't good. But if SOMETHING did happen, or it wasn't all bad, how on earth can the betrayed spouse benefit from knowing? It would color the reconciliation efforts too, I fear.

Just my two cents. My h said no PA took place, and I guess since no PA took place on my end, despite opportunity, I'll accept that. And move on. It would hold me back a lot otherwise. Plus, if the WAS returns and is affectionate and intimate, isn't THAT the real answer/solution?
j-

[LoginName]

Time to do a little journaling, thinking, hopefully get some feedback, get some emotion out.

But... just talked to my d11 on the phone. She was really happy and excited. It's hard to think seriously or be sad after talking to her. She got straight As, is on the honor roll, got paid for taking care of the neighbors cat, it goes on - all the good stuff. If nothing else, W is being a pretty good mom, and that counts for a lot.

Last week my son and I went to AR and visited W and d11. It was a good week in that I got to play with d11, and go to her parent teacher conferences. She's doing really well. She's a great kid, maybe that mean W and I are/were doing something right.

But the R talks with w were not fun. Nothing has really changed. She says that when she thinks about loving me again, having me live with her again, she feels like she is going back to being trapped, settling, giving in, (I can't remember the exact word she used, but that's the gist of it). She is enjoying testing her wings (her words), her new job, house, etc. Of course, she wouldn't have that without my help, but still.

It's crazy that she felt so trapped by duty, always responsible, always doing for others, when her actions were consistantly selfish over the years. She was never denied anything. But feelings are stronger than logic. Perception is stronger than reality.

So she hasn't changed, that I can tell. I probably talked too much. I showed my affection, I showed some anger, she talked a little, but never enough. I want to understand her.

One thing she said was that she wanted to be part of my life - when I went out with friends, she was jealous and wanted to be part of it. What??? She hated to leave the house. And, hell, I'd take her out now as much as she wanted.

So are these little statements important? What is important? To me what's important is that she doesn't love me and doesn't know if she will (or really even wants to). How can any of the little things that may have bothered her, or bothered me, from our past matter if the base of love isn't there?

Once a few months ago, she said we were starting over, maybe like dating. If I were dating her, and after a year of dating the relationship had only progressed this far, I'd take the hint and move on. So now I'm thinking about taking the hint.

Maybe she wants to be rid of me, but because of guilt, the kids, whatever, doesn't have the courage to say so. Maybe she's hoping I'll get tired and file myself - then she can be the good one?

I'm tired. If I detach anymore, would I be able to come back if she changed her mind?

If it wasn't for the kids, I'd be gone.

Now the Denver house, my house, our old house, is finally selling (for a lot less than we'd hoped, but for enough). Now I'll really have to leave the house. My son doesn't like it. We like this house, this neighborhood. He is feeling a little stressed thinking about the work invovled in moving while going to school trying to get As. I'm stressed because I don't want the work either, I'm comfortable here, and I feel it's unfair that I should have to move into an apartment while she lives in a new house.

If I it to do over again, I would have pushed W to take the job in AR, move into an appartment and really test her wings; leaving both kids with me. She is the one that doesn't know if she wants in the M, she should face all the consequences.

I'm being a little unfair. My W is not a lunatic, like some spouses I've read about on these boards. She is a good friend and a good parent. I wish her well.

but "let me go why don't you babe, set me free why don't you babe"

I guess that's the gist of my thinking now. I don't know how to proceed or what I really want. I think good DBing would be to keep being nice, friendly, playful, patient, giving her space. I want to tell her everything I'm thinking, talk to her, reason with her, share my feelings, but I think that would push her away. I want to push her away, I want to move on with my live and stop the constant rejection and wondering.

Selling the house: now I have to determine where son and I will live. If I am planning on moving to AR in a year or two, I should probably just rent. If I am not welcome in AR, I should buy, and build equity, tax breaks, etc. I don't know. Selling the house is a symbol, moving out will really be a symbol.

I'm tempted to do more LRT. It would be easy for me except I wan to talk to my daughter daily, and it's hard not to be rude and talk to W sometimes too.

I can tell, now especially that I've been writing, that I will wait some more - be patient. I've got very little to lose, and a lot to gain (maybe... what will I gain? My M was pretty loveless those last few years, just good friends and roommates. Would it be any different? The C thinks it would be and that the potential for real intimacy and happiness is there. Well, he's the expert.)

so, good night.

[LoginName]

Whew, I got long winded just then.

25yr, thanks for dropping in. I try to keep up with you. You're in AK now, have a job, D is doing well but recently thinks she would be happier back in CA - did I get it right? You're still peicing I assume, and I assume you're making progress too. Good luck, fill me in, point me to your thread/posts. Say hi occasionally.

The kiss. Yes, I agree with you. No need to say anything. No need to do it again either.

In your last paragraph, you said "if the WAS returns and is affectionate and intimate, isn't THAT the real answer/solution?" and of course that's my problem, she isn't affectionate and intimate. Is your H?

My W said this last week while we were in her house something to the affect that she was wrong to leave. It was said matter of factly, without much emotion, and in context, I could kind of here a 'but...' in it. So I know/think you had trouble with the issue of your H not getting how he hurt you, what he did wrong. I think he apologized, some, maybe. My guess is this is the best apology I'll ever get and I should be happy with it. If she were "with me" and affectionate, I could easily, I think, accept that. Right now though, it feels like too little.

By the way, how much does an uncontested divorce usually cost? I'm kind of broke these days, but just curious. I want to know my options.

Is there really value in familiarity? Hmmmm. I don't think it would take me long to start dating, but not having dated much at all (having married my H.S. sweetheart) I guess I don't really know. My friends tell me it would be unfair to me and to the woman for me to date too soon after breaking up. I'm sure they are right, but....

and so it goes...

[cat03]

She says that when she thinks about loving me again, having me live with her again, she feels like she is going back to being trapped
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they are too afraid to be vulnerable again, too afraid to give, my H is the same, thinks if he gives of himself he'd be giving in. Don't know what it takes for them to feel safe again, it is a hard place to be in, sound like your W might have a bit of the MLC malady.

Sorry about the move LG, I sure hope you find a good place for you and your son, moves are stressful in any situation.

she should face all the consequences.
I'm being a little unfair.
===============
Heck no, she made her bed she should lie on it. I had to stop myself from trying to rescue my H when he was gone from our home, he chose that life then he'd have to deal with the fruits of his actions. I felt bad, but he was an adult, he chose to leave.

Don't know about where you live, but having kids and property might not let u get an uncontested D.

Yea, if ...IF it gets to that point, if I were u, I would stay away from a rebound R, I think 9mths should be the least time to wait.

I think that kind of thinking (D, dating) interfears with our db plans. I too have planned, but find myself thinking too much about it sometimes and I see it could become a barrier to more positive thoughts. Nothing wrong about making plans, just don't focus on them too much.

[NCplayer]

I just think that although she does some talking about thinks and the relationship, all her little actions indicate she wants it over but is afraid to pull the trigger. Often the one who is unhappy just leaves, blames the left behind spouse who is now dumbfounded by this major life-upsetting event. The one who left has what he/she wants...freedom from you. What she/he won't do is finish it off because she doesn't have to, she/he now has it just like they want it no matter how it looks.

The left-behind spouse unfortunately will eventually run out of energy, money, or whatever, see the writing on the wall and call the attorney for the divorce because he/she finally realize that his/her husband/wife is gone and never coming back. Best to stop hoping and do something else. So sad that we weren't given a ten year warning that things were headed down the wrong path, or maybe things were actually very good.....and then a 3rd party entered the scene and all hell broke loose!

Take care.