Give him the minimal information necessary. Be cordial and kind but don't elaborate on any conversation more than required.
Also, are there any hobbies or interests you have always wanted to pursue? Things you set aside with the business of your married life? Try them out now, even if it's as simple as learning about a new subject or a how to book of something you've wanted to try. Fill your time up with things that bring you joy and you will think less about him and feel better about yourself without consuming your day with thoughts that won't help you. Are there any friends you've lost touch with? Go and have a coffee with them on a nice patio, talk about things completely unrelated to your situation. Ask them questions about how things are with them, it's a great way to learn about people and how we are all different. Think like the french, its a way of life sitting on cafes outside and discussing life and random things, we are inherently social beings and human interaction is built into who we are. Get your mind off of him as much as possible. Once he sees you seem to be getting along nicely without him he will start getting the feeling that you dont need him. In the end you are doing it for yourself.
Yes, the Russian novel continues. Although the kids and I have next to no snippets of what is going on with her. XW is still highly secretive and evasive!
A few days ago, it was XW’s birthday. I’m not sure how old, 53 I think; I’d have to some math to figure out. Let see, born in, it’s 2024, borrow from the hundred’s and thousands place, yep she’s 53.
Anyhow, on her birthday my youngest son called me. You likely recall, that particular son was XW’s least favourite child. As much as MLCers pick a favourite, they pick a least favourite too. Oh, she missed his birthday, Christmas, treated him mean, and on and on. He stood up to her the quickest of all of the four kids and she did not like that one bit.
He called me about the upcoming birthday party for grandma and daughter this weekend. During our call, he said he had new tale of Mom.
D21 called Mom that morning and wished her a happy birthday. During that conversation XW bemoaned to daughter how S23 hasn’t spoken to her since Christmas. And it’s her birthday! (Mother’s Day also passed by without acknowledgement.)
S23 is still not pleased with Mom’s unrepentant making SIL cry with her tirade during her “visit” to S25’s and DIL’s house in early January. He, S25, and DIL, have had little/no contact with XW/Mom.
D21’s call to brother was at 9:00 am that morning, right after speaking with Mom. So, son texted a happy birthday to Mom. XW immediately replied, “I can’t talk right now. I’ll call when I’m free.” She literally 30 second earlier was speaking with his sister, and now she is too busy.
So fast forward to 4:30pm, and 30 minutes before our call. XW calls S24. Took seven and a half hours to free up some time. lol. Here is the complete transcript of that phone conversation:
S24: (Cell phone rings, sees its mom’s number) Hello.
Mom: Hi. How are you.
S24: I’m fine. (He is busily working on his Master degree thesis.) How are you?
Mom: I’m fine too. I’ve got to go. Goodbye. <click>
Hahaha. Son was laughing as he regaled this incredulously conversation. Like WTF. It was eight seconds long! She couldn’t afford to expend that much time at 9 in the morning? It took seven and a half hours to find time? She so missed him, so upset without contact, and then 8 seconds. If bull-riding she’d be a winner.
Like he and I agreed, Mom/XW needed her fix. He called her. She got her fix. She doesn’t actually need - or cares? In my more charitable moments I do hope she cares and is just not able to, or unsure how to, demonstrate it. Like I said, she doesn’t actually need the conversation part, just him calling first. Like a staring contest.
Oh well. Son and I also agree, no big deal. It’s eight seconds of his life. He texted her first. She just had to complete the transaction. Poor gal. Super lost soul she is.
My cousin’s widow has ceased all communication with the family. My aunt is taking her son’s suicide rather hard. Understandable. Her pain and despair is compounded with her DIL ghosting her. DIL also is ghosting her BIL, SIL, and nephew/nieces.
Technically, she is not an in law anymore. She was related by marriage and that marriage ended upon her husband’s (my cousin’s) death. However, that doesn’t fit the why of what’s going on. No one is considering her not family.
