I’m back, but it appears to be a whole new set of DBers here, so I’ll give you the rundown on my sitch and why I’m back.
Feb’05 my beloved H revealed an affair with a coworker. We’d been married 7 years, together 13 and just had back-to-back babies. After a half-hearted attempt at reconciliation, he was gone by the end of April ’05, at which point I embraced DBing with a passion. Oh, how I 180’d! I stopped being frumpy, reconnected with the friends I’d neglected during our marriage, I went from a sobbing mess in the fetal position to a person who found her happiness within, went through the toughest time of my life with dignity and compassion – you name it, I did it. It’s been a year and a half of intense personal work and pain and joy. I was a stay-at-home mother and a year ago I went back to work and now have a mentor in upper management and my company is sending me back to school part-time to have an even more successful career. My life is busy, happy, full, exhausting and I’m more authentic than I have ever been. I’m honest with my feelings, addressing my anger by setting firm but calm boundaries instead of suppressing it, I laugh a lot. I still have trouble admitting when this life of single working mother of two toddlers, part-time student (that was thrust upon me) overwhelms me, but I’m working on that too. I am a very good example of how DBing can save your life and your sanity when you are in absolute despair. It’s hard to imagine that in March of 2005 I was actually suicidal. That’s unimaginable to me now. I’ve made a few forays into the dating world without much enthusiasm, but am thrilled to discover that men are willing to pursue me. Very encouraging after my “soul mate” told me he just wasn’t attracted to me.
My husband continues his affair. Until last week I knew very little about their relationship, as I abided by the rules religiously and never asked about Her. Never accused, never got emotional. He is a man with a conscience and has been living with his parents since he left so that he can give us all his money. To be very honest, there is a huge measure of relinquishing responsibility in that. He is an extraordinarily passive man who is paralyzed by responsibility and choices. Plus this way he alleviates his guilt. But it has been to our benefit, so this has been our arrangement. He comes over 3-4 times a week to see the kids. I often go out (gave up on acting mysterious after about 10 months – I can’t pull off mysterious) but also am often at home while he’s there. We get along superbly (thank you DB!) and connect easily. In recent months we’ve started to email from work about stuff other than kids. Just chat and interest – I’d describe the tone as playful and mildly flirtatious. Originally I liked doing this because I called it “f-ing with the Other Woman”. I liked feeling like the other woman and that he was investing all this energy into me instead of Her. Of course, last week when he announced that he was introducing the kids to Her, I realized how vulnerable I had allowed myself to become. I was angry, which I expressed, as we had agreed no “introduction of new partners” for a year after he moves into his own place (and our practical separation begins) to allow the kids a chance to adjust to their new circumstances. We are at long last getting things in writing via a mediator, and after an intense (and ultimately loving) conversation about it, we’ll be agreeing to introduction schedule in mediation. Our wonderful mediator has a master’s in child psychology focusing on separation effects on children, in addition to her law degree.
So he is moving out next week, and for the first time in our year and a half separation there will be some separation in our separation. More than anyone I’ve met on this site, we’ve stayed in prolonged limbo. Except for our increasing affection (this very gentle but unexpressive man told me last week that he’s terrified of losing my friendship), nothing has changed between us since the day he left (which we still had a very high level of affection back then). And now we’ll see each other for a brief exchange of kids once a week. And at a WAY overdue schedule, I’m finally going to go dark. I’ve been promising to do that since very early on in my sitch and never found the self-control to cut him off. And circumstances kept us in a tight orbit with one another.
Which is why I’m back. My friends and family don’t like to hear about any lingering feelings I have for him. Even my DB pals (we keep in touch off the board) have heard me say it so many times that “this time I’m really dropping the rope” that I’m sure they’re rolling their eyes. I’m gonna need some support as I adjust to not having him in my life. So here I am! A year ago this board was a compulsion bordering on addiction for me. In many ways it saved my life and in many ways I used it as a means to avoid truly getting a life or moving on. I hope I “use it wisely” again. I’ll be reading up on all of you to see what’s the story on everyone.
Also, I'm going to look and see if any of the old gang is still around... if so "HEY GUYS!!!!!!!!! SHE'S BACK,AND YES SHE STILL DANCES ON HER COFFEE TABLE!"
Oh, and since we opened the door to discussing "her", after 1.5 years, I finally got some answers about their relationship and I no longer have to wonder. I'm so glad that I've never snooped (never seen that cause anything but pain) but at this point, since it's inevitable that she's going to meet my angelbabies (and likely with them part-time) I am glad to have asked. It was a very calm and neutral conversation, so H was comfortable answering. Well,not comfortable, but he certainly didn't feel cornered.
