Learning to Trust Myself VI

[oldtimer]

Really beautiful example of how not being a fixer is best for everyone :-)

[heatherg]

Thanks everyone for your help and your words. I just posted something and deleted it, hopefully before anyone could see what a pity party I'm having today.

I need to get with the program. Which program, I'm not sure.

[koshka]

Heather,

You can have a pity party any time you want. I know I had plenty for myself.

You're in a tough sitch. Maybe you and H are stuck in some power struggle, with bedtime the battlefield. I like the advice you're getting from folks here. If you let H work it out, he'll have to act as a responsible parent all by himself.

I play all kinds of silly games with my kids. When I drop S6 off at school, I get a "high-five" from him. He's started touching my palm with one finger, and I go reeling backwards. (I check for kids behind me before I set up.)

He smiles, but in a year or two it would be way too embarrassing for him, so it will end.

H will work out his R with S5 (and his R with D3) himself. If he wants to "be a kid" forever, eventually S5 won't. No matter what happens, you will always be Mom to your kids.

Remember the piece about how things can feel like they'll always be as they are right now? This might be a good time to imagine how things will be different when you and H communicate more openly and respectfully.

When's the next MC session? H's tonsils are pretty well healed by now, right?

Thanks,

Joe

[heatherg]

I wanted to post this before I forgot where I found it....it was on TomT's thread posted by Bowtech and I want to remember it and comment on it later, as I think this has significant meaning to me and my situation.

"I'm working on my marriage, but it still isn't working."

Question: Michele, after reading your books (Divorce Remedy, Divorce Busting and Getting Through to the Man You Love), I have one question: The underlying assumption of all three books is that you DO love your spouse. I am in a situation in which I don't really love my spouse, and actually often don't like or respect him. Yet he is a good father, and our children are incredibly devoted to our little family. I definitely believe that a divorce would be the best thing for ME (and probably for him), but the worst thing for my children. It's been hard for me to try to divorce bust because I can't seem to get over the hump of feeling I'm knocking myself out to work on something I don't really want, namely, staying married to my husband. Does this mean mine is just one of the marriages that can't be saved? Most of the posts I read on the boards seem to be from people who WANT their spouses. Any comments would be appreciated, and I'm sure would be enlightening to many on the board, because I've heard from many about to be Walkaway Wife's who feel the same way I do -- little, if any, love or respect for our spouses, and little, if any, desire to be married to them. Thank you.
Jenny

ANSWER
Dear Jenny,
You ask an interesting question and I hope my response will be helpful.

First, I want you to know that your assumption that my books presuppose love for one’s spouse is completely incorrect. My books presuppose a commitment to working on one’s marriage. It is absolutely true that when you love your spouse, it makes going through the hard times more palatable and sharing the good times more enjoyable. No question about it. But I don’t assume people reading the books love their spouses.

I know you won’t like what I’m about to say, but I can tell from your post that you have never really committed to working on your marriage. Yes, I know you’ve had a telephone consultation and some counseling. But that doth not commitment make. Too many people say they’re working on their marriages when they drag their bodies to therapy or talk to some sort of expert. That’s not even scratching the surface. Working on your marriage means making the decision to be there in spirit, not necessarily to be head over heels in love when you start, but to invest yourself fully.

Working on your marriage means giving of yourself completely, putting your spouse’s needs before your own- and vise versa. It means quitting the game of keeping score. It means forgiving and letting go. Working on your marriage means focusing on people’s strengths and downplaying their shortcomings. It means not expecting to have all or even the majority of your needs satisfied by one person. It means vowing to have a full and satisfying life of your own so that you don’t blame your spouse unfairly about your unhappiness. It means appreciating the little things and overlooking life’s annoyances. It means recognizing that no one, not even you or me, is perfect.

I’m not sure why I think this, but I have a distinct feeling that you are holding on to resentments from the past. (I don’t even know you but the feeling is there nonetheless). It seems to me, that your current willingness to stay is built on guilt and self-sacrifice rather than any pleasure derived from the gift you would be giving your children and “your little family” aand as a result, yourself. As long as you look at staying through the eyes of resentment, you will not be able to fully immerse yourself in what you need to do to make your family truly work.

Unfortunately, no one, not your parents, friends, family, therapist, clergy or me, can make the decision to have a good, healthy family for you. Only you can make that choice. You have been sitting on the fence- staying but holding back. (Maybe that's why you chose Paradox as your username.) This won’t get you where you need to go. I can promise you that. Make a decision. Own your decision. Stop fooling yourself into thinking you’re working on things when you're not. If you feel you can’t forgive and start fresh, take ownership of that. Go. However, you know my first choice. But in the end, that doesn’t really matter. Yours is the choice that matters. If you choose marriage, the rest is relatively easy. You decide. Love is a decision.
Michele

[grasshopper]

That's funny Heather, I did the same thing. I only posted part of that on my thread but I wanted to make sure I had it to go back to. It's great, isn't it.