My aunt lent pictures of her son to DIL for the funeral, and she cannot get those cherished photos back. Going into four months now and no communication. This is hurting my aunt a lot. Poor woman has lots on her plate.
Taz,loved reading this update. Sounds like your boys have become great men. I don't know what my kids would have done if I was the MLCer, but I must say that the loss of a father figure is an impossible void for my son, and the impact is never-ending. And for my daughter also an endless source of confusion and pain. Glad yours had a clear-headed and loving dad, it obviously made a huge impact.
Oh gosh, I never even answered this, DnJ. HOW RUDE OF ME! I will soon, I did read it back then and then because of the worst baseboard heaters that basically spit out a tiny little breath of heat that dissipated within an instant in what we call cold and what you call balmy, I took the plunge to have the chimney fixed and put in a fireplace insert to get me through the winter without figuring out what really to do with the heating in general. I will have to revisit that issue in August. I'm always hoping I'll be divorced and not have to worry about my expenses being subpoened every ten minutes, but no matter what I do or don't do or try or don't try, I can't seem to get this guy to stop filing, motioning, threatening, etc., even though I was forced to settle the house with an insane overpayment. This is a long story that I will have to fill in later but overall it seems that this guy does not ever want to be done, he wants to keep finding new reasons to drag me back into court, and the current judge is so dreadful he has found an enabler. As ever, I will promise to respond/update and then have no time for another 6 months to actually do it.
Eagle, I rarely come on here anymore and am way overdue for an update. It was so nice to see your name (name-ish) and to read your update. The wonderful man part sounds impossible! and so nice. Happy that you are feeling so good and sending you all my love.
A true test of character is when you are up against it....
And you are up against it now....
And as you might know...
There can be no testimony without a test…
I’ve contemplated this from month one. Imbued in me by my parents…every trial in life is your testament to others. You do not know who is watching or what effect it will have on their lives. People are not truly convinced by your talking or preaching. They watch to see if you LIVE it. Sounds like DB.
A true test.
Come at me sideways
from an unexpected direction.
And in areas I am not skilled
or comfortable.
An “Out of Context Problem”
I didn’t start from zero either. I started in the negative because of my own sad state, depressed and withdrawn, at the beginning. I had to struggle simply to come to the surface before actually beginning.
Testimony. What do I want others see in my actions/reactions? What example to I want to leave for my D19, D17, and S12? How do I show love, empathy, AND disapproval of W’s choices? What will my failures, breakage, and recovery show? Perhaps a Sometimes Phoenix. Fill in the blanks.
Sometimes Phoenix - Kings Kaleidoscope
When I am an old king Will I be alone in my castle cold? ... Just a sometimes phoenix Burning through castles of clouds Just a sometimes phoenix Above or below, I am alone here ... Cold from the crash Grounded but free Embers of birth Rising in me Cold from the crash Humbled and free
Test <current year> "#"var=$((var+1)) (Not actually a programer, but have had to pick up enough along the way. For those not technical, this just means then next increment of the Test)
I notice W’s vehicle is parked out front last night. Kids and I are going about our evening routine. I said nothing and wait. Eventually
D19 says, “I’m going outside dad. I have to talk with momma and have it out with her. Because I’m right and she’s absolutely wrong.” G, “OK D19. What’s going on?” D19, “She’s…. I’ll fill you in later.” She rolls her eyes and goes out the door with a look of distaste on her face. G, “D19, tell me if and when you think it is right to do so.”
D17, S12, and I go through our nighttime routines and get ready for bed. I’m not sure they know she is out there. Maybe. I take the little dogs on a 15 minute night walk, get them food/water and crate. I take out big dog for a short walk just to pee. I had taken him for neutering today. He is soooooo out of it on the sedatives… and funny/not funny keeps running into things with his “cone of shame” to keep him from licking the wound. I help D17 with her chicken and take care of W’s rabbit. Lights are almost all out. Then head up to brush my own teeth.