All my 180s, wanted to appear (and eventually became) strong and competent are no competition for her. My positivity is not a draw for him. She is anti-social and has no friends. He has few friends but has a few on his softball team - she has only been twice and had to "be taken home early" because she was so uncomfortable. They are both very close to their families - her family dislikes him (apparently it's mutual) because of what they have done and what he has turned their daughter into. His family (with whom I remain very loving) refused to meet her for the first year, and have had a couple of what he describes as "brief and uncomfortable" encounters with her. They are living a life where they have nothing (neither has hobbies, except for H's softball) and no one in it. When I expressed concern about that H told me that they understood each other and their loneliness, and that's something that I could never understand. That I'm so strong and happy and competent and popular (his words) that I can't understand. He's right - if that's what makes him feel secure, I can't offer it. We had a very underperformer/overperformer dynamic (which we both now acknowledge and fight tooth and nail against sliding back into, although we tend to slip into that regularly and at least can laugh about it)and in their relationship, he's found someone more passive than he is. He is the dominant one, and I can understand the appeal. But I can't be that. So maybe he really does belong with her.
Although everything he complained about (he's voiced very few complaints about our marriage) he has tenfold with her. But I never really "bought" his reasons for unhappiness - it really wasn't denial but it just didn't ring true. And now I see it wasn't true - it was merely justification.
And now he's going to have a very small and lonely life with her. Broke, barren and isolated. I must admit that it bruises my all-too-healthy ego - you left *ME* for *THIS*?
She hates me - and is driven crazy by the fact that he won't talk bad about me. It's "very hard on her" he says. I can't believe that I've been so easy on them both that she has the nerve to cast ME as the villain! But at least it's a source of tension between them.
Welcome back. I remember you and your angelbabies. A lot of the people who were here in Infidelity have either left all together or have moved over to other places. I am in Surviving. A few of the old folks are over there with me.
You sound great! I am glad you have come full circle. If I remember correctly, you and H had a "separation agreement" thing. Did you get a divorce? I'm glad the job has turned out well, too.
I'll check back on you.
Hugs,
Spitfire
Always do right. This will gratify some people, and astonish the rest. Mark Twain
I remember you too! I'll go check you out in Surviving.
The Separaton Agreement! Ah yes - I wrote it back in October. Got up the nerve to give it to him in January. He got up the nerve to make reference to it in March. We finally decided to let a professional help us and went the mediaton route in May. We now have a draft of a separation agreement that should be finalized within the month. As for actual D-I-V-O-R-CE? The word hasnt' been used. I'm hoping we stay legally separated for a time, but he may file for divorce. Once the agreement is signed, the bank will give me solo mortgage and I'll buy him out of the house, and I will own my own home! Imagine - little old me, doing it alone! Canadian laws are really good about protecting the custodial parent so we're getting a lot of money from him (none of it alimony) and he's been good about the split of equity. He'll be pretty broke for a long time. He has to live with her because he can't afford it alone.
So that's where we stand... almost legally separated.
Hey doll... no offense to those here on this board but the REAL party is over at Surviving... those of us still on DB every now and then are posting there... but we do bring our experiences and thoughts to everyone here.
See you there and please bring the wine... we're running low!
I always love reading your sitch – no one knows how to GAL like you do! I suspect you’re right and will probably find my way over to Surviving. At this point I don’t think that Infidelity is really my problem anymore (if we disregard OW, which I tend to do with someone so pathetic)
Ah Burgbud… coming at me with the insightful and incisive questions.
Why now? Why go dark at all? What is the goal?