GH

[heatherg]

Yeah, I did think it was very thought provoking. I feel like Michele could have been talking about me....I wonder how effective any 'work' it feels like I've been doing can possibly be when I know my whole heart isn't in it. My whole heart has not been in this marriage for quite some time. I go back and forth between being determined to try to being so absolutely floored at the new levels of disrespect in our R that I immediately sway back to being sure that divorce is the only option for us.
Yesterday in particular, I had a very bad day. This morning I was still feeling hopeless, but started to pick myself up some. Then H and I had a discussion turned bad about a family vacation to Orlando in March. I am going there on business and told H I would fly him and the kids out on my dime and we could go to Disney or Sea World or whatever. The first thing H does is make a demand about the type of airplane....it has to have three seats on one side and two seats on the other so that he and the kids can all sit next to one another. That is important b/c they have never flown before, but I guess I was just a little surprised by his "call and make sure the flight you're looking at on the internet is on a plane with that seat configuration". Um, ok. So I did. And it does. So I called him back and told him that and then he gets an attitude with me because he said he wanted to work Wednesday, so he'd need an afternoon flight. Well, the flight was $79 at 11am. After that, it went up to 204. So, the flight I called the airline about to find out about the airplane was the $79 one. When he asked what time the flight left and I told him, he got mad because he said "I told you I want to work Wed.....once again Heather just does what she wants...". The whole thing went downhill as I sat in amazement that he was being so nasty about it. It wasn't like I booked the flight, I just had to pick one to call on, so I picked the cheapest one. It was just stupid and I was fuming at the way he was speaking to me. Slowly and condescending like I was a child..."I TOLD you I w-a-n-t-e-d an e-v-e-n-i-n-g flight". He doesn't even have any idea what will be going on at work during that time, I don't have any idea why he can't arrange to take three days off of work. He says he doesn't know who he'll be working for......it's just stupid to me. I mean, come on, you've got to have someone to go to in order to arrange a vacation for crying out loud! How does he do it any other time?! Whatever.

My point is that after that I was back to feeling hopeless. I'm just not that good of an actor. He says and does things that result in me hating him. Like want to punch him hate him. When I feel like that, I can't pretend everything is ok, ya know?

When's the next MC session?

Monday at noon. All should be clear for both of us to attend. There for a while, there was question about whether H would have to go out of town Monday, but he doesn't so he should be able to attend counseling.

H's tonsils are pretty well healed by now, right?

No, not really. He is still taking pain medication and says his throat still hurts pretty bad. I haven't left the kids alone with him all week because he really needs to take it easy still. In fact, I am driving us all to Baltimore tomorrow for his niece's 2nd birthday.....I want to go and be with H and his family like I want a hole in my head, but I feel like I need to go mostly because H can't really drive himself. Boy, can't wait.
It's weird too because I find myself wanting to be around H's family less and less. I don't really understand why because I used to like being with them more than I liked being around H! Not the case anymore. Now I don't like being around any of them

Thanks for listening. Hope everyone has a great weekend.

[SweetRedd]

Heather,

I'm just catching up..making my way through your recent posts. I just want to say, and I know it doesn't "help" the sitch, that I understand your frustration and anger with the bedtime routine. I understand you wanting your baby to get to bed at a reasonable time and if your H was thinking about what's best for S5, he'd want him to get the proper amount of rest too. It's easy to point out what you could've done better and given your H leeway on, but it doesnt seem to matter how reasonable and how much rope you give him. He continues to do what he wants regardless of the consequences.. S5 not getting enough sleep, undermining your authority with your children. I dont get it. I dont understand why your H's best "friend" is his son. Parents aren't friends first.. they are parents!! So, I understand GF and I think you handle it much better than a lot of mothers would. Your H is creating a "us against her" sitch in your house and that's just wrong.

Hang in there. Maybe you can bring this issue up at your next C session?

Sheila

[NYsurvivor]

Heather, I'd say that the "booking a flight" episode is another great example of where you could just say to H from it's very inception, "You take care of it", without you being involved an any manner, shape or form, not one iota, making it all his responsibility to handle.

[Jabez]

Hi Heather,

I haven't been able constructively comment on your sitch recently. I truly empathize with your frustration.

I've been reading the book "I Don't Have To Make Everything All Better", it's about validation. Here are three ideas from the book that I'd like to share with you:

If you start to formulate answers while the other person is talking, refocus your mind to listen completely.

Nothing good happens in the heat of the moment.

Boundaries are set by being kind, gentle, respectful & firm.

Take care of yourself.

~J

[koshka]

Heather,

I wonder how effective any 'work' it feels like I've been doing can possibly be when I know my whole heart isn't in it.

That's the "Act As If" part. It's your commitment to do your best for your M that carries you through, as long as it lasts. It's not a warm, fuzzy feeling about the "true love" you enjoy with "your soulmate."

No one can do it perfectly. As long as you keep trying, keep focused on your goals and your own efforts, you can know someday that you did give it your all. Every time you broke out the duct tape, every time you stopped yourself from repeating some pattern that wouldn't work, every time you sought a compromise solution, whether H accepted it or not, whether it worked well when he did or not, you were "putting your heart in it."

This is difficult. All of us felt the difficulties of our own sitches, so we recognize that it's not easy for you, either. Vent away when you need to vent.

I hope your visit to Charm City turned out well.

Thanks,

Joe