Aside for background: D19 works at a family run (mom and two sons) business that combines a racquet club, restaurant, gym, swimming pool, and during/after school care for kids ~4-13. She teaches swim lessons and does kid care. She loves those kids. "Dad, I'm their parent. They need someone to be. Many are often dropped off for 12+ hours a day." One of those sons oversees swim lessons and the restaurant. He is the OM that W thinks made her promises. So…sort of one of D19’s bosses…. He actually handed D19 a $100 bill a few weeks back after she had dealt with several situations during the day, when no one else was stepping up.
D19 finally comes back in and plops on my bed. “D17, S12, go say goodnight to momma!” She hollers. D19, “Yeah dad, I caught her lying to me today. I called her out on it earlier. Now I told her exactly what I think of this. Someone has to knock some sense into her.” G, “D19, you know I can’t be the one to do so. You tell her what YOU think is right. You know I’m not telling you most of what I know and what is between us because it is not your problem. You are my CHILD. At the same time I try to let you know a little bit because of where you work.”
D19, “I know dad. But I’ll tell YOU. She sent a 40 piece chicken nuggets to the pool deck (where OM is often). Then she came by with a steak and tried to play it off as if it was for me. I DON’T eat steak! She knows that.” G, “That…..doesn’t really surprise me. When I want to know, I can look and see what she is up to. I haven’t it quite a while.” D19, “I told her it puts me in a bad position. It’s not right. I had her agree that she wouldn’t come over to the facility any more unless she was actually directly invited in writing. And that is not happening.” She snorts. (She meant OM directly inviting her over)
D19, ”Dad, what she’s doing will end up with D17 and S12 in counseling.” G, ”D19, does D17 talk to you? “ D19, “Yes, she talks to me. We sometimes discuss things.” G, ”Good. Like I’ve said before, you three should be able to talk to each other and support and depend on each other. I’ll think on stuff like counseling.“
thanks for replies guys, i ramble on a lot here but its a great place to vent and get frustrations out.
I have ceased communicating with her unless its business only and even thats sparse, any attempts to coordinate anything is usually met with no concrete times, dates, etc. So thats clearly not an option. I do not see her, dont talk to her on phone or message, its a waste of energy in my opinion and very unproductive.
Despite all this at least i sense some hope, which is something i havent had in a while, the more it drags on the more the prospect of my new life gives me even a small sense of optimism. I know its no cure or solution to my emotional state, but I am putting myself in the best situation for healing and create a new oppurtunity, and for once in my life I am looking out for my own well being and pursuit of personal happiness, without external input from anyone but the person that stands in the mirror. She is merely an obstacle to me now, but nothing that I cant surmount. I realized a few months back that she has chosen the wrong path and I have to choose my path now and stick to it.
I long ignored my own intuition and perception of her and my life and now its time to let destiny and fate take me to where i belong.
ill leave with this reading from 2 Timothy 3:1-17 But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good, treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power. Avoid such people. ..
Thinking about it a bit more - I have again been down the cheeseless tunnel which is the relationship talk. There is so much blame that is coming my way, and so much regret of her past decisions. The desperation for a different life, with what she has in mind not being workable as a parent.
I am more at ease with where things are going, just daunted by what I will face in the next 2-3 years. And I do want to keep the collateral damage on my kids to a minimum. She has no consideration what her actions are / will do to them…
I realize I’m stronger now. I know now that I need to maintain my life outside of a relationship. I built a good one and I’m not making the mistake again of wrapping my entire life around one person. I have friends now, hobbies, enjoy my own company, I have a life.
I’m grateful for this site for teaching me this. It was awful getting to this point but now I can honestly say it was worth it.
Hey Grok and all. Things have been busy at work so I'm playing catch-up. Grok, your reference to John Gray is spot on here. I agree there may also be some "testing" happening here.
Our new MC is doing a good job of pulling some things out of W that she's been unwilling to let surface or acknowledge. I've been happy with our progress. W told her L to postpone mediation. She is talking more often about continuing to work things out, and doing a better job of clearly and directly telling me what she wants or needs. She's also acknowledged that she's not spoken up in the past when she should've.