A whole bunch of goals – pick the one that you find most valid
1. I need to see if this attachment (call it love if you must) that I feel for H is genuine, or if it is a result of habit and action. I’ve been with him since I was 18 and early on in my sitch embraced the “I love this man and am not going to stop trying” philosophy. And we all know that love is an action (we do all know this, right?) and I have been behaving with love towards him since the beginning. What happens to this love if I detach? We’ve been so bonded in recent months (not bonded enough to prevent him from making plans to shack up with OW, however) that it’s very hard for me to know if I want him back, or if I just like messing with his R with OW (payback, Baby), if his attachment to me is real. I need to step back and figure out what my wants/ needs/ feelings are. We’ve been so deeply into each other’s lives in the year and a half we’ve been separated it clouds my ability to see what my true feelings are. 2. 2. Dating. It hasn’t gone terribly well so far. Oddly enough, getting all dolled up with H in the other room, going out and thinking “Now they’re probably watching Franklin. Now they’re having baths” and wishing I was home with my family has not led to smoking sexy dates. And the uncomfortable moment when the date asks where the kids are: “with their dad… um, at my house… uh, yeah, he’s there waiting for me to get home”. Plus, at some point I’m going to need to have overnighters (1.5 years and counting) and I need to be distanced enough that I stop feeling like it’s infidelity on my part! 3. To see if it will work. The competitive side of me wants to see if I can get him back (and then I’ll figure out if I want him or not) I have done so many things to change our dynamic and heal our fractured relationship. And so much of it has worked to heal us, but not to reconcile us. This is the one thing that is fairly universally recommended and the one thing I could never bring myself to do. I want to look back and see if I’ve truly tried everything. If I don’t try this, I’ll never know whether my walking away would cause him to follow. And if I try this and he doesn’t follow, then I’ll know that he really is not the man for me. 4. To help us both to grow. Like I said (and you know oh-so-well), Rob and I have an overperformer/ underperformer dynamic. This absolutely has to change, and the way we work right now we slip back too easily into our old roles. As long as we keep going like we are now, it will always be me overcompensating with giving too much, and him passively (albeit happily) receiving, while resentment festers about how Anna sets the tone in the relationship. Maybe a significant amount of time will break this cycle and change us enough that we don’t default to our old habits so easily. I feel like if there is a reconciliation to be had, it will never work without a true break where we go off, grow as people and come back together to see what there is left. 5. To help him grow. He went from living with his parents, to living with me, back to living with his parents. He’s always been a very easy person to take care of. I’ve facilitated his relationship with the kids, made sure he eats his veggies, even packed for him to move out. His mother does the same type of stuff for him, as does his sister, and almost every woman he encounters. He inspires caretaking. As soon as I stopped “helping” him with the kids, his relationship with them and confidence in his own parenting blossomed. I need to do this in a lot more areas so that with or without reconciliation, I’m no longer a barrier to him being the kind of man I want as a father for my angelbabies.
Now, obviously I’m not going dark on our coparenting relationship. I’ll still keep him involved and informed, but I won’t send him little emails about the adorable things that D4 did, or S2.5 said. I won’t invite him in for a drink when he drops the kids off – I’ll be upbeat and friendly like I always am, but I won’t seek to engage him. I won’t have our marathon “work avoidance” email sessions where it feels like a real flirtation. I won’t call him when I’m struggling with something around the house.
It’s going to be hard for several reasons… one is that I like doing all that stuff. It’s fun and it feels good. The other is that I think it will hurt his feelings, which I hate to do. He’s said that he feels like I should hate him and there are times that he doesn’t want to reach for me when he really wants to because I won’t want to hear from him, and that he doesn’t deserve to be in the same room as me, let alone have me as a friend. So in his inimitable fashion, this leaves me “in charge” of whether or not we have a friendship. If I don’t initiate friendship, he slinks off saying “I knew you hated me” to which I always say “How could I ever hate you? I care so much about you! I’m so sorry I made you feel sad – let me make it up to you by being extra super-nice!” Cue vomiting. But it’s going to be breaking long-held patterns between us and is going to feel extremely unnatural.
Tonight we are dividing up the possessions that we have remaining. I am getting the vast majority of the house contents (not to mention the house) but I keep telling him he does get to take some stuff. Anyone remember the scene in “The Jerk” (Steve Martin) where he is leaving and crying and saying “I don’t need anyone! All I need is this lamp. This lamp… and this table…” That’s H. I have to practically beg him to take stuff – reminding him that the kids will be with him 2 days a week and he needs to have a nice home for them.
And D4 started junior kindergarten today. It wasn’t actually a very big deal, because she’s not going to a new school but entering the kindergarten program at our daycare. And they let her start going on field trips and spending the day with the “kinders” earlier this month. Technically, I didn’t know she’d had her first day of kindergarten until the end of the day when I arrived and they said “Oh, D4 was with the kinders today”. One day I’ll dress her up, put a lunchbox in her hand and take her picture on the sidewalk. Tell her that was her first day of kindergarten. Not today though, because she dressed herself and went off wearing a Supergirl t-shirt and grey cut-off sweatpants. She looks pretty ratty, but she thought it looked lovely.