It is almost like she needed the MC to help show her a way back from filing for D. We aren't out of the woods yet. I continue to practice DBing, GALing, and balance the application of Sandi's rules with being responsive to W's positive efforts. It is tough to strike the right balance and, more days than not, I feel good about my words and actions under the circumstances.
Anyway, I hope that is helpful for others out there to hear. Keep working, applying the lessons and experiences in our community, and asking for help. Positive outcomes will happen.
MA, I spent some time reading up on your story today and am astonished on so many levels. My initial BD was around the time of yours - Feb 2023. But, I had no idea that this was a MLC until Feb 2024. I did many things wrong in that year and suffered many tears of confusion, anger, disbelief, etc. As I read through your year, it is so very different from mine. The only window of crazy monstering was from Aug to Oct. There were tough arguments, sadness and discontentment before Aug and then after Oct but not red flag monstering - just marriage issues that we work through. For me, the tough thing is that he runs. Abandoned house, kids, me a month after BD2 and quickly bought a house down the road. H calls that house 'home' and it triggers me. I'm working on that.
I am so sorry to hear how much your H monsters and am impressed how you don't get sucked back into his emotions when in the moment. I am weak in comparison to you. And, still question if abandoning H is the right approach. H's family isn't all too engaged or actively concerned.
A comment that caught my eye in your post is, "We met the other week & he was crying saying he feels he has nothing to show for the past 27 years and that he's stepped back in time (he's living in a studio flat, unfurnished, sleeping on a mattress). When we met, his circumstances were similar. I was the wage earner & we lived a good life, nice house, nice holidays etc. I think this was also a trigger for his MLC." Like you, I saved H financially and emotionally some 32 years ago We've lived a co-dependent life but unlike your H, my H contributed to the house and family. H cleaned, picked up, organized, coached, cooked, mowed. He would gaslight and walk away from conflict, but as a whole our co-dependent relationship did run a house and kept the family afloat through busy child rearing days. Interestingly, as I reflect, he didnt do much parenting - that was all on me. My question is: Why do you think that you providing for him triggered the MLC? My H is struggling financially now too, doesn't contribute to 'our' home and has spewed that I make more than he does and he's struggling to pay bills. First, I don't know how to respond to such commentary, but secondly, I'd be interested in learning why you think saving him and financially providing for him could have triggered MLC.
Stay strong - your ability to manage him and your situation is impressive. I don't know that I'd be as strong.
Just to add in I realy have been working on myself and doing a lot for myself and kids. I know it isnt about me and i cant fix him or reason with him. It just gets to be a lot with it all up in my face everyday with him being home know. He has been home for about 7 months now. it is getting better when I can almost line draft out where we were a year or two ago. I just need a reset I guess. I hate when i let myself do something that will not benefit me.
Hey MrP, thanks for checking in. I continue to move forward with my process and have filed D. As many here understand this is a tumultuous time and it's taken a lot of energy and focus to remain emotionally resilient for myself and my kids. Being sober has helped enormously as has prioritizing sleep, fitness, and a healthy diet.
I spend a lot of time with my kids especially on weekends and this weekend will be no different. Love it. They are still unaware of what is happening and it breaks my heart to think of what's ahead so I focus on the present.
Highs and lows. I've strayed at times from behaving in the way I want to but each time I find myself re-centering faster, like a rubber band whose elasticity increases with time. Perhaps this is the long-awaited detachment taking hold.
Summer is around the corner and I couldn't be more excited. A good friend just bought a small boat and we plan to spearfish up and down the coast all summer long. I want to teach the kids to surf this year too, something that I spent years doing and brought me a lot of happiness. Camping trips are booked.
So that's all for now. I still check the boards weekly and appreciate you asking after me. Thanks again to everyone who has weighed in and continues to check in.