You brought up so many valid points, thoughts and goals. I really admire your honesty and it brought back up something for me... I wonder at first how badly I did want Wanker (Dave) back in my life or did I just want to prove that I could take him back from OW. It was fun when I felt that he was talking to me behind her back and then when he basically asked me to end it for him. I remember one day laughing "HA HA I had become the OW." But when it just came down to it, I couldn't do it. The words "You were miserable in our relationship" kept echoing in the corner of my mind. He told me that when we met up once to "talk." He was right. So very right... while I did love him, my life was falling down all around me. I was so taken up with taking care of him and being "mother" to his alcoholic lifestyle that I forgot who I was. Sometimes, being honest here, I wonder knowing all that I know now about DB and codependency if I had handled things differently, where would we be.
But I think the greatest release for me was in finding someone. Gave me a much clearer view on what was so wrong in that relationship with Wanker and how I accepted crumbs instead of the full cake!! Now I can have my cake and enjoy it... guilt-free!
LOL... the vision of you bringing a date home... "Oh don't mind the guy on the couch, that's my H, he won't care..." I can just see the date running for his dear life.
The only concern I have is right now your H has the best of both worlds... loving Anna who is there and gives him his Anna fix and then the OW who does whatever the hell it is that she does ;-) Sounds like you are weaning him off gently and considerately... just becareful, you. I think you are very in tune with the reality that if there is a reconciliation to be had you would both still need to be on your own before it could take place. That would truly be the smartest thing.
I really admire your honesty Cool - thank you, that means a lot. I used to be a person who loved to paint everything in its best light (and would secretly throw up after becoming such a doormat). Now I work towards balancing maintaining that positivity, while still being genuine about the uglies that are in everyone's lives and hearts. I've found that being honest about my shortcoming or fears or problems has really improved my relationships with my girlfriends (my family not as much - we're very close but I think they miss Old Anna a bit - she was very sweet and compliant) as now they feel like they can be very open with me too without fear of judgement. I always thought that admitting to unpleasant things would just make life, well, less pleasant. But it's a bit of emotional housecleaning that actually makes my world a much better place.
did I just want to prove that I could take him back from OW Ah yes, an ugly truth that may lurk in the hearts of more DBers than will admit it. I was bound and determined that I was simply a good person who loved unconditionally and was faithful to her vows. But I fantasize a lot more about the moment when he admits he wants me back than fantasizing about what it would be like having him back in my home. For one thing, I'd have to surrender closet space! I'd have ugly "Buffalo Bills" magnets back on my pristine fridge! I'd have to live without WOA! (I shamelessly thrive on flattery - it will get you everywhere, to the delight of several boys in my high school )
It was fun when I felt that he was talking to me behind her back and then when he basically asked me to end it for him. I remember one day laughing "HA HA I had become the OW."
I believe that is pretty much a direct quote that I've made on several occasions . And I've learned that being the OW really *is* a lot more fun! You get all the good stuff and none of the fights or tensions or BS. But it's no more real between us than it is between them. It's all make-believe.
But I think the greatest release for me was in finding someone.
I wonder about this. It's certainly something that sounds very appealing. And it would really help me move on and leave him behind. I've had a couple of flirtations that were very heady experiences, and did help me move away from him. My problem is that I've never been alone - been with Rob since we were 18, and it was a VERY codependent R. When we weren't at work (or school in the early years), we were rarely in different ROOMS, let alone doing things separately. I know that I'll never have a R like that again, but I still feel like I should be single for quite awhile so that I can really get to know who Anna is when I'm alone before I become coupled again. (unless I'm using that and not wanting to introduce a new person into the angelbabies' lives as an excuse because I'm just a great big chicken - also entirely possible). However, that doesn't preclude dating lots of cute boys! Now I just have to stop freezing the cute boys out!
The only concern I have is right now your H has the best of both worlds... loving Anna who is there and gives him his Anna fix and then the OW who does whatever the hell it is that she does ;-
Big time! But it's more important the effect it has on my psyche and my life rather than going dark to punish him (which my absence from anyone's life is a punishment close to torture! ) or to prove a point. He might be the biggest cake-eater going, but I'm the one who keeps baking those damn cakes! I am insanely curious to know whether he misses me once I'm gone, however....
. And I've learned that being the OW really *is* a lot more fun! You get all the good stuff and none of the fights or tensions or BS. But it's no more real between us than it is between them. It's all make-believe.
) or to prove a point. He might be the biggest cake-eater going, but I'm the one who keeps baking those damn cakes! I am insanely curious to know whether he misses me once I'm gone, however....